How best to do this?

[bob w]

Hi all, I am wanting to restore this old chiffoniere. It is reported to be circa 1860 and is cedar. It has a dark finish which has gone patchy over the years and I have been told it is "black japan". I don't want to renovate, just restore leaving any marks and dents as that adds to the patina. How would I best remove any old coating and what would be the best way to refinish? This is definately not my area of expertise. This belonged to my mothers mother so is a labour of love for me.

[bob w]

Just some more pic's of this project

[chowcini]

Perhaps just a light clean with some warm soapy water first of to rid of any grime in the mouldings and crevices ( DONT soak it on just wash on and wipe of with a clean dry rag ) and after that re access the situation and advance from there. The likely scenario on the shaded moulding is probably a build of wax and grime over the years. Dont rush it and take you time, good luck

[auscab]

Hi Bob, great piece,looks like a later colour job on top of an original finish,test with the water and soap, I have had great results by mixing mineral turps 65% linseed oil 20 % metho 15% ,put in a small coke bottle with a hole in the cap size of a match stick, always shake up before every application, test on a piece out of the way with oooo steel wool, the oil and turps lubricates and the metho eats in ,you should only be trying to take off the dark stuff and this process lets you go down slowly ,rub your test spot for ten seconds then buff off with a dry rag,if it were metho only the test spot would be like jam , but with the oil and turps it should buff with a shine, a very thin rubber of shellac with a drop of linseed oil andthen a wax would have it looking good,this is a pro way of giving it a clean up we use in our restoration business at Graeme Brown Antiques and it works ,but can totaly ruin the piece if taken to far,if you go through the original finish under the dark colour job you will be heading into raw timber and the faded light colour will be lost , if you haven't used shelac you could go straight to a wax , if you want to drop in ,I will give you a fifteen minute lesson, bring a door , check my web site www.robertbrown.com.au .it really is a great piece and woth getting it spot on

[RossM]

Depends on what you are after as an end result, but re-polishing an antique can decrease its value, so take care. A piece in good condition, with its original finish is much more valuable than one that has been stripped and re-polished, or badly cleaned up.

The advice about warm mild soapy water & a cloth is good. Use a soft bristle toothbrush for crevices. Start on a really inconspicuous spot & test to ensure you are not going to wreck the existing finish. Wipe off moisture as you go - don't let it sit. If this does not get all the muck off, you can carefully use turpentine to loosen & remove wax buildup on just about any existing finish without damage, but again, start carefully & test. Use an open weave cloth or pieces of hessian.

Polish with a good quality paste wax - check this out as a good example - it is used by the British Museum.

Have fun

[bob w]

Hi all,
Thanks for the advice to date. I will probably start this on the weekend using the water method to start with as a trial. Two further questions, as the moulding on the backboard is only screwed on, should I remove before trying to clean, & should this clean up to match the rest of the timber? I ask this because it looks considerably darker than all the flat surfaces and I thought it might be a different timber.
Cheers
Bob W

[Horsecroft88]

Depends on what you are after as an end result, but re-polishing an antique can decrease its value, so take care. A piece in good condition, with its original finish is much more valuable than one that has been stripped and re-polished, or badly cleaned up.

The advice about warm mild soapy water & a cloth is good. Use a soft bristle toothbrush for crevices. Start on a really inconspicuous spot & test to ensure you are not going to wreck the existing finish. Wipe off moisture as you go - don't let it sit. If this does not get all the muck off, you can carefully use turpentine to loosen & remove wax buildup on just about any existing finish without damage, but again, start carefully & test. Use an open weave cloth or pieces of hessian.

Polish with a good quality paste wax - check this out as a good example - it is used by the British Museum.

Have fun

I am not sure I quite would agree with your comment there re that an antique with its original finish is more valuable than one that has been stripped and re-polished. I have been restoring antiques and antique joinery for the past 20 years and so have a little knowledge of this, including restoring professionally for clients, for myself for onsale and for keeping.

It really depends on what the piece is, and how well it has been restored. Over-restoring for sure will detrimentally affect the value of a piece but a well restored piece, from a piece that was in poor condition actually will do the opposite, that is, increase markedly its value.

In respect of the piece in this instance, I think with very careful attention, it will not only help bring the piece back to life, but as well won't degrade its value. It really comes down to how carefully it can be done so as not to destroy the patina.

Darkened and dirty antiques simply don't sell well, but in addition, given this piece is not for sale, such condition is also not all that inviting to use. And that is the pity for antiques need to be loved and used. They are furniture afterall, just old furniture with history and sentimental value, but mostly made well unlike modern throw away furniture. dave.

[RossM]

OK HC88 - I was probably not clear by what I meant by re-polishing. I don't mean cleaning & renovating the original finish. By re-polishing I meant stripping & re-applying a new finish. Original finish should not include dirt and accumulated gunge. Careful removal decades of built up wax & grime & using wax or oil to bring the piece to life is what I would call renovating as opposed to re-polishing. I think we are in violent agreement !

I also completly agree that the approach depends on the piece to be restored. Sometimes a piece is in such bad condition that stripping & re-finishing is warranted. And it also depends what the owner wants & likes.

Your point about retaining the patina is what I was trying to get at in my original post. It is important (IMHO) to retain the original shellac, varnish or whatever & not damage this in an attempt to make it look brand new. I have seen examples where beautiful pieces have been stripped back to bare timber, sanded, filled, stained & spray finished with shellac. These look brand new & "plastic-like" & I don't think would be as valuable as a sensitive renovation. I have also seen pieces where the cleaning process rubbed through the original shellac & left glaring patches on the timber. These two outcomes is what I was trying to advise against.