No furniture, no Quokka but lots o'paper

[felixe]

Last time I was back home in Tassie there weren't any quokka's, but maybe you can see them all from Melbourne??:confused:

Also, how irresponsible is it to post a picture of a log truck, (any log truck) and make an off the cuff statment that it is "bound for Japan"..

Geez, I could stand on the Southern Outlet or any other part of the Huon Highway and take photos of log trucks all day, but how could I tell where they are bound for? Most go to mills, others for Pulp, don't know about the charcoal,

Also, do they have Jarrah in Tasmania? (This is an honest question).:confused:

Red B, I ask all these questions because I would like to know specific sources to your information, maybe some basic intext referencing so we could all read up on your in-depth research.

[Red_B']

Thanks Clinton1,
I think you've been more succinct than I and indeed have helped me address it better having seen it in someone else's words. But the timber is cut by Japanese companies for other Japanese companies for further Japanese companies and for the most part, these companies are owned by the same Japanese corporation; or as they put it, " a value chain, encompassing upstream fields to those downstream".
At one time, there were over 25 million Japanese citizens who petitioned the WA government to stop woodchipping WA's old growth.
Around 160,000 tonnes of 1st and 2nd grade Jarrah goes to saw logs and 150,000 tonnes of 2nd, 3rd and some 1st grade Jarrah goes to charcoal. (I think this corrects my second misunderstanding of the grades that go to charcoal).
Then on top of that is approx another 200,000 tonnes of 3rd grade for fence posts, telephone poles and railway sleepers (Jarrah sleepers may cease soon due to the mining industry cancelling contracts for them). This is every year for 10 years as part of the current Forest Management Plan and comes mostly from the Central and Swan Jarrah forest regions. It amounts to approximately 8,000 Aussie rules or 15,000 Rugby football fields of forest logged EACH YEAR for TEN YEARS.
Maglite: You are wrong as you say you could be: The Jarrah logs on the truck are virtually stripped of bark at the logging coup. And take a look at my first post as that is the sort of timber that goes to charcoal to convert quartz (silica) to silicon for the substrate of CPU's, transistors and solid state devices in general. (they make 30,000 tonnes of pure silicon per year)
Of course, I don't know and can't provide, and nobody would want me to here, all the facts on the topic. It was never my intention but I did wish to find out how others felt and as I mentioned earlier, I appreciate everybodies' input.
Regards and thanks again,
Red_B'

Look here <http://www.tcha.org.au/water.html> for the effect of the wood chipping industry on Melbourne. I literally only just found it at time of posting.

oh, and Waldo, for you and those others who like to swear in a forum by misspelling words, your intent is the same and should be treated with the contempt it deserves. I'm glad it didn't get through to the forum though it did go through my e-mail. You've lowered yourself below any level of respect I could afford you.

[Lignum]

oh, and Waldo, for you and those others who like to swear in a forum by misspelling words, your intent is the same and should be treated with the contempt it deserves. I'm glad it didn't get through to the forum though it did go through my e-mail. You've lowered yourself below any level of respect I could afford you.

I respect Waldo more than some new pup with 6 posts to his name. Maybe if you had a few posts up your belt introducing yourself around and also showing your interest in woodworking, THEN have your say about what you feel so strongly about instead of your first post attacking the industry like you did. If all you want to do is come here and rant, then maybe you should be looking at another forum to do it in

[Red_B']

G'day Felixe,
I don't know if Jarrah does grow in Tasmania. I can't find a reference to it on the net but as Gunns is doing its best to construct a pulp mill at Bell Bay for Kraft wood, they will probably "import" Jarrah from WA. After all, if Bell Bay is to produce 800,000 tonnes of pulp EVERY YEAR, where do the trees come from?

[BobL]

At one time, there were over 25 million Japanese citizens who petitioned the WA government to stop woodchipping WA's old growth.

I don't buy blanket woodchipping but I find some of your facts distinctly lacking credibility.

