Graziano SAG 180

[Anorak Bob]

Bryan,

I found these photos on a favourite Dutch site. An original finish, good nick version of yours. Might be of interest. There are higher definition photos on the website -

Draaibanken

Bob.

[Anorak Bob]

From Reliable Tools when they bothered to post good quality photos in abundance.

[Bryan]

Bob, thanks, that is indeed a very tidy example of a 14. It differs from the 180 in a few ways, which we've just been discussing on PM.

And thanks for the advice about welding guys, but that will be a last resort.

Have now got the carriage and cross slide all cleaned out and reassembled. It's starting to feel very nice. Next I need to sort the clutch.

I said when I first inspected it I thought it had been cared for. I must have had the rose-coloured glasses on. There are quite a few signs of heavy-handedness and neglect. Things broken and bent; non-critical things mostly. The sludge in the apron was unspeakable. No way will I use water based coolant after seeing that. Filthy stuff! The upside is the machine seems to have survived these torments very well.

[Dave J]

If it comes up half as good as your shaper it will look great.
Once you go through it you will know what you have and I am sure it will be looked after from here on in.

I missed the earlier question about the bolt size, I was thinking something like M6-8 socket head that could be counter bored and puttied over so it would be unseen when finished.

Don't forget to keep us updated with photo's, you know how we all like them.

Dave

[Bryan]

Not much chance of it looking like the shaper I'm afraid Dave (but thanks for the compliment). No, this one is getting necessary repairs & maintenance, a good scrub and that's about it for now. The shaper put me off painting big time. Partly because it just takes so damned long. But also I'm not that sure I like the pristine, high gloss look. What I might do is get some paint mixed to match the blue - which I like, though it's not original - in a satin finish and use it for touch-ups, like the tailstock. Could be a slippery slope though.

[eskimo]

But also I'm not that sure I like the pristine, high gloss look.

Yeah..it only needs to be cleaned more often if it is

I was ...no I started cleaning the drill press last night and thought..I wonder.....a little car cutting polish made the front belt guard look great...still has a few chips scratches etc...but it looks clean, shiny, and looks as though it has been cared for ....does'nt look like a new plastic hybrid...I guess this action is same as what I learnt when I restored some antique furniture....dont rub/scrap and sand away all the old patina...just polish over it.

I am thinking I will go down this track instead instead of re-painting..maybe it will suit the Graz as well

[Markv2]

Hello Bryan,
If you decide the Graziano is not what you wanted let me know?
Mark

[Bryan]

No harm in dreaming I guess.

[Bryan]

Time for some updates.

This is how the tailstock came back from the welder:



The stitching didn't pan out. Don't ask. But Green's did a good welding job. After a few weeks on the back burner at 'Reluctant Paint & Panel', I finally reassembled it today:



Didn't fuss with ancillaries, just painted the main body. I'm very happy with the colour match, and like the satin look, but could not get the Dulux semi gloss to flow properly. I think it really needs to be sprayed. Thankfully the brush strokes don't show up much in the pic.


This earlier pic illustrates the height problem:



Here is my solution. Those are salvaged jarrah bridge timbers, machined flat. Together with the 12 mm plates, they give about 180mm total lift:



I know timber is not really text-book, especially only being secured by gravity, but I figure it's worth a try. It certainly feels solid enough. I will start bolting things down as needed. The first time I turn something off-centre in the 4 jaw will be the test.

Now I can roll the the handwheel over with just the slightest drop of the shoulder - very comfortable. (Sorry about the glare - I need a taller tripod.)




Here is my solution to the missing front way covers - some MDF and sheet ally. Crude but effective. It just lifts off. Wipers still need fixing.



One problem I spent a lot of time on was the clutch drag, but that remains unresolved. I have decided to try living with it for a while, rather than pull it apart again with no real prospect of a fix. It's quite a bit of work to get at.

So I've been levelling and tweaking. I had a nasty moment when I did a test cut and got .16mm/100 taper. Glad I did some cross-checking before messing with headstock alignment. Turned out to be deflection. A truer figure is about .01mm/100. That'll do for now. Also in the levelling process I discovered some wear in the ways. The front way drops a few thou in the usual area. I worked out the diametric error would be a couple of microns. Whatever.

Now I just wish my QC toolpost would arrive from the states. Nearly seven weeks now. Not happy with USPS!

[Dave J]

Hi Bryan,
Good to put a face to a name.
The tail stock looks like it came up great, the wear is to be expected of a lathe this age.
I raised my Chinese lathe 100mm at first, then when I fitted feet I found it to be even better with the extra 50mm.

If you keep your eye out you might find some RHS steel off cuts laying around to replace the wood, but I don't think it's going anywhere with the timber.
Those way covers come up great as well, and will serve the purpose.

What size QC tool post did you order? I have read on HSM forum a lot of guys complaining. My son is waiting for stuff to arrive as well.

Dave

[Hunch]

Looks the goods, you do need Italian ape body type to operate these things!

They tell you what type of filler was used on the tailstock by the way?

USPS has been running 2 weeks for me recently, suppliers have been telling me a lot of porky pies though on dispatch dates! Got another Create Multifix clone QC for this thing inside 10 days - on the other side of the ledger, from the place up north.

Here are the molded wipers on this thing, got me a block of UHMW nylon for my attempt at turning good material into a probable unmitigated disaster. Struck out with one supplier trying the easy solution.........and don't want to deal with a couple of other possibilities locally. One of the guys on PM did have some luck with his 12 through this mob though apparently.

VAJ s.r.l.

[Jekyll and Hyde]

Now I just wish my QC toolpost would arrive from the states. Nearly seven weeks now. Not happy with USPS!

Lathe's looking pretty mean though - I'm just a lot jealous!

As far as USPS goes, I'd be getting a bit concerned.... I had a large flat rate box posted on the 3 of August, and it arrived on the 18th....

Hopefully it shows up soon for you...

[Bryan]

Dave, I decided on CXA after much agonising. At 14" swing my lathe fits the specs for BXA, CXA and CA. I considered the Dickson style like yours because a lot of these lathes were supplied with those. But I went with the Aloris type mainly for simplicity of making holders. I bought ten holders from CDCO to get me started and they arrived promptly, so it's frustrating not having the post. I didn't buy the post from CDCO because they only sell the piston type.

Bill, your wipers look very similar to mine, though I don't have the long one for the cross slide. Or is it the compound? You're keen carving them from solid. I'll be interested to know how you go. I bought some nice aluminium backed way wiper material, kindly supplied by a forum member. I won't dob him in, he can put his hand up if he wants to. I just need to figure out how to cut & shut it to get the shapes I need. Or more to the pint, how to secure it well. This is the stuff: KabelSchlepp Machine Way Wipers

Jekyll and Hyde, yes I am getting concerned, but I don't know what I can do. Any suggestions?

[RayG]

Hi Bryan,

Nice repair job, considering the location and difficulty of welding cast iron, it looks brazed, and I guess they would have had to heat the whole part up to at least 500C and then braze it while hot. And cool real slowly

Nice to see it turned out so well.

I won't ask about the stitching.... oh wait I think I just did...

Looking back at the original pictures, I see that they had to build up the area that had chipped out as well.

Impressive repair!

Regards
Ray

[Bryan]

Yes you're right Ray, on all counts. And I forgot to answer Bill's question about filler because I don't know. Some type of bronze alloy obviously.