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Thread: Blacksmith supplies
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9th October 2014, 01:27 PM #31Member
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9th October 2014, 07:09 PM #32
No, that is the one advertising on Gumtree, made in Victoria, see post above.
And in relation to those photos, the owner told me the photos are for illustration only (well what is a photo for right?) and that he does not cast them with side shelf. There are some drawings on that ad that show the pattern.
A bit of a disappointment for me since I like the side shelf. I used the side shelf when I was an apprendice at age 15 yet never owned an anvil with one.
As far as that auction in WA, that is a collector that has been hoarding anvils for years. Don't expect a bargain though.“We often contradict an opinion for no other reason
than that we do not like the tone in which it is expressed.”
Friedrich Nietzsche
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9th October 2014, 11:32 PM #33Member
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Mon De Lany anvil on Ebay
Still looking for an Anvil just missed out on one on EBay I bid up to $680, I emailed a seller about another on EBay and it looks like they are from the Mont De Lancy forge in Wandin and Melbourne http://www.blacksmithing.com.au/forsale.html , advertised also on EBay http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/121448748...84.m1423.l2649
the answer I got back from them is;
"It is made of cast alloysteel, not cast iron, and are toughened as they cool, but not heat treaded. Wedo not have as specific hardness rating but will suit hot working steel, and wehave never had one crack".
Could I get some comment this I thought Cast Steel was the material best suited
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10th October 2014, 07:32 AM #34
Ask what sort of steel they use. Modern anvils are cast tool steel like 41xx chrome molybdenum or 51xx chrome nickel they have different qualities, can be flame hardened and are certainly better than the old way of cast iron with a plate welded on top. I could never understand why someone would pay the cost of a new anvil for an old beaten up cast iron with a plate.
I once bought an anvil from Dough slack's foundry. They used to make anvils for the mines. they were not heat treated yet hard enough for rough work as required by mines.
I got it flame hardened by Gearco in sydney and it is a decent anvil and did not get any dings from my hammer. The Victoria anvil is 4140 I am told and hardened to 51 hrc. If that is enough, I am not qualified to comment. Europeans manufacturers go higher to 59 or so. If that is a significant difference or not, again I do not know.
It all comes down to money. You want an anvil that has a good rebound and obviously can not get damaged by a missed blow with a hammer. You choose the weight of your anvil according to the size of your work and the max weight of the hammer you are likely to use. There is a 3/100 rule doing the rounds yet I doubt that can be taken to the letter. After all you can have a second blacksmith with a 5 k sledge hammer on a 100 k anvil and the blow will be cushioned by the hot iron and not the anvil ... anyway that is another debate .
And finally you choose the shape of the anvil according to either your experience or your taste. I learned to work an a Swedish anvil with two horns, so I am biased. I notice that in Sydney it is all single horn with a step. I am lost without a smooth surface and have no use for the step in front of the round horn. Furthermore I think a round horn should be round not some mysterious oval shape like the claw of an alien creature, but hey, don't go quoting me, that is just my idea of the tool I like.
if you want to know my opinion that by no means is the only one, nor academic certainty, I think that for ornamental blacksmithing you need something over 70 kilos, with two horns and possibly with a side shelf. If you can get a bargain (meaning half price from new) you can gamble on an older anvil considering you will not work on it 40 hours a week. If not, bite the bullet and buy a new one from a reputable manufacturer.
New unknown manufacturers offering products no one knows nor used, are just that... another toss a coin and hope for the best. May be they are really good. I don't know, never seen them never used them nor do I know anyone that has.
If I were to manufacture a tool I would go to great lengths to present it to those more likely to buy them and turn up at shows with them.“We often contradict an opinion for no other reason
than that we do not like the tone in which it is expressed.”
Friedrich Nietzsche
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10th October 2014, 09:16 AM #35
I was at a life time working blacksmiths the other day getting a tour of his work shop. He has a Mont de lancey anvil and demonstrated how if you his it square on with the face of the hammer it was fine, if you slightly miss hit and got the edge of the face it put a dent and it do right in front of me. Same risk with a peen. The major problem he has is with smiths who try to taper (draw down) a bar in the middle of the anvil face not over the edge and put plenty of dings in it as a result. He also has several anvils that are just large chunks of suitable steel, bisplate and duraflex. These he thinks work better.
Based on the above I think the anvil in question would be functional as long as you watch your hammer work and take reasonable care with it. If you want something to bash on that can take the abuse and not show it get a block of steel from a scrap yard. Plenty of smiths in the world have and still do use a rock for an anvil.…..Live a Quiet Life & Work with your Hands
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10th October 2014, 09:22 AM #36Member
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I think at this time I'm going to keep looking and settle on a chunk of rail track or large billet. One will come along soon enough I'm sure, thanks for the comments all helpful.
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10th October 2014, 10:01 AM #37
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10th October 2014, 10:26 AM #38Member
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10th October 2014, 10:32 PM #39
An anvil that is not flame hardened is an unfinished anvil. It is not a problem to take it for heat treatment. It will cost a few hundred dollars. Better to do that than to fret over each missed hammer blow I think. As far as using a rock ... well ... what can I say? If you talk to someone that is into woodwork, he will happily spend thousands on the latest drop saw, cordless tools, boffin style planes you name it. When it comes to blacksmithing for some reason unknown to me, everyone is thinking 3 centuries back. No one would think in making wooden planks by digging a hole in the ground and sawing a tree trunk with a two man saw. Well almost no one ...
Blacksmithing be it for fun or for profit is a trade and as such has evolved from the time of the caves. Yes, it can still be done the old way. I don't see the fun nor the advantage in doing it the hard way. I use stick or MIG when necessary, I have at least 10 different grinders, electric pedestal drill (not one with a pedal) cold saw, plasma cutter and plan to install a cad cutting table with its robot and computer to cut out silhouettes that I can later mold in the forge and on the anvil. Not for the purist? Perhaps, but I don't really care. My master had a german forge with a blower attached to a pedal like the old sewing machines and also a "portable" wheel grinder that was a contraption he made with a motor on a rotating platform attached to a flexible shaft and felt guilty for using them. He used a stick welder and ready made rivets red faced. He thought he was cheating by using those tools. Beats me.“We often contradict an opinion for no other reason
than that we do not like the tone in which it is expressed.”
Friedrich Nietzsche
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10th October 2014, 11:10 PM #40Member
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11th October 2014, 07:22 AM #41
Very nice picture and nice memories. Where is that?
My wife grew up next to a blacksmith who made horseshoes and gates hardware day in day out. He did not even have a shed and worked under a tree. His forge had a hand actioned billow and his pay must have been a pittance. Different centuries.
Who knows why the blacksmith workshop is dark?“We often contradict an opinion for no other reason
than that we do not like the tone in which it is expressed.”
Friedrich Nietzsche
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11th October 2014, 09:34 AM #42Senior Member
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...why smithys are dark.
Hi all. A dimly lit workshop lets you see forging and even tempering colours better. The major challenge with outdoor demonstrating is the bright sunlight- it is so easy to burn a job in the forge, also to belt away at a job that is too cold- very difficult to differentiate in bright light.
hope that helps,
Andrew.'Waratah' spring hammer by Hands & Scott c.1911- 20, 'Duffy, Todd & Williams' spring hammer c.1920, Premo lathe- 1953, Premo filing machine.
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11th October 2014, 10:25 AM #43Member
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11th October 2014, 11:03 PM #44
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12th October 2014, 07:45 AM #45“We often contradict an opinion for no other reason
than that we do not like the tone in which it is expressed.”
Friedrich Nietzsche