Future of the Australian Electricity Market

[havabeer69]

Broken Hill compressed-air energy storage facility to inject $457m into economy, company says - ABC News

take that with a grain of salt, its still in the "feasibility" and business case phase, there is even articles about the project from 2019 and 2020 and yet not one shovel has been brought out to start the project.

they couldn't even get funding for a 5MW/10MW/h pilot plant
Storage proponent for huge Broken Hill micro-grid fails to land finance for pilot plant | RenewEconomy

Hydrostor energy storage project to contribute to New South Wales economy | Energy Global

In 2020, Hydrostor’s 200 MW and 8 hours (or 1600 MWh) A-CAES system was selected by NSW’s Transmission Network Service Provider, Transgrid, as the preferred option in its Regulatory Investment Test for Transmission (RIT-T) for reliable and secure supply for Broken Hill. Hydrostor and Energy Estate are actively developing this project, which has received grant funding from the NSW Government’s Emerging Energy Program to complete pre-feasibility work.

[Bushmiller]

Yes.

We have to differentiate between those projects that have an incontrovertible go-ahead and those that are being touted to see if there are any takers. The proposal for a new power station at the old Collinsville site was a classic example of something that had no foundation.

Regards
Paul

[Lappa]

And it’s amazing that all these new technologies require electricity to work

[woodPixel]

And it’s amazing that all these new technologies require electricity to work

I am amazed, from that article, that they couldn't raise 60 mil. Such a trivial sum.


The whole point is electrification. Everyone wails about "what when the sun dont shine" .... well, tra-da! Batteries and CAES.

Fossil fuels and CO2 generation must stop.


I think the problem is these developers are still thinking too small. $60M is just background noise. Pump it up to a billion and then you'll get a few Liberal pollies involved

[havabeer69]

I am amazed, from that article, that they couldn't raise 60 mil. Such a trivial sum.


The whole point is electrification. Everyone wails about "what when the sun dont shine" .... well, tra-da! Batteries and CAES.

Fossil fuels and CO2 generation must stop.


I think the problem is these developers are still thinking too small. $60M is just background noise. Pump it up to a billion and then you'll get a few Liberal pollies involved

a problem is at the moment we're asking private companies to front up the cost and unless they can see a $$$ return they won't invest.

so unless the government chucks the money in a lot of projects just wont happen and its actually pretty hard/slow just to get grant money out of the government. It's also not just the building costs its all the on going costs as well and the government are just too focused on trying to get the budget back into the black then what's actually good for all its citizens.

[Bushmiller]

a problem is at the moment we're asking private companies to front up the cost and unless they can see a $$$ return they won't invest.

haveabeer

That is absolutely the crux of the matter. Add to that the equivocal stance by the government and the prospect of investment becomes slight tending towards "you must be joking.". Until such time as the government of the day acknowledges there is a climate crisis and actively demonstrates that this is it's firm belief by their actions, as opposed to lip service, private companies will be reluctant to commit their funds

How will the government persuade private enterprise they are serious about climate change? I would say they have a problem in this regard considering their past history of constant denial. I would suggest they would need to have a vested interest such as would come about by joint ventures even if they are a minority partner.

Before my comments are seen as political I would like readers to view this satirical take on the Victorian situation (Labour party of course) where there is a proposal to begin taxing electric vehicles. Watch the delicious ladies from The Juice Media and see the comparison with Norway in particular.

Honest Government Ad | Electric Vehicles - The Juice Media

Regards
Paul

[Chris Parks]

The idea for taxing BEV's came from the US and Australia would just be copy cats if it happens here which it must do eventually. The difference between the US and here is that in the US there are tax credits and incentives to buy a BEV and here the government is trying to avoid upsetting its electoral base (presumably) by not encouraging anything that can be seen to be hurting the coal industry. This is a good link to the US situation Special Fees on Plug-In Hybrid and Electric Vehicles (ncsl.org)

[Bushmiller]

Chris

Thanks for that link. My take is that there are two aspects. Firstly the initial incentives to go EV, which are just not there compared to other countries: Norway is the prime example

Norweigian EV incentives.jpg

and secondly the question of taxation down the track. It would seem that Victoria is putting the cart before the horse. Also see where the US is related to other western nations:

US place in the EV stakes.jpg

Having said that, our past record of sleeping with the US would leave me to believe your conjecture is right.

Regards
Paul

[Chris Parks]

Norway is actively going down the path of alternative energy in spite of what it will do to their huge oil production that supports those goals of reduced emissions while Australia refuses to do exactly the same thing because the politicians are petrified of what will happen to them at the next elections. I thought the politicians were elected to do the best thing for Australia and not for themselves. I doubt one party is any better than any others in Australia but time will tell on that one.

[Lappa]

One argument I see the Govt using is they have spent close on a trillion dollars getting Australia through the pandemic so they will need time to pay down that debt before they can provide relief in other areas such as electric car incentives.

[Chris Parks]

One argument I see the Govt using is they have spent close on a trillion dollars getting Australia through the pandemic so they will need time to pay down that debt before they can provide relief in other areas such as electric car incentives.

They had exactly the same policy pre the virus issues.

[Lappa]

Maybe so but they didn’t have the same debt, so now, as much as we don’t like it, they are in a stronger position to put off incentives by crying poor.

[Bushmiller]

Maybe so but they didn’t have the same debt, so now, as much as we don’t like it, they are in a stronger position to put off incentives by crying poor.

That may well be true and probably is, but there could be peer pressure from around the world that says something like "Do you think for some reason you are the only ones doing it tough? Have a look around the world and wake up: And, stop hiding behind excuses!"

Regards
Paul

[Chris Parks]

I can't understand how the government can't see the benefit to the country by adding infrastructure such as the Singapore proposal and the various other solar and battery proposals mostly funded by private industry. I understand that some of these maybe either dreamland stuff due to other issues but like Paul says international pressure will force them to do it in the end. Maybe it will take a major coal market that is converting to stop buying coal and that is going to happen anyway.

[Bohdan]

I would say that it's more likely that the coal industry is lining the gov's pockets and until there are better offers the policy won't change.