Questions about french polishing [from beginner]

[Pavel]

I started my first french polish try on a piece of pine and results don't look that good. (Before polishing I sanded up to 400, than applied commercial sanding sealer that also fills the grain, than sanded up to 1200, than stained and finally lightly sanded a bit more.) After the first polishing session I got a small area (about 1'') where polish layer seems to be like washed out. I thought that this may be because of problems with grain filling and this would be fixed after the next polishing session but today I continued with polishing and got such washed out arey in another place while the first one was still there. My guess that I may use too much or not enough metho or polish. The problem is being a beginner I can't tell what will happen if wrong amount of ingredients is used. So here is a list of almost all possible combinations. Can somebody who is familiar with french polishing answer these questions?

How do I know if I use:

1. Too much polish

2. Too much metho

3. Too much oil

4. Too much metho and polish

5. Not enough polish

6. Not enough metho

7. Not enough oil

8. Not enough metho and polish

[Different]

No offence and I dont wish to discourage you from trying new things as a learning experiance but I have to ask the questions

1 Why French Polish?

2 Why pine if you are going to go to the trouble then at least use a hardwood of some kind?

3 Why stain? If you want a red finish use Jarrah if you want Purple use Purpleheart if you want stripes use Zebrano if you want honey use Cherry and the list goes on and on and on. Nature provided just about any colour you might want and they dont rub of or go blotchy or need chemicals.

Sorry for being pedantic but was born that way!

Ross

[Pavel]

No offence and I dont wish to discourage you from trying new things as a learning experiance but I have to ask the questions

1 Why French Polish?

Because I like it.

2 Why pine if you are going to go to the trouble then at least use a hardwood of some kind?

Pine is the cheapest timber I could find and since I'm a beginner I expect to ruin the first couple of projects so no point to use expensive wood.

3 Why stain? If you want a red finish use Jarrah if you want Purple use Purpleheart if you want stripes use Zebrano if you want honey use Cherry and the list goes on and on and on. Nature provided just about any colour you might want and they dont rub of or go blotchy or need chemicals.

See my answer to #2. Or is Jarrah or Cherry that are cheaper than pine? Where?

[ubeaut]

Pavel - You said in your previous thread that you had a copy of "A Polishers Handbook".

I'm not trying to be smart, but maybe you should read or reread the sections on French polishing. I do not recall there being any mention of using a commercial sanding sealer to fill the grain or staining over grain filling sanding sealer and definitely no mention of sanding the stain after applying it over a sealer.

Pine is a very close grained timber and shouldn't need to be filled at all, just sanded and stained. The French polishing should quickly fill the grain for you as you go. If you really must try to short circuit the filling in process, then using a grain filler tinted to the colour you require would be a better alternative, although as I already said, I really don't think pine needs to be filled. Another alternative is a full strength brush coat of shellac as the first coal then leave it to dry for at least 24 hrs and sand back to raw timber with a fine grade of abrasive like 600 or 800 grit. This should leave the pores mostly filled and the surface ready to polish.

The simplest and most likely answer to your problem is that you are pulling off some of the stain and thus giving a washed out look to parts of the surface.

Hope this helps.

Cheers - Neil

[Pavel]

Pavel - You said in your previous thread that you had a copy of "A Polishers Handbook".

I'm not trying to be smart, but maybe you should read or reread the sections on French polishing. I do not recall there being any mention of using a commercial sanding sealer to fill the grain or staining over grain filling sanding sealer and definitely no mention of sanding the stain after applying it over a sealer.

Yes I read this part of the book several times. The reason I use sanding sealer before staining is that after several tries I found out that staining over this sanding sealer gives much more uniform colour. I couldn't achive same uniform colours staining just sanded wood.

Pine is a very close grained timber and shouldn't need to be filled at all, just sanded and stained. The French polishing should quickly fill the grain for you as you go. If you really must try to short circuit the filling in process, then using a grain filler tinted to the colour you require would be a better alternative, although as I already said, I really don't think pine needs to be filled. Another alternative is a full strength brush coat of shellac as the first coal then leave it to dry for at least 24 hrs and sand back to raw timber with a fine grade of abrasive like 600 or 800 grit. This should leave the pores mostly filled and the surface ready to polish.

This is a good idea. Thanks.

The simplest and most likely answer to your problem is that you are pulling off some of the stain and thus giving a washed out look to parts of the surface.

In my case thinks statred to come out better. I continued polished and it seems that what I called "washed out" areas now spread over the whole surface leaving uniform nice polish layer (which is abit lighter in colour than when I started but still is very nice). Maybe french polish somehow partially dissolved the stain I used.

Pavel

[ubeaut]

If you are having problems getting an even stain try mixing 1 part shellac with 8 - 10 parts metho and giving the surface a single wash coat of this prior to a fine sand and applying the stain. This should allow for even stain penetration of the timber. Don't use oil stain or spirit stain. Preferably use water based dye or a turpentine based wiping stain, the latter will need to dry at least overnight before applying shellac and still may lighten off ever so slightly.

Cheers - Neil

[la Huerta]

hi Pavel...i did my first attempt of french polishing the other week and it looked beautiful...i totaly suprised myself, so here is what i did , it may be
unorthodox but it worked...I use recycled Oregon , and aim for a mid antique brown colour, use the old timber if you can or at least anything but pine , it is such crap and never looks any good...

first I gave a coat of black Japan , brushed on wiped off, then a day later give it a light rub back with 0000 steal wool,and a wipe coat of French polish (buy stuff made already like from feast Watson, to you learn more) then when that's dry another coat of Japan , but this time thin some out slightly with turps and brush it on evenly (don't wipe off) to get a nice even colour. leave it for a couple of days and then give it a light rub with the 0000 steal wool, and then start French polishing, first I gave a wipe on coat ,as that's drying I prepare a pad with a dash of metho to just dampen the pad and work it in with your hand, dab a bit of the polish on and away you go, round and round, if the pad sticks even slightly add a few drops of metho, and keep going reweting the pad with polish...I ended up with a beautiful shine and a rich traditional antique looking piece of furniture that did not look 'coloured up'...it sounds like a lot of work but once you do it a few time it's easy...contact me if you have any problems...