The future as i see it (fortune telling if you like)

[doug the slug]

A week or so ago, i received a PM from forum management asking nicely if i would consider changing my avatar. the reason given was that they had received a number of requests from schools to use the forum database for use within schools, and one of the impediments to doing so was concerns about my avatar and its suitability for this new group of forum users.
Well, looking on this request at face value, i thought it was a good idea and widened the public profile of the forum.
well further thought was undertaken and now i think that there are several aspects of the culture of the forum that need to be taken into consideration if it is to be revamped to such an extent. This forum has been so successful because the current membership is basically adult and have established a culture of accepting the mature input of the other forum members who may at times post stuff that is unacceptable to the operators of a school-based forum. the young kids who are currently with us have established themselves in their own right on their own merits.
The reason requests have been made to expand the customer base of the forum is because the forum has been so successful and its success is attributable to the managememnt of Neil. Pauline, and the myriad of moderators and admin. ive seen it before - its been such a success and so now we are getting requests to share our success (but inorder to do so we need to kill off everyone who contributed to our initial success) lets kill off free expression so the school kids parents will let the kids on here.
Sorry, people but tonight was the final straw for me. ive been told that im wrong when ive been right too often and too harshly by too many forum executives to the extent that i dont want to contribute on here any more.
i have learned a lot on this forum but im sure i've contributed more than iv'e gotten out of it and thats great cos i love helping other people. that's the thing ive enjoyed here more than anything else. whats so hard about saying sorry when you are proven wrong?
If i am wrong i just have to take the lumps, if some jumped up junior moderator is wrong they delete or lock the thread - what a nice lovely level playing field.

if this thread is allowed to stay on here for more than five minutes i will be surprised.

[ozwinner]

Doug.
I have banned you seeing as how thats what you wanted.

The ban will stay in place for 7 days.


If you want to rant about the jumped up junior moderators who donate their time so the forum runs better go and start your own forum somewhere.

The thread will stay so people can see it.

Al

[zenwood]

Is there a technological solution to this problem? Perhaps a "Schools" sub-forum, in which avatars are not displayed? And school computers which only allow access to that subforum. I'm sure this could be done.

Other than that, I agree with Doug: increasing censorship to accomodate children would change this very successful forum to something else.

[ubeaut]

Doug - You conveniently left out this bit from my PM: "we have had a good number of complaints from a variety of people"

Most of those complaints have been in disgust of your avatar and personal profile pic.

Quote Doug "asking nicely if i would consider changing my avatar"

Part of PM from me: This is a formal request for you to remove your avatar and your personal profile graphic and replace them with anything you care for so long as it isn't unsavoury, phallic, etc.

You replaced it with an extremely suggestive one avatar (which I removed) and this remark: "Nbody, including you, would expect me to go down without a fight" YES! I expect that you would comply as other who were asked did.

After removing the new one I said you would now have to submit your new avatar for approval before it could go on the forum and you replied: "Now i think you are being unreasonable in treating me like a little kid"Well der.... play like a little kid and you get treated like one.

As I said in a further PM to you after receiving more complaints about your changed avatar:

I don't think I was being unreasonable. Please try to understand that my time is very precious to me and I don't have any extra to go mucking around with things like this, so when I ask for something to be done it would be nice for it to be done without me having to do follow ups and answer a heap of emails and deal with all other rubbish that comes down on my head because of it.

The forums are a much bigger picture than you and most other members see. There are many, many hours of behind the scenes work generated every day by the forums and playing funny buggers with avatars added dramatically to the work load.

In the time you have been on these forums you have created more work for me and other moderators than anyone else. Yes you have contributed well to many posts and that is great. However you have flamed others, complained often about everything from reputation points to moderators and even manipulated rep points for your own gain.

I had asked Al to reduce your life ban to 7 days before reading this thread and now I think it is best that he just terminates you for good as you seem to want.

Neil :mad:
.

This posts needs more but once again I find myself wasting my valuable time. Those who care about these forums will see them grow and not to the detriment of the Ocker spirit but because of it. Maybe now some of those who have left in disgust will return.

[ubeaut]

Zenwood - There is no increase in censorship nor is there an increase planned. We are just asking people to abide by the rules and the rules are and always have been quite clear.

Not everyone wants to see bouncing boobs when they are looking for info on woodwork. Not everyone wants to see people get away with flaming others and constantly breaching a certain standard. Just this last week we had a lady ask to be removed when she asked a pretty straight forward question and received 1 good answer and 5 suggestive ones. Maybe they should have been censored. But they weren't.

Cheers - Neil

[dazzler]

Hey

Well I was also one to be asked to change my lovely lovely avatar.

I was asked politely by the administrators and changed it. As some of the younger ones come on I can see thier point. My 10yo comes online and is getting into turning. I raise my kids pretty liberaly so Dougs or my avatar woulnt be of concern at all, but others raise kids differently and I accept that they may be upset.

I am watching ABC Rage at the moment and there is a lot more suggestive stuff going on.....back in a minute..mmmm christina aguilera:eek:

But I gotta ask, just how do you manage to get into arguements that so bad that people abuse each other. I wind people up all the time and am yet to get slammed.