Your association between Quokkas and jarrah is still not substantiated.
From the WA Calm Website on Quokkas (show me where it says Jarrah or provide me with any creditable reference that says quokka's are associated with jarrah)

PREFERRED HABITAT: On the mainland, densely vegetated areas around swamps or streams are preferred. On Rottnest Island, however, they inhabit low and scrubby coastal vegetation where water is not always available year round.

With all respect to the japanese, some of whom I count amongst my best friends, my experience from living there is I seriously doubt whether 1 million japanese could point to WA on a map of the world let alone have any idea what is actually there. The reason they might petition anything to do with stopping trees being taken for chipping would be based on the same green credentials as their whale research projects, like it might affect their beloved koalas which like quokkas can be found all over WA.

[Red_B']

BobL:
G'day. The Green House cred's is an interesting point but not the case here. I remembered that there was some sort of petition, albeit some years ago and it took a bit to find but it turns out it was from a "Japanese Consumer Union" which stated that it represented 30 million consumers whose main concern was food safety and the environment. I guess it's a lobby group of concerned people. The petition was about six years ago too but the sentiment's just the same. It doesn't directly relate to the quokka either. I merely mentioned it to point out that there is concern from that neck of the woods too. I agree with your comment about not too many being able to point to us; we almost don't exist to a lot of people.
There's a web-site I was referred to but I don't seem to be able to get onto and it's this: http://www.savearcadiaforest.tk/ (where's tk ? Turkey?) I'd be interested to know if you get on it as I'm told it definitely works. I changed my browser settings but still get no result.
There's plenty of info' on the net regarding quokka inhabiting the Arcadia forest. Arcadia is full of Jarrah which a Japanese company buys for $5 per tonne and turns to charcoal at Kemerton in WA, etc; please read full thread.
Thanks Bob.
Regs,
Red

[ernknot]

I wish we had a few more logs like that dropped for us woodworkers, it's a shame to see them chipped ( if that is the case)
This jarrah is most likley destined for the outdoor patio furniture market and some for the professional woodworkers.
Why the hell would you ship a log like that to Tassie to chip?
I reckon red b is one of those tree sitters with nothing better to do than stir the pot.
Bugger off and go live with your quokkas, you are of the same mind.

[BobL]

Red_B

I did not raise the green house cred in my post. My post profers that there is a lot of concern about all parts of the planet from people from other parts of the planet who don't even know "where is" and know even less about what actually goes on there.

I have looked at the save aracadia forest site. Tk is turkey. As a moderately savy web surfer I would immediately ask why turkey? What's wrong with supporting local WA web providers? Double standards at play perhaps or something to hide? There are some uncaptioned photos of people standing around looking at trees but there is not a single name for any individual from SAFE - why?. The site appears to be a collection of comment, newleases from a group called SAFE (Who are they?) and personal interpretations. They claim that 15 quokkas exist in that forest but who has seen them. ie "Who are they"? I would rate the site 3/10 for credibility and tell my students to ignore that site.

Your continuing association between quokkas and Jarrah is still far from convincing. You are making associations that cannot be substantiated.

Once again from the CALM website:

STATUS AND DISTRIBUTION: Once very common in areas such as the Swan Coastal Plain near Perth and Gingin, quokkas are now uncommon on the mainland and confined to isolated pockets within the south-west corner of WA. They are, however, found at Dwellingup, Jarrahdale, Harvey and Collie, in Stirling Range National Park and along the South Coast to Two Peoples Bay. They occur in large numbers on Rottnest Island, near Perth, and Bald Island, east of Albany.

Sure jarrah grows at some of those places but it also grows elsewhere (even more intensely - but no quokkas!) and jarrah does not grow on Rottnest or Bald Island where they thrive. In other words Quokka's do not need jarrah.

Let me just reitterate that I don't support wholesale woodchipping or people that register on forums and sprout things that cannot be substantiated.

