Yes I'm "stoking the fire"

[rod@plasterbrok]

But this is an interesting read and seeing how the MSM will not publish these articles here it is!

http://www.nbr.co.nz/home/column_art...me=NBR+Comment

[Cliff Rogers]

Yup.

[tea lady]

Still getting your science info out of business mags?

[rod@plasterbrok]

Did you read it Tea Lady??

[dazzler]

From Mcshane;

"Monckton and Evans found a large part of this discrepancy is the result of some basic errors in the IPCC's assessment of the Stefan-Boltzmann equation. When they applied their revised factor to the effect of greenhouse gases, the temperature rise was about a third of that predicted by the IPCC."

So there ya go, a rise will happen, but only a third as much.

thanks, now we can all get some peace

[chrisp]

Yes I'm "stoking the fire"

No wonder the earth is getting hotter!

Rod, please put out your fire

[Toymaker Len]

The models will need a lot of work for a long time yet, Owen McShane is merely pitting one small untested development of the theory against another. Meanwhile the fact is that the planet is rapidly (in geological time) getting hotter, icecaps and glaciers are melting at unprecedented rates, the polar bears have lost 90% of their range in less than a century...etc. At the moment our best guess is that human pollution of the atmosphere with Co2 is the main cause and if that is right then we have very little time to make the switch to non-fossil sources of energy. If that is wrong then there is nothing we can logically do and the planet will get hotter or not. Of course fossil fuels will run out during this century anyway and we will still have to go to non-fossil energy. If the theory that global warming is caused by our Co2 is correct and we do nothing then the next few generations will see global disaster. A hard choice I grant you but at the moment we seem to be approaching a consensus that the people of the earth will cut back on burning fossil fuels.

[Gra]

has anyone considered global warming might be caused by the continuous waffling on about global warming?????

[rod@plasterbrok]

Len are you really serious! The polar bears have lost 90% of their range?

I dont think so.

Ice caps Melting?

Nope stike that one out this year too.

Chrisp, just stoking it up for the cold winter ahead!!

[woodbe]

Ice caps Melting?

Nope stike that one out this year too.

You're so right Rod, it just isn't happening:





woodbe

[Toymaker Len]

Yes Rod, it is happening. It is very likely that polar bears will be extinct in the wild this century. In fact a simple linear projection of the loss of sea ice around the arctic where the bears find their food indicates that their range will all but disappear.

[pharmaboy2]

Arctic sea ice has just recently come off an historic low (note winter 2008 has seen an extreme increase in area back to historic averages). This follows an extreme el nino period. Further, people should note that arctic ice levels are not a function of changes in air temperature, but of ocean currentand salinity interplays.

Further, reduction of arctic sea ice, reduces the insulation of the arctic deep water, and hence cools the body of water not warms it - thus you have another negative feedback occurring - just as an aside.

as to polar bears:
http://environment.newscientist.com/...change/dn11656

with lots of links - be careful of extrapolating a prediction of polar bear populations with actual occurrences - predictions based on predictions are inherently dangerous statistically - especially when you are near the top of a sine wave curve (for sea ice mass) - extrapolating in a linear fashion and presenting it as fact is dubious - one of the reasons that the most important words in scientific language are "empirical data" NOT "forward estimates" - one is for science the other is for economists and other social soothsayers.

[dazzler]

Len are you really serious! The polar bears have lost 90% of their range?

I dont think so.

Ice caps Melting?

Nope stike that one out this year too.

Chrisp, just stoking it up for the cold winter ahead!!

North West Passage

[rod@plasterbrok]

The Artic Ice cap comes and goes all the time, as does the North West passage open and close (but not so often open). We have just seen one extreme of ice melt now its comming back with a vengence. Nothing whatsoever un-natural about that.

Anyone who points to these natural events saying "global warming" is kidding themselves. The Ice melt has been proven to have nothing to do with air temperature read pharmaboy above.

You can either keep believing all the propaganda about AGW that the Media promotes or you can dig a little bit deeper for the facts. This stuff about the polar bears dying out is soooo yesterday its a joke that anyone could possibly raise it today as evidence of AGW.

But I guess that is because the facts are not reported in the media! So one should not be to harsh on those that have not heard the facts or seen the empirical evidence that proves the polar bear is in NO DANGER. But those who have and choose not to believe them, well thats another matter. They are just alarmists.

[woodbe]

Rod, did you even look at the graphic?

De Nile ain't just a river in Egypt.

woodbe.