CoronaVirus ==> Empty Shelves

[Tonyz]

So could you knobs do any better? for gawds sake we are in one of the craziest situations the world has been it, situation and updates changing hourly.
The poor leaders of our and other nations may or may not make the (in your smart arrse minds) right decisions but rather them than me making decisions.

Aussies were slow behind America in blame focusing but hells bells we are catching up damn quick, to be the big wingers cause it hurts me and stuff my neighbours.

Times like this our leaders need to know we support them whether they are doing it correctly or 'your' way.

I am getting very angry at peoples mindsets over this, during WW2 people supported the government of the day, didnt matter if you followed that party or not, they were the leaders.

[FenceFurniture]

It's basically the difference between a Statesman and a Marketeer.

Yes. There seems to be a worldwide dearth of statesmen (statespeople?) currently. UK, USA, Australia, Venezuela are just a few fairly obvious ones (to me anyway), and I'm sure there are many more. Ian can much better comment on Trudeau but I get the impression he's viewed as doing ok. Is Conte getting much (deserved) flak?

With the latter it's lots of smoke

Not any more.

[Kuffy]

Now the more important part. Here's a YouTube link that talks about "the numbers", specifically the exaggeration of them. This is something that has crossed my mind many times in the past two weeks. It also talks about why this might be being done. This sounds a little bit too much like a conspiracy theory to me but you be the judge. It's not overly long...

YouTube

Yeah, I reckon it is just conspiracy theories. The virus happened, and there are just a bunch of lucky accidents as a result of the virus. Such as the mortality rate of older people seems to be higher than younger, which is great for the governments because older people are considered a drain on the system. Moving to a cashless society to avoid passing contaminated notes from person to person is just another lucky accident which the government benefits from by way of being able to better track the monies and not having to pay to physical manufacture of the notes.

if he said that China released the virus deliberately to kill of their older population, I'd be willing to believe that with substantial evidence. But I doubt they actually did it, simply because the virus is a bit of a unknown monster whereas a bullet flies straight and true.

[BobL]

when stage 4 kicks in and you can't get to your shed here are a few ideas for youse to try

Central Queensland men smash the stereotypes with pole dancing, embroidery and cake decorating

Central Queensland men smash the stereotypes with pole dancing, embroidery and cake decorating - ABC News (Australian Broadcasting Corporation)

[FenceFurniture]

Times like this our leaders need to know we support them whether they are doing it correctly or 'your' way.

That's a fair point, but going to the footy and delaying measures to do so was really bloody dopey - it was a terrible look. As was the Chief Medical Officer shaking hands with journos in the green room before Insiders two weeks ago (was commented upon by the same journos at the time).

Certainly I think SmirKo's performance is now significantly better than his bushfire response. He just needs to react quicker and stronger with lockdowns and the like. Those sorts of decisions should be in the control of the most senior (unelected) health professionals who have the nouse, not politicians who crave to be loved and who may or may not follow the best public health advice they are given.

[BobL]

Times like this our leaders need to know we support them whether they are doing it correctly or 'your' way.

I am getting very angry at peoples mindsets over this, during WW2 people supported the government of the day, didnt matter if you followed that party or not, they were the leaders.

I completely disagree - there has to be continuing debate, and those in charge have to be held accountable in any circumstance, especially for IN-ACTION and not listening to a wide enough range of experts. Blindly following leaders is what North Koreans do.

For the record, Australia had 5 different prime ministers during WWII. OK one was due to Curtin passing away but we were fortunate to have him for most of the war (Oct 41 to July 45) especially as someone that stood up to Churchill and brought our troops home from Europe.

[FenceFurniture]

when stage 4 kicks in and you can't get to your shed here are a few ideas for youse to try

I can see you cake decorating with SWMBO's guidance, and I can even see you doing embroidery - a little doily for Jeffrey's pommel p'raps - maybe even some socks for his pear shaped feet. Dextrous skills that you probably have or could develop.

But Bob-on-a-Pole is a leap of faith that I can't quite get to.

[ian]

Ian

Our Australian Government has been unforgivably slow in enacting most of the policies around this pandemic. It is not as if there are not examples all around the world to indicate the perils of inaction. I fully agree with some sort of moratorium on rent payment ( as I do for mortgage repayments, easy for the bank: tack it onto the end of the contract). As almost everybody is in the same boat with reduced or no income there is little point in waving the big stick over a tenant. Who would replace them anyway? I think I have seen that the UK has done something similar too, but I need somebody to confirm this.