[Bleedin Thumb]

Red_B

They claim that 15 quokkas exist in that forest but who has seen them. ie "Who are they"?
Take a good look at the web site it clearly states CALM as the people who did the survey,
In July 2005 the government department in charge of protecting quokka - Department of Conservation and Land Management (CALM), trapped several quokka while conducting an animal survey in the ffice:smarttags" />lace>Arcadialace>ity> forest 30kms east of Bunbury. This small colony was said to have numbered about 15 animals. CALM then set about putting in a quokka management plan to protect their habitat from fox predation, fire, and forest habitat destruction. This included dropping poison kangaroo baits to help keep fox numbers down, but according to mammal experts, this plan is failing to increase quokka numbers. fficeffice" />>>
Fast-forward to 2006, and we find that ity>lace>Arcadialace>ity> forest is now to be logged to supply logs to Tasmanian timber giant Gunns, and the Japanese owned silicon smelter at Kemerton.>>
Conservationists from the Save Arcadia Forest Ecosystem (SAFE) are now appealing to the state Minister for the Environment, Mark McGowan to suspend logging operations in ity>lace>Arcadialace>ity> until more scientific data is collected on the rare quokka, including their habitat
>>
Your continuing association between quokkas and Jarrah is still far from convincing. You are making associations that cannot be substantiated.

.

The quokka may not be dependent on the Jarrah as in some sort of symbiotic relationship but it is sure as hell dependent on its environment and if you log those habitates you are putting the population at risk.

The ideological camps are
1. We need the immediate income that logging Arcadia forest will produce or
2. We think that it is more valuable to protect this endangered species.
Personally I think maintaining the worlds biodiversity is hugely important and whilst I also see the need for a robust economy I think that destroying an endangered species habitat for $5 per tonne is criminal.

I also respect other peoples view if RedB has done nothing else he's let some people here vent their spleens
PS Sorry BobL for getting you quote stuffed up.

[Lignum]

The quokka may not be dependent on the Jarrah as in some sort of symbiotic relationship but it is sure as hell dependent on its environment and if you log those habitates you are putting the population at risk.

.

What a Quokkash!t. I lived in Dwellinup for a few years and NEVER once seen a quoakka apart from the weekly copies in the newsagent. redB has told us he has never been over their so whats he on about with all this Quokkacrap. He is just a sh!tst!rrer Troll with nothing beter to do than cause trouble

[Doughboy]

Dont all you sandgropers play quokka sokka?

I went to Rottnest Island and had the dubious honour if meeting them there. Interesting, cute, or a pain in the backside I am not sure but they deserve to be looked after. Not sure why though

Pete

[Lignum]

I went to Rottnest Island and had the dubious honour if meeting them there. Interesting, cute, or a pain in the backside I am not sure but they deserve to be looked after. Not sure why though

Pete

Thats why they dont log on Rotto, to protect the Quokka and the pizzed tourists

[Waldo]

He is just a sh!tst!rrer Troll with nothing beter to do than cause trouble

G'day,

Totally agree with you Lignum and thanks for backing me up earlier.

I'd like Red B to answer a question for me. Why have you joined this Forum? :confused:

Me personally, to learn as much as I can from the people who visit here, to share ideas and as an extension of this I've had the pleasure to meet with some of the blokes here who have offered help and advice on a number of things. I also joined this Forum to give some help to others from the little bit that I do know.

[Bleedin Thumb]

What a Quokkash!t. I lived in Dwellinup for a few years and NEVER once seen a quoakka apart from the weekly copies in the newsagent. redB has told us he has never been over their so whats he on about with all this Quokkacrap. He is just a sh!tst!rrer Troll with nothing beter to do than cause trouble

Hi Lignum,
When I said its environment I was refering to the quokka' environment not the Jarrahs.
We are all dependent on our environment .... even you and funny thing is that the poor old quokka is dependant on you for its survival

Poor bloody things got no chance!!!!

[Lignum]

Bleedin Ill tell you one thing that is FACT. More Quokkas are hurt on Rotto by idiots than any tree falling over in the forests of the south west