Future of the Australian Electricity Market

[NeilS]

8. Any mis-hap is potentially more serious than at any other type of power plant (with the possible exception of a storage dam failing at a hydro plant)
9. Nobody has found a satisfactory solution to the disposal of the spent nuclear fuel.

I know that my BiL, who is a geophysicist and earthquake specialist, has been involved with both the geo-engineering for nuclear plants and also dams. The large water supply storage dams, many of which were sited over a century ago in areas that now have large populations downstream, are probably more of a concern.

The hydro dams are mostly located in more remote areas away from population centre. The Warragamba & Wivenhoe (that are both supply and hydro) are the exception there. See hydro location map in following link...

Hydro Power Stations in Australia | State Guide - Canstar Blue


South Australia, which has the largest uranium deposit in the world, is the state that is most likely to go down the nuclear path for various reasons. However, we are also the state that has gone the furthest down the renewables path.

I don't think we are going to see anything more here than us taking back the spent nuclear fuel for storage from the customers that buy our uranium, plus a few nuclear subs docked down at the port, along with whatever that might entail.

Nuclear industry in South Australia - Wikipedia

[Bushmiller]

South Australia, which has the largest uranium deposit in the world, is the state that is most likely to go down the nuclear path for various reasons. However, we are also the state that has gone the furthest down the renewables path.

Neil

That is an interesting juxtaposition, which under the right circumstances could pose the perfect solution to resolving greenhouse warming from burning fossil fuels. However, for the moment, I don't see it figuring in realistic outcomes.



Regards
Paul

[woodPixel]

Pebble-bed reactor - Wikipedia

China's high temperature reactor - pebble bed modular (HTR-PM) achieves its first criticality - Atomic Insights

China puts pioneering '''pebble bed''' nuclear reactor into operation | Reuters

[woodPixel]

https://twitter.com/DrSimEvans/statu...77349669769219

China just built more offshore wind capacity, in 2021 alone, than the rest of the world had managed in the last 5yrs put together

Its 26GW now accounts for half of the world's 54GW total

Also, it added twice as much in 2021 as IEA had forecast in…December 2021

1.png 2.png

[Bushmiller]

Pebble-bed reactor - Wikipedia

China's high temperature reactor - pebble bed modular (HTR-PM) achieves its first criticality - Atomic Insights

China puts pioneering '''pebble bed''' nuclear reactor into operation | Reuters

WP

Thanks for the links. From reading it seems that the few current installations are pilot plants and the Chinese are pretty good at promoting these even when they are not really viable (Carbon Capture plants are a good example of this). However, I have no information on how commercially viable Pebble Bed Reactors are.

One problem I do foresee from the Wikipedia link is this:


"Waste handling[edit]Since the fuel is contained in graphite pebbles, the volume of radioactive waste is much greater, but contains about the same radioactivity when measured in becquerels per kilowatt-hour. The waste tends to be less hazardous and simpler to handle.^{[citation needed]} Current US legislation requires all waste to be safely contained, therefore pebble-bed reactors would increase existing storage problems. Defects in the production of pebbles may also cause problems. The radioactive waste must either be safely stored for many human generations, typically in a deep geological repository, reprocessed, transmuted in a different type of reactor, or disposed of by some other alternative method yet to be devised. The graphite pebbles are more difficult to reprocess due to their construction,^{[citation needed]} which is not true of the fuel from other types of reactors.^[ci"


In other words, the perennial problem of waste disposal.

Regards
Paul

[Bushmiller]

https://twitter.com/DrSimEvans/statu...77349669769219



1.png 2.png

WP

That is impressive by any standards. Maybe something to do with the single-minded, dictatorial regime, their own resources and a population that is four to five times the size of the largest Western nation.

Regards
Paul

[Chris Parks]

Some stats that come out of China are just mind blowing, a bit off topic but interesting is they build more than 5,000 electric buses a MONTH.