Regards
Paul

Paul

what I took away from the link I posted was that the tenant -- Kye Kemp and her daughter -- were being evicted so that the property's owners (who have allegedly lost their incomes) could return to live in it. Note that the owners are not moving back to their primary residence -- which presumably is generating more income than what Kye is paying in rent -- but to their investment property. The comparison I was drawing is that in Alberta -- a Province with a more conservative government than those typically found in Australia -- tenant's rights were being protected and protection of those rights are backdated.

I can't quote Premier Kenny's exact words, but the gist was landlords need to work WITH tenants.




The other interesting comparison is that since the outbreak started the daily Covid-19 updates are provided by the Province's Chief Medical Officer -- Deena Hinshaw -- not the Alberta Premier.
Believe it or not but I find Dr Hinshaw a creditable source.



Edited to correct the spelling of Dr Hinshaw's

[ian]

Perhaps a side benefit of retiring early?

I believe you and I are pretty close to the same age born between 1954 and 1956.

I retired at 60-1/2 but was rather ill for a bit just before retiring.

Getting back to the data, yesterday saw a significant rise in detected cases on the east coast, so my "data looks promising" indication in a previous post just got blown out of the water.

Stricter quarantine measures started last night (Saturday).
I believe that everyone in quarantine is now being tested and including the fact that they've been returning from places like the US, South America and Europe -- all of which require long flights -- it should be expected that the numbers of confirmed and suspected cases would show an uptick.

[ian]

So could you knobs do any better? for gawds sake we are in one of the craziest situations the world has been it, situation and updates changing hourly.
The poor leaders of our and other nations may or may not make the (in your smart arrse minds) right decisions but rather them than me making decisions.

Times like this our leaders need to know we support them whether they are doing it correctly or 'your' way.

I completely disagree - there has to be continuing debate, and those in charge have to be held accountable in any circumstance, especially for IN-ACTION and not listening to a wide enough range of experts. Blindly following leaders is what North Koreans do.

For the record, Australia had 5 different prime ministers during WWII. OK one was due to Curtin passing away but we were fortunate to have him for most of the war (Oct 41 to July 45) especially as someone that stood up to Churchill and brought our troops home from Europe.

for what it's worth, I'm with BobL on this.

It's fair to draw comparisons between what's happening between countries.


As BobL intimated in an earlier post in this thread our current leaders had early warning of this crisis but some chose to ignore that warning in favour of protecting the budget "surplus".

[doug3030]

Here's a little gem someone sent me a link to. Make of it what you will.

COVID-19
Another Conspiracy Theory OR

WELL PLAYED CHINA...?

SCENE 1
The curtain opens: China becomes ill, enters a "crisis" and paralyzes its trade. The curtain closes.

SCENE II
The curtain opens: The Chinese currency is devalued. They do not do anything. The curtain closes.

SCENE III
The curtain opens: Due to the lack of trade of companies from Europe and the USA that are based in China, their shares fall 40% of their value.

SCENE IV
The curtain opens: The world is ill, China buys 30% of the shares of companies in Europe and the US at a very low price. The curtain closes.

SCENE V
The curtain opens: China has controlled the disease and owns companies in Europe and the US. And he decides that these companies stay in China and earn $ 20,000Billions. The curtain closes. How is the play called?

SCENE VI & Checkmate

Re Amazing but true

Two videos have passed between yesterday and today that convinced me of something I suspected, but had no basis. It was just my speculation. Now I am convinced that the coronavirus was purposely propagated by the Chinese themselves.

At first they were too prepared. Three weeks after the start of the roll, 14 days and a 12,000-bed hospitals were already under construction. And they really built them in two weeks.

Awesome...

They announced that they had stopped the epidemic. They appear in videos celebrating, they announce that they even have a vaccine. How could they create it so quickly without having all the genetic information? Well if you are the owner of the formula it is not difficult at all and now we saw a video that explains how Den Xiao Ping gave the west a half stick. Due to the coronavirus, the actions of Western companies in China fell dramatically. China I just hope, when they went down enough they bought them. Now the companies, Created by the USA and Europe in China with all the technology put in by these exchanges and their capital they passed into the hands of China, which is now rising with all that technological potential and will be able to set prices at will to sell everything they need to the West. How are you?

