Getting a better Energy deal - WHAT A JOKE!

[FenceFurniture]

I have been with AGL for Gas & Elec for some years. After the July 1 price skyrocket I decided to look into things. AGL had been giving me a paltry 6% off Elec and 2% off Gas. We are never late - in fact the account is usually still in credit AFTER the bill has been presented to us, because I pay in advance every fortnight.

I wrote a spreadsheet so that I could compare some different suppliers rates. This is a bit tricky because they all calculate things differently, with different rates and thresholds. Some discount usage AND daily supply and most just discount usage. Then of course the rates all vary with postcodes and so it goes on. It is an absolute minefield, and if you are not bent to be good with detail and numbers then you will undoubtedly be ripped off.

The Energy Companies are playing us for mugs, pure and simple.

I have to say that you REALLY need to be on your game to get the best deal. I am 100% certain that there are many older people being absolutely gouged by these miserable mongrels. It is unconscionable.

To be frank, I believe that the Energy companies have now reached the heady depths of the banks, and may indeed be acting in an even worse manner.

The sequence of events that has unfolded is truly astonishing. So much so that I ended up writing to my two local Members (State & Fed), a Senator, the Prime Minister, and the head of AGL Marketing. Bloody AGL wrote back apologising for "any inconvenience caused". Boy did they get a hot response to that. "Incon-bloody-venience? Is that what you think 30 or more hours of my time wasted is????"

I would estimate that there have been in excess of 40 phone calls, and so far this has taken up around 35-40 hours of my time, over the last 6 weeks. I wish I had kept diary notes from the start, but one does not expect such a fiasco to unfold. Especially when one is reassured every step of the way how EASY this is going to be. John Elliot response to that!

When you decide to leave a retailer, because another offers you a better deal, the victor sends the vanquished a "notice to quit" if you like - you know "nyaa nyaa we have the poor bastard now, so cease and desist". When that happens the Vanquished have a Retention Team that have better discounts than the Sales Team can offer. They have to call you within the 10 day cooling off period for the Victor, and sweet-talk you into staying with these better rates.

In my case, AGL were the Vanquished, and Origin were the Victors. After my initial call to AGL my Gas discount went from 2% to 16%, and then in a subsequent phone call it magically became 20% (without saying anything), and Elec went from 6% to 24%.

Now I happened to know that they can do better than that, through a friend who went through the same process. He said that the Retention team called him and offered him 25% off Gas and 32% off elec.

So I told AGL that I knew they could do better. "Sorry, can't give you that until you actually leave." SO I have to waste Origin's time and effort, oh, and considerable hours of my own.

Well what a sorry bloody chain of events that started. I am now 4 levels of management (AGL) up from the usual call centre. Just cockup after cockup after cockup, and they are still happening. Got the latest call from AGL this arvo, after someone read my email. The upshot of that was that my Gas was still going to Origin, and that I had until close of business today to stop it. Earlier in this call I said "I know this call with you is not the last call I will have to make". She said she thought it actually would be. No more than 5 minutes later she was proved wrong (when it surfaced that the Gas was still going to Origin).

We agreed that I would call Origin to stop the transfer, and that she would call me back in 30 minutes or so.

So I rang Origin and explained to the chap what was going on, and did Origin have a retention dept? Yes. Ok why don't you call them, and tell them they need to talk to me because right now I'm ready to throttle AGL. OK.

Finish up I got a better deal on the Gas & Elec than what Origin originally tempted me away with. This deal was marginally cheaper than AGL's best offer on Elec, and marginally more on Gas so I have now made a final decision to make the move to Origin for both.

When the AGL "4 levels up" lady rang back to see how I went she sounded quite disappointed that I had done exactly the opposite of what I had set out to do (cancel the move to Origin with just hours to spare). I think the "4 levels up" people expect to always be successful.

TOUGH LUCK!

She knew she didn't have leg to stand on though.

