Senseless and Stupid

[TassieKiwi]

Peter,

I say, if you stuff up, wear it on the chin when you get caught, don't blame your upbringing or your horrible addiction or anyone else that really had nothing to do with it etc.

Dan

Yeah, what he said. The Eagles have a cool song 'Get over it' on this theme. Worth a listen.

Mind you, in order to fix the problem we might need to look beyond the 'pedal operator'

Den

[Grunt]

The Eagles have a cool song 'Get over it' on this theme

You mean that The Eagles have another song besides 'Hotel California'?

[DaveInOz]

It is only a small thing but I think (all) people need to be taught that there is no such thing as an accident, there is always a cause and there is always fault.
Even if someone hits you, could you have anticipated them moving, were you going too fast to avoid them, were you in their blind spot, were your reactions delayed because you were distracted .... sure they will wear the majority of the blame, but don't imagine you played no part, and don't dismiss it as an accident, or something unavoidable / inevitable, admit the faults you made and don't make them again.
The best advice I received was 'remember you are invisable' and 'always have an escape plan.' If there is no escape route you know you are in trouble so slow down until there is one, then when something unexpected happens you'll know were to go safely.
There are no accidents in cars, call them collisions or something that isn't dismissive of fault.

[Wood Borer]

In my earlier thread I wasn’t suggesting we let wrongdoers off the hook, I was suggesting that perhaps some parents and society have been remiss in not teaching the wrongdoers right from wrong or consideration of others.

If people have been exposed to figuring out consequences and thinking of others then they might not act in such selfish ways.

I think a breach should be punished no matter what the reason behind the breach. Certainly gaoling, fining, canceling of licences etc won’t heal the wounded or bring the corpses back to life but it may influence some others not to be so stupid. If it doesn’t then the offenders are out of the way for awhile – no long enough generally.

As Zed suggested, foolishness leads to Dave’s collisions, injuries or death which is nature’s way of ensuring future generations are less likely to carry the idiot gene. Unfortunately when cars are involved, the consequences of stupidity also affect others rather than just the idiot.

No wonder the selfish and foolish don’t go for the woodworking, if we stuff up we have to throw it away. Appealing with pathetic excuses to the bandsaw or the lathe after a disaster doesn’t reverse our mistake but most of us do take more care next time and learn from our experieces.

[DaveInOz]

No wonder the selfish and foolish don’t go for the woodworking, .

Speak for yourself

Appealing with pathetic excuses to the bandsaw or the lathe after a disaster doesn’t reverse our mistake.

But kicking it, swearing at it, then storming off for a beer is highly therapeutic

[johna]

All this talk about high powered cars is a load of hogwash.
Doesn't matter if you give them a R34 GTR , WRX , 200sx or a god damn commodore or falcon. All these cars can reach very high speeds, just that the first 3 i mentioned can do them quicker. The biggest problem we face today is driver attitude.
I own a modified WRX but do not go out onto the streets everyday thinking i'm in a race, i reserve it for the race track.
To restrict a P plater from driving high powered cars will not work because even in a kia rio you can hit speeds of up to 180km/h and this is were we are losing our kids on the roads.
The government isn't doing jack about any of this, they think putting all these revenue raising cameras all over the highways and open roads will save lives...hahahahaha, pitty that these deaths are happening on 50km/h roads.
They also mention driver training to become compulsary, ok so lets see here, you take a young arrogant P plater with a bad attitude and teach him how to handle a car, what will this acheive??? it will acheive another death on the roads as this now more arrogent and more confident kid will push his car even further than before thinking to himself i am ready for every situation.

[DanP]

Feel better ?

[RETIRED]

[LineLefty]

Doesnt the driver training make you realise just fragile your control of a car actually is?

[Peter R]

Peter,

You may state your opinioin anytime you like. As I have stated mine. We will have to agree to disagree though. I think that the biggest issue in the world today is the refusal by anyone to accept responsibility for their actions. It's why there's so many lawsuits and sadly, society, through it's courts, allows it to continue. I say, if you stuff up, wear it on the chin when you get caught, don't blame your upbringing or your horrible addiction or anyone else that really had nothing to do with it etc.

Dan

Dan,

Acceptance of responsibility - I agree wholeheartedly.
I say society is to blame( I stated the circumstances)
You say 'society, through the courts has allowed it' to continue'. Society to blame??
Passing the blame or having an excuse has never been in my ideology.
But again, society has allowed crims of all sorts to blame someone else, it is a greatly used defence in the courts, is it not?
I do not think that we disagree all that much Dan.

