Filling a complex surface

[Arron]

Firstly, apologies to anyone who thinks I should be doing a search instead of posting this, but I've read all the prior posts on filling and though they have lots of good advice I just end up confused. Maybe, therefore, I'll ask the question in terms of a specific situation.

I have a timber surface I wish to fill, and then finish with wipe-on poly and then wax. The problem is that the surface is made up of solid timber, veneer of two species (one porous and one non-porous) and decorative veneer banding. The timber and veneer are predominantly red and white, and the banding is made of dyed red, black, white and green timbers. The gaps between the different elements are generally good but not perfect. There are gaps within the banding say 0.25mm maximum. Now what I want to do is find a filler which will give me a level surface. I want something I can just wipe across the top, leave to dry and then sand off. I guess it has to be clear, or nearly so. The main thing is I dont want to loose the impact of the colours with something which muddies them up.

any ideas, anyone ?
cheers
Arron

[Wizened of Oz]

My suggestion would be talc in shellac, dewaxed white shellac for no colour change.
As Neil says in his "Polishers Handbook", it leaves a silky smooth surface after sanding. May need a couple of coats to fill some areas.
Whatever you do test first on a scrap or inconspicuous area to see if it satisfies you. Then you probably don't need my advice on that score.

[Arron]

Interesting idea. Would this mix be clear once it dries, or does it go clear when the poly is applied.

[powderpost]

I do a bit of polychromatic turning, involving numerous coloured timbers. I use a sanding sealer, which is similar to shellac and talc filler. After sealing you can use coloured putty, similar to the old "plastic" wood. There are a number of "puttys" that can be used. Sand back after the "puttys" have set and apply the finish of choice, eg lacquer or polyurethane.
Jim

[Harry72]

Pour on some resin or glass coat.

[Arron]

I do a bit of polychromatic turning, involving numerous coloured timbers. I use a sanding sealer, which is similar to shellac and talc filler. After sealing you can use coloured putty, similar to the old "plastic" wood. There are a number of "puttys" that can be used. Sand back after the "puttys" have set and apply the finish of choice, eg lacquer or polyurethane.
Jim

Jim, what brand sanding sealer do you use ?
Cheers
Arron

[ian]

for a previous task (filling a gum vein) I had success using spirit stain to colour neutral plastic wood -- the solvent based version, NOT the water based one. From the description of your project, you may already know that the stains came in a broard spectrum of colours.
I used a bright white bathroom/wall tile as a mixing surface -- at the time you could buy single white tiles at Bunnings -- and 3M blue painters tape to mask the gap so the filler only went where I wanted it.

for a less drastic fill, a clear finish should do, apply enough clear coats till the surface is completely filled, then sand back to the point that the finish is only in the cracks. A solvent based finish (possibly thinned a little) is possibly better for this application than a water based one. Depending on the finish's build, you may need to sand back after every 1 or 2 coats.

the problem (if it is one) with using talc and shellac is that it is really designed to form the base for a mirror like piano finish. OK if this is the look you're after, possibly overkill if you want to see some grain texture.

[Wizened of Oz]

Interesting idea. Would this mix be clear once it dries, or does it go clear when the poly is applied.

Yes. It very much "disappears" under the finish.
But I've used it as a pore filler. Your description suggests you have some small gaps. I can't say how the mix performs as a gap filler. You'll have to test that.

[Arron]

the problem (if it is one) with using talc and shellac is that it is really designed to form the base for a mirror like piano finish. OK if this is the look you're after, possibly overkill if you want to see some grain texture.

thats something to think about. I like a little bit of grain effect showing. Still worth trying.

cheers
Arron

[AngelaPetruzzi]

I've used the timbermate putties quiet a bit. they are available in various colours. probably the natural colour would be the most suitable for your project. you can even thin it with water and trowel it on or heat it for a few seconds in the microwave to soften it up. once dry you sand as required.

[ubeaut]

Put a thin coat of Dewaxed White Shellac in the project first then you can fill with Timbermate or almost any other filler without the fear of it colouring the rest of the surface. It will also make it easier to sand or wipe off the filler when it is dry.

Timbermate can also be coloured with any water based stain or dye to make it the right colour to match the different timbers. However you should be aware that most fillers are to a certain extent abrasive and if you don't seal a comples piece first you could end up with a not so interesting final finish.

Hope this is of some help.

Neil

PS the Dewaxed White Shellac will not colour the timber any more than wetting it down with water. Dewaxed is better than ordinary white shellac as it is as the name says dewaxed and will allow fillers and other finishes, to stick easier than a waxy shellac.

[Arron]

Ok, so I seal with shellac and then use Timbermate tinted up to match. Now I need to get some neutral Timbermate, then tint it up as I need it. Naturally Ill want to do various reds and browns and sometimes an ebony colour. so what do I use for tinting. Can I use artists acrylics? if I need to purchase some stains or dyes, what do I purchase - something that will give me a good range of colours and wont cost the earth ?

Cheers and thanks for the guidance offered so far
Arron