[FenceFurniture]

A very very brief overview of events:
Electricity:
AGL improved my rates
Not good enough so I get Origin to take over
AGL Retention offers the rates I knew they could, so I stay with AGL
Oops, AGL were too slow with that so the Elec is still actually going to Origin.
AGL close my Elec account, which was still $100 in credit after billing. $100 moved to Gas account.
AGL to organise getting the Elec back in January next year - I AM ASSURED IT WILL BE EASY
Rang Origin, spoke to their retention team, got even better rates
Bugger it, I'm going to stay with Origin

Gas:
AGL improved my rates
Not good enough so I get Origin to take over
AGL Retention offers the rates I knew they could, so I stay with AGL
Oops, some kind of giant cockup discovered today, so the Gas is still actually going to Origin in a week or so.
Rang Origin, spoke to their retention team, got even better rates
Bugger it, I'm going to stay with Origin

[FenceFurniture]

This is the email that I sent.

TO THE PERSON THAT READS THIS:Make sure Michael Briggs (AGL marketing Manager) gets this email - he needs to know what a fiasco he is presiding over, and how much time & money it is costing AGL, and the rest of the country. All for nil result, I might add.



Mr Briggs


I am currently going through the extraordinarily painful experience of getting a better energy deal (Gas & Elec) from AGL. The facts are as follows:

1. I have been with AGL for many years and was getting a paltry 6% discount on Elec, and an even worse 2% on Gas, both from AGL.
2. I spent many hours researching all the various suppliers, created a sophisticated spreadsheet to compare everything. This research involved numerous phone calls to the various energy suppliers, as well as about 10 hours of internet research.
3. On 23rd August I rang AGL to see what they could do, and was immediately offered 25% of Elec and 16% off Gas. I said to that person that I knew they can do better than that - and so can other energy cos - as I have a friend who gets from AGL 32% & 25%, respectively. This was about the third time I had called AGLon this subject, for various reasons.
4. I was told that I actually have to leave AGL to get those rates. HOW RIDICULOUS! "Ok, I'm going".
5. I had cause to ring AGL again to say that I was definitely leaving to go to Origin, so what can AGL do? "Nothing", but I was told that my gas discount was in fact 20%, not 16% as I had been advised verbally and by email.
6. So then I have to ring Origin to get the move across to them happening.
7. This involved a further 4 phone calls to them because there was a problem with my gas meter not being on the Jemena database. Origin told me that they had to cancel the gas transfer.
8. So then I had to make 3 phonecalls to Jemena to get the meter sorted out (the gas has always been connected here, and is currently being used - just an administrative cockup - something I am even more familiar with now!
9. Then "Josh" from Jemena had to drive from Sydney to Katoomba - a 3 hour round trip - just to read my meter - he had no other business up here.
10. The next week Josh was back here again to read the meter - I have no idea why. Probably because Origin had requested a new meter reading because now they had the authority to take over the gas account. At least he had other business in the area this time.
11. I had to ring Origin again to make sure of what was happening with my accounts. I was told that everything was now ok to transfer to them.
12. All this time I had been expecting the AGL Retention Team to call me and make me the offer that I knew they could have made some weeks beforehand - if MANAGEMENT WAS EVEN HALF AS SMART AS THEY THINK THEY ARE!
13. As time was getting away, and I had not heard from AGL I decided that I had better go to Centrelink to cancel my two payments to AGL. I did not want to be in a position where I had to get money back - I can only imagine what a mess AGL would make of that. Total time for this was 85 minutes.
14. Finally, on Saturday 23rd September "Tony" from AGL Retention called me to make the 32% & 25% discount offer to me. I accepted these offers. I was assured that everything would go smoothly and that I would not notice any differences or changes, except for the discounts applied. How vastly wrong that turned out to be.....
15. On Monday last, 2nd October, I received an email from Origin to say that my electricity account was now with them. WHAT?
16. I then had to ring AGL to find out what the hell was going on. After waiting my time in YET ANOTHER AGL PHONE QUEUE the call centre person said I would have to speak to Dispute Resolutions, so I go back onto a queue. Disputes said I would have to speak to Management as this had been going on for so long. I go back into the queue again. I have had a tooth extracted a couple of days previous to this, and have discovered another one is loose, so I AM IN NO MOOD FOR THIS! Sorting out other people's cockups is never good, but particularly not at the moment.
17. Finally I get the doubtful pleasure of speaking to "Cam" from AGL "management". I do not know what the criteria is to be a manager, but Cam is hopeless and with the personality of a goldfish. He offered not a word of apology, and presented an attitude of "look, this is how it is - if you want me to fix it then say so". I was told by Cam that I would have to go to Origin for one billing cycle of electricity, and then I would be back at AGL. I told Cam what I thought of his performance - very clearly. I am quite certain that this is my second encounter with Cam in recent times.
18. I have received an email this morning confirming that I will be back at AGL for Elec from 28/1/2018.

