Staining Radiata Pine -- What's the secret to success

[Dod]

I have never had a satisfactory result when staining radiata pine. Here are the steps I take:
1. Sand the boards up to 240.
2. Apply a turps based sanding sealer.
3. Sand the sealer away with 240 "no fill" sand paper.
4. Stain the timber with turps based stains. (Feast/Watson and/or Wattyl). Sometimes I keep brushing over and over and over to try and stop the stain lifting.

5. But the result always like it is a piece of "stained" wood. There is brush marks if I use a brush. Or if I rub on with a rag the coverage is never consistent.

What is the secret to successful staining?? Any help, please.
Thank you
Dod

[RETIRED]

Gooday.

Shane will give you a better answer when he gets back on.

The way that I stain pine is to absolutely drown it in stain, let it sit while you have a cuppa and wipe off the excess.

Hope this helps.

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Ian () Robertson
"We do good turns every day"

[ubeaut]

Sanding sealer should never be used before staining unless it is a shellac sanding sealer which is basically super thin french polish. This raises the nap of the grain allowing it to be sanded off cleanly leaving you with a silky smooth base to polish on. It is not a sealer as such just a sealer in name. It will allow the stain to bond with the timber.

Turps based sanding sealer is basically a lazy persons way of filling grain and will not allow the stain to bond with the timber.

As Doorstop said it seals. Once sealed the timber cannot accept the stain, all that can happen is it will sit on the top. It will not adhere correctly unless you use a stain like Black Japan which is more like a paint, in that it has a dryer in it.

The best stain is done directly onto the raw timber either after the timber has been wet down then sanded again when dry or has had a coat of shellac based sanding sealer preferably from U-Beaut and then sanded.

Apply the stain liberally with a brush or rag then even out the whole thing going with the grain using a clean soft rag (preferably something like flanelette sheeting) until the desired efect is achieved. Don't press hard like you are scrubbing a floor but ues light even strokes the idea it to give an even coverage not to try and remove the excess in one hit. You will know when you have got it right. And if you bugger it up put some more on and try again. It can take years to learn the art of good staining, so don't expect to do it right the first time you try, not the second, third or even the fourth. Practice makes perfect..... or better at least.

The stain you use on pine can dictate how the finished piece will look. I like to use Black Japan (BJ) that is weakened a little with turps for a dark walnut colour, BJ that is weakened a lot for teak and other honey colours, BJ with some red universal tint for rosewood and other red colours. You can also mix Wattyl ColourWood stain with it for other colouring effects.

Water dyes can also work well as can chemical dye. Condys crystals on pine will give a brilliant dark walnut colour.

The first thing you need to do is get rid of the sealer. The second is to experiment with a few different stains and application methods. Thirdly, I personally would be sanding to at least 320 or better still 400.

Lastly don't expect stained pine to ever look like anything other than stained pine. It will never be walnut, mahogany, maple or anything other than stained pine pine. It will always look stained and never natural.

For a walnut that looks like real walnut use real walnut for a mahogany that looks like real mahogany use real mahjogany.

Hope this helps a little.

Cheers - Neil

PS you can also spray on a stain or dip it and all sorts of other stuff but master the wipe on stuff first.

[Dod]

This is just a thank you.
I tried the sanding to 400 , then wetting and resanding -- and it worked perfectly.

So thank you for all the advice.

Regards
Dod

[Woodchuck2]

Hi Dod,
After your fine sanding to 400 grit try
applying a coat of Feast Watson china wood
oil. Let it dry then apply your stain with
a cloth. (I use an old T-shirt)
I find it makes the stain go on much easier and more evenly without patchiness.
Cheers,
Woodchuck

------------------
Woodchuck

[JackoH]

Neil is far too modest! He should be recomending that excellent book
"A Polishers Handbook" by one N. Ellis.
If he won't I will! No woodwork shed should be without it.
Regards John H.

[Geoff Allen]

A lady from Malvern Paint & Timber Finish came along to my woodies club and demonstrated how a wipe over pine with a product called FungiShield. The result soon after was that any applied stain went on very evenly. Somehow this stuff reduces the porosity of the softest bits of the pine and the endgrain.
I tried it and found to be both quicker and better!

[Dod]

Thank you everybody for your advice.
I did what Ubeaut suggested AND what a difference. The job came up perfect!!!
Dod

[la Huerta]

Neil...do you brush on the BJ, any favourite brush to help against brush marks, and do you put a second coat on or just thin the BJ as necessary to achive the disired colour in one hit

la H

[ozwinner]

You must have dug deep to get this post.

Al

[la Huerta]

fancy meeting you here all the way down the back end of the universe...

actualy i was reading a recient post and someone had a link and i clicked it and here i am...



internet time travel...

[Rusty]

I need all the help I can get with staining (yes, I have the bible). Dig as deep as it takes, LH!

Regards,
Rusty-resorting to commercial stains-ouch$$!

[ubeaut]

la Huerta - I hate these antique posts........ they make me feel older.

Apply stain any way you like doesn't have to be fancy just get as much on as quickly and evenly as you can, I usually use a rag loaded with the stuff.

One coat is all that is needed, after-all you are trying to stain the timber not paint it. Pretty much all the basic info you need is in the very old post of mine above.

Cheers - Neil

[la Huerta]

thanks Neil...i use BL a lot and am always open to learning something new about it, it has endless possibilities...


la H

[TassieKiwi]

THe whorly grain of pine is your enemy. The gel type stains from Wattyl work well. I have seen the 'new' beed of pine timber in the shops. It is a bit bland, but I'd say that they've applied a sealer and then oversprayed with oil based stain, or maybe tinted poly. Looks OK, but as Neil said - it's sitll pine. I think that a piece done with close grained pine in the right style, warmed with shellac, maybe distressed a bit if your'e into that and waxed looks fine. Why try to make it look like walnut?