ABS Releases more useless Stats

[AlexS]

I disagree with most of what Dazzler has to say on this topic, but I can't see that he's said anything racist.

[Driver]

I agree with Alex and a couple of the others. Dazzler hasn't said anything racist.

Metal Head, you should be careful about citing Akermanis as an exemplar of freedom of speech. Most of what he says is designed to be deliberately provocative for no other reason than to stir up controversy. It's an old and tired excuse to justify a personal attack on the grounds that you're just expressing yourself freely. Samuel Johnson said: "Patriotism is the last refuge of a scoundrel". He might equally have included people who use freedom of speech as an excuse for personal insults.

You're playing the man, not the ball. Accusing someone of racism without any real evidence is a nasty tactic. I can understand why Dazzler is demanding that you justify yourself. I reckon he's being very restrained. If you had accused me of racism in similar circumstances, I'd be a lot more outspoken.

[bitingmidge]

Oh come on you guys!! Open your eyes!!!

Let india deal with it?.

He didn't put a capital "I" in India!! Surely that's obvious to someone other than MH and I!!


P

[dazzler]

Heres Dazzler spreading hate amongst the world;

Here he is handing out presents laced with smallpox

Attachment 52593

Wheeling a drum of anthrax towards the local well

Attachment 52594

Injecting acid into this kids eye

Attachment 52595

Operation Racism - a complete succes

Attachment 52596

[SPIRIT]

Back to the house thingy, I blame the government (alright I always do).
Well the government and the banks.

First home buyers grant......what a joke.
No deposit finance.............get real.
Baby bonus............What for?

Must admit I never got any of these handouts so I may be a lttle jealous too.

But seriously i think that when the next credit squeeze comes around...you know the recession we have to have...18% interest rates etc... there is going to be record numbers of casualties.

I think that it is best to be prepared for this situation by compromising your bank manager and letting them know you are not afraid of publishing the photos.

have cash in the bank and wait ,then jump into the house market when it is low sell when it goes up ,easy

stop buying junk you don't need CDs,new computors ,cars ,TV the size of a whole wall,smokeing ,drinking ,new cloths every year ,lunches ,cups of coffie for $3 wait to you get hope and have one for 5 cents,it all adds up

Metalhead just say sorry

[ian]

From the SMH:

On the day when a Reserve Bank meeting is expected to raise interest rates, new statistics reveal thousands are paying off loans on houses that are too big for them.

The ABS found that between 1994 and 2004, the average number people per household dropped from 2.7 to 2.5, but the average number of bedrooms had risen from 2.9 to 3.

In 2003-04, 77 per cent of households had one or more spare bedrooms and nearly all (97 per cent) of couple-only households had one or more spare bedrooms. At least 85 per cent of solo dwellers also had empty bedrooms in their homes.

By tying it to interest rates, what they are trying to say here is that people are foolishly paying off huge mortgages on bedrooms they don't need.

Don't any of these people have family or friends that live interstate/overseas who come to visit? Don't they have friends who like to come over for a few drinks and stay the night? Don't they have old computers/toys/boxes of junk to store?

I mean, if you took any notice of these pointy heads, where would the childless couple who don't want to live in an apartment block find a house with one bedroom? What about the young couple buying into the housing market and planning a family in a few year's time - are they supposed to live in a flat until the first baby comes along?

It's the weakest excuse for a story I've heard today!

To go back to Silent's original observation...

the ABS is talking averages, so 2.5 people per household translates to a street where every odd numbered house contains a couple with no kids and every even numbered house a couple with 1 kid. At 3 bedrooms per house this means that the couple with the kid have a spare room for the grand parents to stay in when they drop in from 2 suburbs away, while the couple with no kids can accomodate at least 6 drunken friends (including the 2 who crashed on the lounge)

all a bit silly really when you talk averages.

more likely the hypothetical street has families like Wongo's (4 people 4 bedrooms); mine (3 people, 3 bed rooms – one of which is used as a study); my neighbour to the left (1 person, 3 bedrooms hasn't had a house guest in the 14 years we've been neighbours); neighbour to the right (mum plus 1 kid, 3 bedrooms one used as a study); guy across the road (dad plus 3 kids in 3 bedrooms); my in-laws (3 adults, 4 bedrooms);

in other words lots of permutations.

when you look more closely at the demographics,
"couple with no kids" is more likley to represent a couple with adult kids who have left home than a young couple who have yet to start a family.


as to huge unnecessary mortages, 20 years ago it was fairly common for the developer of a new suburb to place a covenant on all the blocks requiring that all the houses to be some minimum size — the unstated purpose was to keep out the "riff raff" only professionals (and plumbers!) would be able to afford to buy and build there. The option of starting with a two bedroom cottage which could be extended as the family came along was not an option. I have no evidence that this practice doesn't continue to this day.


ian

[bitingmidge]

I have no evidence that this practice doesn't continue to this day.

Like you have no evidence that there is no God you mean?

If I sent you details on say twenty new estates which did not have covenants, would that be evidence?

Of course some do have minimum size requirements, but they aren't in first home buyer territory, and it would be a rare house indeed that would be built to the minimum size requirement.

The size is driven by the market ie the purchaser demand and no one else!

Sad, isn't it?

P

[dazzler]

I reckon canberra is a great city to look at to see how small houses were in the 1920' and 30's and gradually got bigger.