I am extremely confident that this will not be the end of this ridiculous stream of cockups. This could have all been avoided if your team was able to offer me the 32% & 25% discounts that I told them I knew about, in the very first place.


If you want confirmation of what I have said, then check the phone call recordings - that's what they're for - and there sure is plenty to choose from in recent weeks.
You will find that I am usually calm, reasonable, rational and courteous, although yesterday I finally took a bit of a holiday from that.


AGL's absurd Management policies have wasted the following:

1. about 25-30 hours of my time, involving some 30 or more phone calls to various energy suppliers. Most of those calls were to AGL, and second most were to Origin.
2. about 2-4 hours of Origin's time in taking over an account that they then lost, retrieved, and lost again.
3. about 5-6 hours of Jemena's time, including a ridiculous trip from Sydney to here just to read a meter.
4. Now I know AGL doesn't care less about wasting all of the above - that's very obvious, BUT think selfishly....
5. about 4-5 hours (probably more) of AGL's time has also been spent on achieving ABSOLUTELY NOTHING! At the end of the day(sssss) there is absolutely no change - I am still with AGL, just getting a fairer price from the previous gouging.
6. So this has cost AGL I suppose in excess of $120 in wages FOR NOTHING.
7. It has cost Jemena probably $150 or more FOR NOTHING
8. It has cost Origin probably $80-100 FOR NOTHING
9. If I put $15 per hour on my time, then a total cost for this fiasco, for all concerned, would be around $750-900. THAT'S FOR ONE CUSTOMER!!

WAKE UP AND STOP WASTING THE COUNTRY'S HUMAN RESOURCES!
"Everyone else is doing the same" is not an excuse!


While I'm about it, get rid of that stupid talking head that constantly yaps at us when we are on hold (which is for a VERY long time). Every 10 seconds he tells us how wonderful AGL is - and you know what? I AM NOT CONVINCED - nor is anyone else! Just play some music, and forget the self congratulations - it's tedious, tiresome, and irritating, or do you not understand this? It's actually self-sabotage.


No doubt I will not get a response - that would take some bottle. I will be sending this story to my local members, and to the Prime Minister - I know he has a soft spot for an AGL story.


A very frustrated and cranky

FenceFurniture

[ajw]

I went through the same thing. Threatened to leave, got a slightly better rate. Then actually left, and got the retention team who offered a reasonable discount. Took several hours, but saved hundreds of dollars. It's absolutely ridiculous. I don't know why we need "retailers" of electricity. The so-called competition only works for those with the stamina to go through the process. I know of people who are paying full rate, because they simply don't have the capacity to "work the system".

My contract expires in November, so I'm gearing up for the same stupid waste of time again. I'm hoping to be a bit quicker about it this time though. I'll switch to an alternative retailer up front, and then deal with the retention team. This will cut out some of the steps.

I share your frustration.

ajw

[tonzeyd]

atleast you guys have a choice, in WA its Synergy for your Electricity. I hear rumours that this will change soon... I eagerly await the day that happens.

We have a few options for gas but its much of a muchness between the providers

[Chris Parks]

Brett, wind up Fairfax and the SMH, you have all the facts so it should be easy for them to write the piece. They also do a comment for publication thing that might work. I got 20% on electricity with a tiered discount rate the last time we changed but when the last changes came through I noticed they had changed the tier arrangement removing and blending two of them so I gave them the finger and I am installing solar at the moment. Before it gets commissioned I am going to change supplier and see if I can screw them down further.

[Simplicity]

Brett,
You a gifted with a very markable skill.

You could have all the work you want.
At a very reasonable rate I'm sure.

Cheers Matt

[FenceFurniture]

Chris you may find that Origin is the best deal, wrt FITs. It is a combination of what you pay and what you get, as you know, and my research showed Origin had the best all round deal with Solar. You may have to start with Origin, pretend you are leaving, and stay with Origin. When I say "pretend" you actually have to activate the leaving process. It's bloody ridiculous the amount of time they all waste.

How many panels are you putting up?