Now, my mate agrees with the concept that P plates and learners tickets are used for an apprenticeship into driving. They are to show that the person is worthy of a full license if they behave sensibly. Given that a person is not fully brain sufficient until they are thirty,(her words, and boy,can she fight) my mate reckons that if you exceed the speed limit by 30ks on P's or Ls that you should be told to come back when you are thirty. If you are caught driving in that period, along with the appropriate penalty, another five years should be added on to the application for re-plating.
The politicians are doing the two foot shuffle at the moment hoping that their overseas study tours come up before they have to make a decision.

Peter R.

[ozwinner]

I normally don't offer an opnion as I try to be neutral BUT!!!

Over the past 35 years of having my licence I have done 4 advanced driving courses, driven rally cars, had a go at go-karts, raced speedway and driven Formula vees and a formula 5000 car.

.

That must have been one big go cart.

Only Kidding.

Al

[DavidG]

Does not matter what we say or what we do, Mother nature will always find a way to adjust the gene pool.

[Iain]

Unfortunately I have deleivered too many trauma debriefing for fatals (I used to contract to TAC) and the number of times I heard 'he really was a good driver', 'he knew what he was doing, what went wrong'.
In short, although I never said it was, he was not a good driver, he was a dickhead and had no idea how to control a car.
My daughter is currently on her L's and thinks nothing of cruising at 100kph, she thinks it's cool.
I let her loose in the middle of a wet paddock and when she turned at about 25kph the car went for a slide, what did she do, panicked let go of the wheel and braked.
We achieved 3 360's and a bit of screaming but I got the result I was after, she slows down now realising that she can't drive that well.
We live opposite a T intersection just out of town, the intersection is invariably covered with gravel and we get about 4 cars a year cruise straight through and into our embankment generally wrecking the said car.
What makes this even better is that every bingle has been by a local hoon who travels these roads on a regular basis and KNOWS THAT YOU CANNOT BRAKE HARD IN GRAVEL, but they persist.
TMU sit up the road from us and manage to demolish the bank accounts of local hoons who want to travel well over 100kph in an 80 zone, but they still persist.
My own pet hate is young girls in Excels with P plates, they are so bloody arrogant and always want to be in front, sitting at the lights in my 4.5litre Landcruiser with a float and two TB's on board, all up about 5 tonnes, and I can still out accellerate them but they still want to be in front and try to cut me off, half the time I never see them coming but have to brake hard to avoid hitting them, and the donkeys just love that, smacking their big noses into the window.
There is a theory that hotted up cars are generally owned by under achievers who have no control of their own lives and this is the only time that they are in control, albeit not very well.

[jow104]

Ian

Thats what I said the other day the young ladies all seem to want to jump me at the lights.

If the commercial world had invested the money spent on mobile telephone technology on a form of cruise control for motor vehicles with external electronic control, driving would be a much safer way of life.

So anyone wanting to create a new and worthwhile industry why not give the above thought a whiz. The basis for this advance is already lying around, they puts chips on windscreens so those chips could be programed to do other things.

That fellow Peter (whats is name?) should be able to make a dummy set up.

[stevephillips]

Last year I was unfortunate enough to come across an MVA on the way home from work. A Hyundi Excel had failed to take a bad downhill corner and hit a tree square on at around 90 kph. There were a lot of vehicles stopped and people milling around, I was going to keep driving but I stopped and walked down. The bystanders said there was only one occupant but when I tore the passenger window out there were two young men inside. One was dead and the other died while I tried to revive him.
They were both wearing seatbelts.
The next day I was driving home and saw a solitary man standing where the boys had died. I stopped and approched him as I had a feeling about it.
The two boys aged 23 and 28 were his sons.
He told me they were normally carefull drivers and always wore seat belts, he asked if they had suffered any pain before they died, what do you say?
I see a lot of people die in my line of business but this incident has effected me more than I can explain.
The car was not hotted up and provided precious little protection for the occupants.
I believe that young people will inevitably take risks in motor vehicles and need better driving training to deal with situations when things turn pear shaped. We do need to place limits on young drivers and hope that they survive long enough to pass the "personal myth" stage. But we can never completely eliminate risk taking or accidents.