Ainslie is one of the hot suburbs ATM and most are ex govt homes of about 9sq with 2 beds.

Dont think they had plasmas though

[ian]

If I sent you details on say twenty new estates which did not have covenants, would that be evidence?

if the estates are on Sydney's fringe, yes
I'm also equating a covenant with those situations where the developer will sell you the block but you must pick your house from one of these 8 options

Of course some do have minimum size requirements, but they aren't in first home buyer territory, and it would be a rare house indeed that would be built to the minimum size requirement.

funny thing about "new housing" estates in Sydney, especially in the North-west, a lot of buyers are trading up into their 2nd or 3rd home.

The size is driven by the market ie the purchaser demand and no one else!

Sad, isn't it?

yes it's sad how people MUST have a house that is soo like their neighbours


ian

[Metal Head]

Your not getting off the hook that easy old son.

Maybe it means nothing to you to throw the racist tag. I dont like it.

So once again. Show me the evidence that I did not like the guy because of his colour or that he is an indian.

Prove it.

You sound like Jack Wilson (aka Jack Palance) in Shane. "Go on Shane (Alan Ladd) PROVE IT" and he did. They don't make them like they use to.

It appears to have been a problem in the NSW police force and may well still be but on a smaller scale

Racist attitudes in the community

The Hon. P. F. O'GRADY - One place to start, and one that would certainly please many Koori leaders, is the Police Service. Attitudes recently exhibited by some members of the Police Service are a disgrace. They deserve the greatest condemnation, but they are only a fraction of a much wider problem. For many non-white groups, especially Kooris, the police are a constant presence in their lives. When one reads what has been said in many thousands of pages of reports, both State and Federal, during the past few years, one learns that simply being an Aborigine in New South Wales means that one is a target of the police. I cite as one example of that the Koori people who were travelling in a nice red car in Redfern earlier this month and were pulled over by police. The police admitted that they suspected the car was stolen because they were not used to Koori people driving such cars.

It must be hard Sgt Dazzler working with colleagues who are racists?. I was bought up in an area that was a mixture of people from the West Indies, Pakistan, India etc I used to get my head & body punched occassionally because I had coloured friends so I know what it is like dealing with WHITE "HONKEY TONKS" - white trash. However, I also know there is god & bad people in every race on this Earth.

[Ashore]

"Go on Shane (Alan Ladd) PROVE IT" They don't make them like they use to.
You are Right for once this is also the movie where the line " A mans gotta do what a mans gotta do " is spoken never spoken by John Wayne I might add.


that simply being an Aborigine in New South Wales means that one is a target of the police. I cite as one example of that the Koori people who were travelling in a nice red car in Redfern earlier this month and were pulled over by police. The police admitted that they suspected the car was stolen because they were not used to Koori people driving such cars.

Long Bow and you Quote one case which you base your arguement that all police have racist tendencies,

My BIL an ambo when stationed in sydney could not attend a call in redfern unless they had a police escort due to the FACT that while attending people ambulances were attacked and looted and one almost turned over .

what were their names and if this did happen, and is not another urban myth I will happly go with them to lodge their comlaint though I fear you cannot name the individuals .

It must be hard Sgt Dazzler working with colleagues who are racists?. However, I also know there is god & bad people in every race on this Earth.
What a statement and I quote
there is god & bad people in every race on this Earth
When have you ever heard anyone on this forum make a claim that there is not.
Mate get it together you seem to think that because Dazzler is was a cop then he's racist , because he expresses his views and experiances that he is wrong.
Metal Head I have stayed out of a few discussions that have happened recently but I felt the need to respond to this one you in my opinion have overstepped the mark by using an unwarented slur calling Dazzler a Racist and you owe an apology

[bitingmidge]

funny thing about "new housing" estates in Sydney, especially in the North-west, a lot of buyers are trading up into their 2nd or 3rd home.

Not funny, just reinforces my view that it's the buyers driving the market.

People tend to forget, if buyers didn't want a product, it wouldn't exist.

What happens historically in areas with covenants, is that they covenant is soon dropped when the market turns. They are nothing more than a marketing tool, to attract like buyers!

Cheers,

P

[Honorary Bloke]

The size is driven by the market ie the purchaser demand and no one else!

Sad, isn't it?

P

Absolutely true, Midge. But why does the free market make you sad?

[bitingmidge]

It must be hard Sgt Dazzler working with colleagues who are racists?.

Wake up to yourself MH! Whatever we believe we all have colleagues who are racist in some form or other, being an (ex) copper doesn't make Dazzler any different to the rest of us. We'd be stupid to think that there weren't one or two police in NSW who didn't hold prejudices, but then we'd be stupid to think that one or two people on this board didn't as well. Dazzler just hasn't done anything to indicate he's one of them.

Maybe you were flogged because your attitude was misread, just as I think (hope) it has been here.

The racist card is one of the easiest and most gutless ones to play if one is looking to distract one from the real issue in debate.

I know some kids who were pulled over in a green car the other night, just because they were having fun. Maybe Dazzler's a party pooper too!

cheers,

P

[HappyHammer]

I was bought up in an area that was a mixture of people from the West Indies, Pakistan, India etc .

We must have lived on the same street except where I was bought up we had Bangladeshi as well. We also had the best Indian restaurants in the world. I know irrelevant but I miss the food.

HH.