Where is the water cannon?

[Rocker]

It seems pathetic that there are riots three nights running in Sydney, and all the cops can do is stand in line waiting for the Molotov cocktails to be lobbed at them. Don't they have any water cannon in Sydney? And why are only two or three people out of the mob arrested?

Rocker

[graemet]

It IS pathetic, but it's the outcome of a government who want to pander to the snivel libitarians, human rights activists and completely gutless judges and magistrates who don't live in the real world, as well as a community attitude that kids don't need to be accountable for their actions but are entitled to do just as they want while being paid not to work from MY taxes.

Government should repeal all the laws allowing people to blame others for their greed or stupidity, allow the coppers to belt a young hoodlum under the ear or kick his backside 'till his nose bleeds and then have the expectation that his old man will do the same when they sling him in the door of the family home.

Ranting terminated as I might get nasty if I continue.
Graeme

[Pat]

I and many that I have discussed this issue with do agree, that the police are being too tolerant of these hoods, and should be able to use physical means to subdue and terminate the riot. Dan may be able to enlighten us on the reasons why the Police cannot respond with force even when they are taking casulties.

Pat

(Concerned Cit with two mates stationed in the Sydney area, who may get drafted into this bun fight)

[Fat Pat]

Seems to be just a general deterioation in our society. I first noticed it when I found out that parents started demanding that schools and teachers were solely responsible for the education and disciplining of their children. What are the parents supposed to be doing?????

A kick in the **** is most likey a good solution, but as we have seen, some in authority in the past have gone a little too far. You can't regulate this sort of attitude, so they made a law which banned these sorts of activities.

My Brother-in-Law is a copper, and the stories I hear about the dregs of society he has to deal with, they make you hair curl.....and if he uses slighlty too much force when arresting some dill (we're talking a bruised wrist or strained ankle) he has to justify every single action or face the sack!

We get the society we deserve.

[Rusty]

Okay, I'll bite. I don't watch tv or get the paper and my ISP homepage has no mention of riots in Sydney. (they mention Togo, though). So what's got the concerned citizens um.. concerned?

This isn't some bizarre board timewarp, where this is really about Redfern ages ago is it? Sometimes this happens to me. No, I won't explain.:confused:

Wondering,
Rus.

[graemet]

It's about three hoods in a stolen car, who crashed it running away from the cops, the driver legged it after killing his two mates and it's all the coppers' fault!

[Bruce Micheal]

Where's the Israeli army when you need them?

[Rusty]

Maybe the Israelis have Rocker's water cannons? Okay, I found a short description of events from the SMH. I think I'll stay out until I have something intelligent to add. (Don't hold your breath).

Let reason prevail, gentlemen. Or let Love rule. Take your pick.

'night.

Rus.

[beejay1]

[QUOTE=graemet]as well as a community attitude that kids don't need to be accountable for their actions but are entitled to do just as they want while being paid not to work.

Unfortunately an all too common problem. It saddens me to see so many kids who have little or no respect for their community and society they live in. The same kids tend to be the ones who perform badly at school,get led into crime easily, have low vocabulary and intelligence,hang about etc etc a very common sight in almost every town and city. Oddly enough ive never witnessed this in the far east in particular japan, korea, and china/hong kong where although there is crime its not usually of this nature.
My own belief is that such kids generally mirror their parents who dont know how or dont wish to introduce proper training and discipline into the responsible task of raising them. This is not helped by the education systems which although excellent do not have any real form of punitive punishment available to them, and of course the police, whose hands are pretty much tied when it comes to dealing with them. The law almost encourages them to behave in any manner they wish and social services seldom report such behaviour but seem to want to blame it on underprivilege and abuse which may of course be the cause in some instances.
It is a very serious issue and one that does not have an easy or straightforward solution but I firmly believe that if any child is taught correctly from a very early age by the parents how to behave, respect others and, recognise right from wrong, then the problem would be significantly reduced. Sadly this would take generations now unless laws are changed. . Maybe conscription would help, either army or civil police?
Sorry to go on but I do feel very strongly about this. If the kids today dont know, then the kids tomorrow certainly wont and thats one hell of a downward spiral to contemplate. Society today certainly seems to promote the "wealth is power" measure of success but as we old farts know, thats not what its about. Lets all pass our wisdom down the line.
beejay1

http://community.webshots.com/user/eunos9

[Toggy]

In times passed; they had wars and these f**kwits were used as cannon fodder.
Sent to the front line and let the enemy use their ammo supplies on the "under achievers". Either that or get over-run themselves.

Harsh; but effective. Those that survived appeared to lift their game a bit as well.

I have to agree about the softc**cks (if they have one) that are in power here now. Why the hell do the decent people in the community have to bear the brunt of these riots. Why can't the battle zones be redirected into their communities and then we would see how long it is before they had a change of mind.