[BobL]

WP

That is impressive by any standards. Maybe something to do with the single-minded, dictatorial regime, . . . . . . . l

Reminds me of a dinner I attended in Beijing in 2005 hosted by a Chinese Govt ministry. There were 30 or so internationals and we were spread about 2 or so per table across about 15 tables. Each table seated 8-10 people so the remainder at each table were chinese. It was all very friendly and there was lots of drinking and fantastic food. I sat next to young Chinese guy who wore black jeans, T-shirt and a black dinner jacket sans tie, ie fairly trendy. He was constantly on his mobile, often speaking excellent english. At one point the table was discussing various forms of Government and the young bloke chipped in. "Democracy is fine but if you want to get something done then a single party state is much better, if we decide to do something we can start it today".

[Glider]

Singapore has voted the same party into power since its break from Malaysia and they certainly get things done. The question in Australia is which team is worthy? IMO, none of them.

Alan Finkel's recent Quarterly essay about the transition to sustainable energy answered a lot of questions for me. It's remarkably well written.

mick

[Bushmiller]

I saw a headline:

Nuclear fusion breakthrough opens door to clean and near limitless energy

and thought to myself, could they have cracked it?

Eh...No, not quite

This is an exert from the article linked above and highlights the incredible hurdle that has to be overcome for this technology to become feasible:

"Temperatures of more than 100 million Celsius are required to fuse together atomic nuclei and generate the release of energy. No material on earth can withstand direct exposure to such high levels of heat.

Because of this, the JET scientists have constructed a doughnut-shaped magnetic field that holds in place the fusion reaction’s “fuel” – the hydrogen atoms deuterium and tritium – which goes on to form a highly ionised cloud of gas called plasma."

Regards
Paul

[NeilS]

I saw a headline:

Nuclear fusion breakthrough opens door to clean and near limitless energy

and thought to myself, could they have cracked it?

Eh...No, not quite

And, it isn't a new problem they are trying to solve. My FiL, who was a plasma physicist, was working on the 'magnetic bottle' problem over 50yrs ago. Perhaps it will be another half century before fusion becomes a practical solution for abundant clean and cheap energy, a little too late for net zero in 2050.

[woodPixel]

Nope. Its solved.

The 5 second wind up was proof of concept.

The magnetic constraints are uncooled copper so they overheat very quickly. This was known.

A 5 second operation proves it works. They could have run it for 5 minutes, 5 hours or 5 days. The reaction was sustainable.

The ITER overcomes the magnetic cooling issue by using ... cooling


I've been following ITER very closely and this is very exciting news. Its as good as done.

ITER will be a colossal win for all of us.



Once ITER starts pumping, the designs will be flicked out and everyone will want a few

Very exciting!



EDIT - What wasnt included in the OPs MSN link was the video! It is awesome.... turn up the sound!

https://www.bbc.com/news/av-embeds/60312634

[BobL]

I forget how many "fusion breakthru" seminars/lectures etc I attended over 40 years on this topic when I was working, and I still I reckon I'll be long gone off this planet before anything useful comes out of fusion power. Its obvious scientists will always keep saying positive things about their research- its' so they can get more money for their pet projects. It's a game we all encouraged to played at work - this thing is bigger than sliced bread Yada Yada . . . . ..

FWIW I hope it never works because IMHO like any centralised power (political or electrical power) its inherently evil in that it favours bureaucrats and cashed up fat cats.

I'll be interested when they make a fusion reactor that is about the size of a small rubbish bin and runs off banana skins and long life milk cartons.

[woodPixel]

I'll be interested when they make a fusion reactor that is about the size of a small rubbish bin and runs off banana skins and long life milk cartons.

[woodPixel]

What is renewable energy curtailment and how does it affect rooftop solar? - ABC News

A Good read.

Now, if ONLY there were a way to store all that cheap excess/generated electricity to be sold off when its expensive.....