[Uncle Al]

A very interesting process you have been through Brett. About 4 years ago I embarked on a quest to reduce electricity prices, (no gas in my area) receiving considerable price reductions for my efforts from Origin Energy, whom I had been with ever since buying the property about 38 years ago.
About 2 - 1/2 years ago, I had a solar electricity system installed, which created another round of price investigation, especially with the rates offered for the feed-in tariff.

In researching the various offers on the net, it became obvious that I could obtain better pricing.
Ordinarily, one would contact the selected new supplier and let them do all the necessary changes, but I got a touch curious, and rang Origin and asked the question - "Am I in a current contract with you?" (Answer was 'No'), and then "What do I have to do when I change to another provider?"

Well, didn't that start a bit of a chain reaction! The lass offered to match the new providers offer, which I declined, as the new provider had been pro-active with their pricing. No sense accepting the same pricing as their opposition, they have to have a better offer to make it worthwhile. Cutting a long story short, I was contacted by Origin's retention people, and ended up with a considerably better offer than anything offered on line.

I know I have enjoyed very good rates up until the latest price jump that occurred a couple of months ago, and it is now time to do some more investigation. One bonus has been the doubling of the feed-in tariff in the last couple of months, but a full survey of offers as Brett has done is now a necessity.

Going off grid and relying on battery back-up isn't cost effective at the moment, but may become viable in a few years time.

If you don't ask, you will not get any reductions, regardless who you are with!

Alan...

[Mr Brush]

Much the same story here. Contract coming up for renewal, so shopped around for better prices. Got substantially better discounts from a number of other players, then contacted AGL to see if they would match these to retain my business. Was told that their current (uncompetitive) offer was the best they could do, and that they weren't interested in discussing this further. Duly changed suppliers, then for the following 3 months received multiple calls from AGL (to the point of becoming a nuisance) offering discount inducements to go back to them.

I only managed to stop them calling by speaking to a supervisor, telling her in terms too rude to repeat here just what a stupid business model they had, and that I wouldn't go back to AGL if they were the last supplier left on earth.

Happily let your customers go, then run around like crazy trying to get them back??? Who are these idiots?

[FenceFurniture]

Cutting a long story short, I was contacted by Origin's retention people, and ended up with a considerably better offer than anything offered on line.

I know, and in my opinion, this is dishonest BS. In other words "we'll gouge you for everything we can, until you can prove otherwise - then we'll listen to you and give you better rates". Brand loyalty. Pffffft!

Going off grid and relying on battery back-up isn't cost effective at the moment, but may become viable in a few years time.

Yep. Two more years to get the tech right, another 1½-2 years for the poor sucker early adopters to pay for the R&D, and we should be ready to rock.

[FenceFurniture]

.... telling her in terms too rude to repeat here

Ohhhh, go on....don't be chicken.

[Enfield Guy]

The power business is a market based thing. The price fluctuates from minute to minute. It is my very strong view that the general public should automatically receive the best price available within that market without having to negotiate that price. We, as individuals have little power or opportunities to negotiate.These are essential services.

[Chris Parks]

Chris you may find that Origin is the best deal, wrt FITs. It is a combination of what you pay and what you get, as you know, and my research showed Origin had the best all round deal with Solar. You may have to start with Origin, pretend you are leaving, and stay with Origin. When I say "pretend" you actually have to activate the leaving process. It's bloody ridiculous the amount of time they all waste.

How many panels are you putting up?

We are putting up 28 x 290 watt Samsung panels for a start but one thing I am doing is getting full data logging to see what happens as decisions can't be made without data. The ideal is not to feed in anything but that ain't gonna happen as supply and demand within the house goes up and down. I looked at this some years ago and dismissed it but the price of panels has plummeted and at todays electrical supply rates the pay back period will happen in my lifetime where a few years ago that was debatable even for a small system. Batteries aren't a starter at the moment as Al has said, they are simply too expensive and the total current draw from today's batteries is pretty dismal as well, no way can batteries supply a house if the power is cut, you would be lucky to boil the kettle and run a few lights at the same time.

[Uncle Al]

Batteries aren't a starter at the moment as Al has said, they are simply too expensive and the total current draw from today's batteries is pretty dismal as well, no way can batteries supply a house if the power is cut, you would be lucky to boil the kettle and run a few lights at the same time.

Add a 4.8Kw water heater to the mix and the batteries would flatten quick smart!

Alan...