None of this could have happened by chance. China who cared that a few old men died? Fewer old-age pensions to pay, but the loot has been huge. And right now the West is financially defeated, in crisis and stunned by the disease. And without knowing what to do.

Masterfully diabolic. It had to be the communists.

Adding to this, they are now the single largest owners of US treasury with 1.18 trillion holding surpassing Japan.
An instrument that has seen the most rally

One prospective & Analogy

How come Russia & North Korea have Low or Zero incidence of Covid - 19 ?

Is it because they are staunch allies of China

On the other hand USA / South Korea / United Kingdom / France / Italy / Spain and Asia are severely hit

How come Wuhan is suddenly free from the deadly virus?

China says that the drastic initial measures that they took were very stern and Wuhan was locked down to contain the spread to other areas

Why Beijing was not hit ? Why only Wuhan?

It is interesting to ponder upon.. right ?

Well ..Wuhan is open for business now

Covid - 19 needs to be seen in the backdrop of the arm twisting of China by USA in the trade war.

America and all the above mentioned countries are devastated financially

Soon American economy will collapse as planned by China.

China knows it cannot defeat America militarily as USA is at present the most powerful country in the world.

So use the virus...to cripple the economy and paralyse the nation and its defense capabilities.

Nancy Pelosi got a part in this.... to topple Trump.... ?

Lately President Trump has always been telling of how the great American economy was improving on all fronts and jobs were coming back to the USA

The only way to destroy his vision of making America great again is to create an Economic havoc.

Nancy Pelosi was unable to bring down Trump through impeachment.....so work along with China to destroy Trump by releasing a virus?

Wuhan's epidemic was a showcase.

At the peak of the virus epidemic....China's President Xi Jinping wore a simple RM1 facemask to visit those effected areas.

As President he should have been covered from head to toe but that was not the case.

He was already injected to resist any harm from the virus that means a cure was already in place before the virus was released

China's vision is to control the World Economy by buying up stocks now from countries facing the brink of severe Economic Collapse. Later China will announce that their Medical Researchers have found a cure to destroy the virus.

Now China shall own the stocks of All Western Alliances and these countries will soon be slave to their new master..... CHINA

COVID 19 Another Conspiracy Theory Or Well Played CHINA

[FenceFurniture]

The Guardian blog is a pretty good roundup of events as the unfold around the world.

Some excerpts from it:
All migrants in Portugal will be treated as permanent residents until 1 July to ensure they have access to public services during the coronavirus outbreak, Reuters reports.

From probably the worst non-statesperson leader:
“Some people are going to die,” Bolsonaro said on Friday. “That’s life.”
“You can’t shut down a car factory because people die in traffic accidents,” Bolsonaro added.

Social distancing, as demonstrated by migrant workers in India (pic by Bhuvan Bagga/AFP via Getty Images:
Capture.jpg

[Greg Ward]

Been reading the discussion for a period.
We have a range of members, some have been high flying executives, some teachers, a lot in IT, some sole traders, many retired. None have had to manage a small or large country as far as I am aware
What is interesting to me is the different attitudes of the armchair critics.
And the measured comments or absence of comments from those who have had to manage a business or been involved in crisis management.

[FenceFurniture]

You have to wonder if the various cruise ships still at sea are going to wind up like the MS St Louis as portrayed in The Voyage Of The Damned. I would not like to be aboard one of those giant incubators.


This link to Johns Hopkins shows the world in graphic detail with a few tweakable controls. The USA and Europe appear to be basket cases. Just adding up the European cases, and just Italy, Spain, Germany, France account for over 260,000 cases and 18,752 deaths. Germany, whilst having a large number of cases at 57,695 has a very low number of deaths at 433.

[doug3030]

None have had to manage a small or large country as far as I am aware
What is interesting to me is the different attitudes of the armchair critics.

Well I have never been personally responsible for managing a country. But having been an Intelligence Analyst for 20 years, I have personally briefed the Prime Minister and Cabinet and the Chiefs of the Armed Forces of Australia on matters of national and international importance. I have also forwarded Intelligence Reports that I have written to heads of Allied Governments throughout the world, including the big ones. I have therefore had substantial input into the decision-making process. There's more goes on behind the scenes than most people would think.