Consider the possum stirred.:mad:


Ken

[dazzler]

Hi all

I have been a copper for seventeen years and the biggest problem (IMO)is occurring at macquarie fields and occurred earlier at redfern is the deployment of the tactical response groups.

I was at the parliament house riots with the unionists, AIDEX riots back in the late 80's that went for 3 days full on and have worked the niteclub beats on and off as well as general duties.

The biggest problem with the deployment of TRG is that it gives a focus for the anger in one point and as they are equipped with shields and protective gear they take a heap of **** from the protagonists. It then becomes a game for them as each tries to get braver and throw the largest brick and do the most damage.

Eventually the coppers start to get hurt and then they charge and lock a few up and things calm down a bit until the egos come back and it starts again.

In effect we are causing the problem by having the TRG there. TRG are great at organised demos as both sides generally have an understanding of the game.

In the macquarie fields problem the TRG needs to be withdrawn to a nearby location and life be given a chance to return to normal. If it doesnt and patrols need to go back then you send in experienced, hard and seasoned coppers to deal with the issue immediately and take the fight up to any that stand up. If they stand up they get knocked down and locked up. trust me we dont need water canon, shields or anything else.....just batons, capsicum spray and braun.

50 or so hard experienced coppers would have this sorted quick smart. One thing that most people dont realise is that most coppers love a blue. Just keep pouring in blue until its stopped.

Believe me that as soon as one copper calls for assistance on the radio every cop in sydney will head that way.

getting hurt is part of the job and the one thing that a good fight does is bring us together and improve moral. There is nothing better as a team than to back each other up and fight till the fights over.

And yes some will get hurt but thats the job.

Here is a qoute that I heard at a riot with a group of professional protesters (lunatic green anti forest anti man anti world)

Protester: "Why dont you police go home, your only here because your being paid"

Copper: " Darling we'd come here and bash you C****s for nothing!"

My 2c worth.

[Toggy]

Hey Dazzler, that bloke should have been decorated for that pearl of wisdom. It would be right up there for quote of the year.

Ken (who won't admit his priors)

[DanP]

I'm with Dazzler for the most part.

I think that they are right to have called in the TRG. But they are not right in making them stand there and take the s.hit that they are. In the street if someone came at you in a way that threatened your life, you are justified in using lethal force. In a demo/crowd control situation, they send you in with basically nothing but a baton. These dogs are using molotov cocktails for christ sakes. They should be met with a strong show of force which makes them question their reason for being there.

Police are well equipped to deal with this sort of rubbish. We have shields, helmets, guns that shoot bean bag pellets, and so on and so on. It's some pathetic officer sitting in his office miles away who makes a decision if they are deployed. His/her main concern is whether or not we might get sued. Which we will whether we use force or not.

I watched on the news tonight, coppers standing there while people walked up to them and threw bricks, cocktails, timber and various other missiles at them from VERY close range. Well within range of OC foam. Did they get sprayed? NO. :mad: Did they have any fear of the consequences of their actions? NO. :mad: Why? BECAUSE THEY KNOW THERE WILL BE NO CONSEQUENCES. :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad:

When someone walks to three of four matres away from a shield wall with a missile in hand he should be sprayed then arrested. FULL STOP. If someone walks to within ten metres of a shield wall with a molotov cocktail in hand, he should be shot with a bean bag, then arrested. FULL STOP. Large congregations of violent people should be disbursed with water cannons if possible, if not then at the least with baton charges.

I have to disagree with dazzler that getting hurt is part of the job. I'm not there to be anyone's target. Some will get hurt, but if a copper gets hurt, the offender should get hurt too. Not just stand there and cop it sweet like these ivory tower officers have us doing now.

I for one am sick to death of seeing my workmates getting a flogging and all they can do is stand there and take it. It should make anyone sick that your police officers are being made to be pathetically soft in the face of true danger so that we don't have to spend a few dollars defending ourselves in court.

I could say a lot more but would have a bit of work to do.

Dan

[vsquizz]

A little bit of Rock'n Roll will sort them out, I blame modern music for the troubles, it corrupts the mind and causes violence. I mean look at all the good wholesome music that was around when I was a young boke, Bob Dylan, Rolling Stones, Neil Young...and the coloured girls sing... I had a real riot at an ACDC concert once


I feel very sorry for the innocent bystanders/property owners that always have to suffer this king of behaviour.

I don't envy those encharged with the responsibility of crowd control in these matters.

Cheers

[rodm]

Dan and Dazzler,
Wouldn't have your job for quids but for what it is worth thanks for doing your job.
It is interesting that your operations people prefer Workers Comp claims than civil action. :confused:
I have two BIL's that have recently retired from long service in the force and both are unhappy about the way Policing has changed over the years.
Close all University Legal studies and perhaps in twenty years we might be able to do something sensible in these situations.
Hang in there as we need you.