If u go into the orange room then its like a balmain pub....say ya piece and expect to get a mouthful. Similar to other non wood discussions, people arent going to agree with you and may even suggest your arguement is stoooopid....Get a grip

But I think we need a "gossop" room....like the watercooler at work.....did you here about "doug" and "ele"...your joking...giggle giggle...

Perhaps when the moderators get time they could post some thoughts on the direction of the forum.

cheers


dazzler

[Grunt]

Ah Doug, the new Kenmil

[Gumby]

Perhaps when the moderators get time they could post some thoughts on the direction of the forum.

cheers


dazzler

I don't think they need to. We all know where the boundaries are and I'm sure Neil doesn't want this to go on and on. We've been there, done that.

[dazzler]

I don't think they need to. We all know where the boundaries are and I'm sure Neil doesn't want this to go on and on. We've been there, done that.

Well theres obviously been a change (Our avitars have not been an issue for over a year)...more aligned for schools etc.

Not complaining

Not having a go or causing trouble.

All business have a plan, this forum is part of the business, and it would be interesting to know where it is planning to go in the future.

Which direction will it be moving.

Not complaining, wondering

[Wood Butcher]

Well theres obviously been a change (Our avitars have not been an issue for over a year)...more aligned for schools etc.

Actually the avatars have been an issue for a long time. There were complaints made last year, so it has been a long time coming.

In regards to the other questions I can't help you as I think Neil is the only one who can answer them authoritively(sp?).

[sbranden]

Well theres obviously been a change (Our avitars have not been an issue for over a year)...more aligned for schools etc.

Not complaining

Not having a go or causing trouble.

All business have a plan, this forum is part of the business, and it would be interesting to know where it is planning to go in the future.

Which direction will it be moving.

Not complaining, wondering

There are a couple of interesting points in this post:
1. It reads like you are a little fearful of complaining, and that I believe that is going to be an increasing issue around here. This forum needs moderation, but if it goes to far then we will all either tow the company line or be forced to leave. This is quite a friendly and definately a helpful resource. It would be a shame to see it change to a powerplay.

2. Yes, this forum is a business tool. It is used as traffic generation to ubeaut.com.au, advertising for ubeaut and increasingly revenue via advertising. There are a lot more ads now than when I first came on board, and I imagine they pull in more than a full time wage for the board owners.

Every post by volunteers is leveraged to income to ubeaut. This is fair as they have hosting costs and a business to run, but I would hate to see all the work by members around here manipulated so that the only appropriate use of the forum is helping ubeaut at the expense of members.

There is a fantastic community here. I hope that the admins and membership can work out a way to keep everything going happily while remaining within reasonable boundaries.

shaun

[Sir Stinkalot]

2. Yes, this forum is a business tool. It is used as traffic generation to ubeaut.com.au, advertising for ubeaut and increasingly revenue via advertising. There are a lot more ads now than when I first came on board, and I imagine they pull in more than a full time wage for the board owners.

Every post by volunteers is leveraged to income to ubeaut. This is fair as they have hosting costs and a business to run, but I would hate to see all the work by members around here manipulated so that the only appropriate use of the forum is helping ubeaut at the expense of members.
shaun

I wouldn't think so. I am sure that Neil doesn't want us to go into the finances of the business but I recall that when the google ads were initially put in they generate something stupid like $0.01 for each click, no revenue is generated if they are not clicked.

There are many new post who have no idea about the Ubeaut range, it is actually difficult to get to the sales site of Ubeaut from the forums, perhaps a little too difficult.

In my opinion the time and efforts involved in keeping the forum running free for members would be an expense to Ubeaut, and this is something that some members forget.

[dazzler]

Hi Shaun

I am not complaining at all.

My point is where is the forum going. Which direction is it going to take. This is not to be arguementative but honest input.

There seems to be a lot of people throwing whammies and running off sulking which is very strange indeed. Particularly in the past few months.

I love this forum. Its like a child that grows and moves. What was appropriate six months ago may no longer be appropriate. No worries with that.

I understand that this is now the premier woodworking site in Aus. That is great, but it is evolving and I was wondering where the administrators see the future.

A more informative, more focused on woodwork and its associated offshoots perhaps? With less rogueish behaviour.? Less aussie perhaps?

If it evolves more in this way one would suggest that most of the "non woodwork" forums should be moved over to orange as so many people seem to have a thinner/more pc skin.

So I no complain. Just muse

[fred.n]

Hi All,
Just have to add my 2 cents worth here (sorry )

I to have had PM's from the powers that be, and also had stuff removed.
Some times when we post stuff, the emotions can get a bit hot, and things can be said.......and it's up to the administrators to either let it be or not.
I dont see anything wrong with complying with THEIR rules, if they ask you??
It all boils down to this......if you don't like the channel.....change it
I think this is a great site, and a great deal of FUN is had here by a lot of people...............lets keep it that way

[Cliff Rogers]

...I imagine they pull in more than a full time wage for the board owners....

I bet you couldn't live off it.

Ignore him Neil.