From the daughter of a Soldier.

[bennylaird]

What sort of man can climb out of a trench into devastating machine gun fire so as not to let his mates down? Maybe that's why we respect the ANZAC legend?

[silentC]

I think there are several sides to that story. The one we like to remember is the story of bravery and comradeship. That's a good story to remember and it makes us proud of them.

One of the other sides was revealed to me when I read the diary of a great grandfather of an ex-girlfriend. He was stationed in France at the front line and was basically ####ting himself the whole time. He was there for a few days and was sent out into no-man's land on reconnaissance and almost caught. He was expected to write down everything he saw but in the heat of the moment, he bolted and forgot everything. After about a week in the trench, the Germans launched a mustard gas attack and he spent most of the rest of his time there in the military hospital while they shoved wires up his nose (he never explained why) and in excruciating pain. They sent him back eventually and he got hit by some shrapnel and was eventually sent back home.

He talked about the young blokes crying in the trenches, didn't say whether he did or not. It was very matter of fact and unemotional, but then he was only 17 at the time.

[bennylaird]

Like I said what sort of man (woman) can go through it all. To follow insane instructions from command. Bravery? Madness? Just glad that my military service didn't put me in that situation. Vietnam vets have good reason to despise after the treatment they received on return. Conscripted and doing what was ordered only to be spat upon by peace activists using violence to get their points across??????

[namtrak]

I have my grandfathers diary from WW1. He spent a year around the Somme and wrote about it, on a regular basis. He was pretty phelgmatic about it all "copped one in the shoulder today, thought I was a gonna but met up with Jimmy Phillips and we followed a little dog to safety" etc He got a lot more excited about his days off out the back where they beat the Waikato 1st Regiment 5-0 in a game of Rugby, or got sloshed on some plonk he found etc

[bennylaird]

My Dads stories of the Middle East and New Guinea were mainly all the good times, very rarely mentioned any of the bad times. Some idiot asked him once if he saw any of his mates die. He was clearly not happy to recall such things...

[Studley 2436]

My experience is the same Benny

The vets I have known are happy to talk about funny things that happened, but never the fighting or killing. I did get to hear a story once though about one diggers patrol. He went on a march into the mountains of PNG armed with a mere 6 rounds of ammo! Shoot straight son *LOL* Anyway he came to a position above a harbour the Japanese were using and made a radio call to direct an air strike. There was a submarine that dived but after the raid he saw an oil slick come up. I've never never heard a guts and glory story I don't think it has ever been told by anyone who was there. They just don't do that.

In more recent times with the respect given to returned soldiers there are fakes around the place. I was at a bar once and one guy we were talking with was going on like he was the real deal so the other guy there said to him, as soldiers always do, which unit were you with. The first guy said I am not into those numbers and that. Well the second guy and I just turned our backs. Those unit numbers are like names and addresses to those in the military. They know them as they let them know who is who. Can get confusing to a civilian when they start talking such and such was there replaced by so and so. I can't keep up with the numbers myself but being a civilian that doesn't matter.

Anyway Richard I have to say the old Mirage IIIC flies the wings off of the FA-18. It is faster has a higher ceiling, better turning too. It doesn't have the same avionics and weapons systems and it can't carry nearly as much ordnance. It belongs to another time. War planes today are largely ordnance delivery devices. It is unlikely that planes will be close enough ever for them to explore their "dogfighting" abilities.

Studley

[bennylaird]

Never get in the way of a Mirage on approach, nose is so high they have to land blind, favorite exception was the nice procedural turn approach side slipping all the way in with a quick kick straight before touchdown.

We had an air trafficer who used to run up the control tower calling everyone to watch the Mirage on a flapless approach.......

(Mirages hvae no flaps, so every approach is flapless)

Hmmm lots of good memories rekindled and I don't think a RAAF Mirage ever fired a shot in anger at anyone?

Proud son of a 2/6 Battalion veteran..........................

[Andy Mac]

I'm reminded of an occasion at Adelaide Central Station, where a mate and I were on our first leave from RAAF rookies at Edinburgh, 1980. Straight into town, uniform on, looking very pleased with ourselves. We were having a coffee or something when this old digger came up to us, and with tears streaming down his face he let us have it, both barrels! "Think you're so bloody tough, you don't know the truth of military service ...etc!". We snuck away as he went on, but he must have had a tough time during the war, losing family or mates. We felt pretty sheepish though.
I too used to enjoy making aircraft models as a kid, Mosquito being a bit of a fave. I love that plywood technology with monster engines! And later enjoyed working on aircraft in the RAAF...the old F111 is an amazing bit of engineering still. It seems an unfortunate truth that war/military technology provides a great boost for technology generally, as it filters down.

Cheers,

[meerkat]

My Dads stories of the Middle East and New Guinea were mainly all the good times, very rarely mentioned any of the bad times. Some idiot asked him once if he saw any of his mates die. He was clearly not happy to recall such things...

You know, I've heard a guy in whatever they call the army cadets ask an Iraq vet if he ever saw dead people or the like. I was gob smacked but eventually put it down youth and inexperience.

I learnt early on not to ask vets about their tour(s). If they want to talk they will if not leave it be.

Ok now we are onto stories, my best memory of an F111 was when I was in Brisbane and an F111 did a fly by past our ship so close it wasn't funny. I was at attention for quite a while after that

[bennylaird]

Like this??

[bennylaird]

While at rookies I was marking along, (no such thing as walking...)
Saw a shadow flit past, then the earth shattering roar as 2 F111s went over me at low altitude. Not at attention, but time for a change of underwear......

[meerkat]

While at rookies I was marking along, (no such thing as walking...) ...

Marking along... better keep you away from our dog, between the two of you we'd get nowhere

and yep close

[silentC]

We were driving somewhere out near Wagga and we heard this rumble. What the F is that? Next thing these two F111s flew straight over the top of us, one behind the other. I swear the car lifted up on its suspension as they went past.

[Daddles]

We were driving somewhere out near Wagga and we heard this rumble. What the F is that? Next thing these two F111s flew straight over the top of us, one behind the other. I swear the car lifted up on its suspension as they went past.

You're lucky they flew OVER you. I was surveying out in country NSW and two of the sods came through BELOW us, following a gully at something like 'fence height plus a foot' (to be fair, we were in a bombing range and we were on top of a hill, but it was a very low hill and they were in a gully).

And as for Studley claiming the Mirage will outfly an FA18, well ... I must confess that my only exposure to them is at airshows, but I've been going to them for over thirty years. Mate, I've never seen a Mirage haul around the sky like an FA18 can - it's call brute force amongst anything else (the Mirage is one of the prettiest a/c ever). The incident I was referring to was with both a/c in the sky at the same time ... though it's possible they were asked to fake it, the difference was, let us say, dramatic. As for dogfighting being dead, are you telling me that Top Gun was just fiction :eek:

But we mustn't be too hard on politicians, there are some good ones, the cemetaries are full of good politicians. Bit like cats, my Dad comes into my house and always asks my Siamese - "haven't you become a good cat yet?"

Richard

[Auld Bassoon]

Driving through northern Germany heading east in the late seventies minding my own business when I noticed a couple of shadows flash past - then a humongous earth-shattering roar as I saw that two F104 Starfighters had passed just a couple of hundred meters overhead - then sat on their tails on went onto reheat. Cor!

Has just passed a USAF airbase. I guess they didn't need signs with that kind of show