Dying Everest Climber - What would you have done?

[Ianab]

I'm guessing the only thing that would have saved him would be to get him off the mountain.. and fast. Hypothermia + O2 deprivation, no way they were going to revive him up there.

If they had tried and got themselves killed (most likely outcome) we could at least say they died heros and the Mt would have racked up a couple more kills.

The fact that there were 40 people up there, and they all knew there was nothing they could do. It food for thought alright.

It's just not a sane place to be

Ian

[Wongo]

Richard has a very good point. Those bastards are on the way up so they must be well resourced. They have the courage and endurance to climb the mountain but don’t have the same to try to carry a 100kg down, 40 of them work as a team.:mad: What is the big deal climbing up the damn hill anyway?

To me it is not about “What can be done”. It is about what a normal human being should do. I am sure the “C’mon nothing can be done to save him, lets keep going” was a big incentive to them. They put their personal agenda before another human being and I don’t like it.:mad:

[Iain]

I hope they find themselves in a similar position in the very near future.

And knowing their past attitude would you leave them or assist??????
Another hypothetical can of worms.

[Wongo]

Hey silentC, 2 miners are lost 1 km underground for a few days now. I don’t think they will survivor. I am going home, do you want to go down there?

[CameronPotter]

And knowing their past attitude would you leave them or assist??????
Another hypothetical can of worms.

Iain,

Again, I would say that saving them would be the only decent thing to do. No way would I stop and judge someone in that situation. So far as I am concerned, not helping would be aiding in their deaths and I am not willing to aid in anyone's death, thanks very much.

[Metal Head]

Hi,

I assume none of the contributors on this thread (or belong to this site) were the ones (30+) who passed me last year when my car had broken down on a side road in country Victoria?. If people aren't prepared to aid someone in sunny conditions how could you expect them to stop in those cold conditions. This guy in question (Mark Inglis) who passed him had lost his legs due to frostbite in 1982.

Please click on this link below to read about his life

http://www.markinglis.co.nz/default2.asp

As he stated he was hoping to be the first double amputee to do this - he had spent 100's of hours training and spent thousands of $$$$$'s to do this. If he didn't do it this time then he may not get the opportunity to get his 15 minutes of fame!!. We can all sit here behind the computer in the warmth of our house and ostracize this guy and say we would have done the opposite. How could this guy throw him over his back (without proper legs & on uneven ground)?. Would you put your life in danger to save someone who had put his own life at risk because he didn't carry the correct equipment?.

What about the woman who was left to die in Sydney a few weeks ago and it was said afterwards that many people had seen her but chose to ignore her.

I was in the British forces for 6 years - and saw action to know that we were taught to get to the target and not to worry about injured colleagues (which was against my nature) as they would be taken care of by the follow up services. The motto was "YOU HAVE TO LOOK AFTER NUMBER ONE!!".

Regards
David

[silentC]

Mark Inglis wasn't on his own.

As he stated he was hoping to be the first double amputee to do this

Oh, well that's different then. Maybe all the people who passed you were trying to be the first ones to do something too.

BTW, people seem to assume that they would have been putting their lives at risk to help this guy. Not so. All they had to do was give him some of their oxygen and turn back.

he may not get the opportunity to get his 15 minutes of fame

Says it all, doesn't it?

[Wongo]

I assume none of the contributors on this thread (or belong to this site) were the ones (30+) who passed me last year when my car had broken down on a side road in country Victoria?.

Was your life at risk? Did you call NRMA?

If you were a helpless 60 yr old lady I will stop to help for sure, no sweat. Mind you if you wave to my car and you dont look like a murderer then I will stop too.

What about the woman who was left to die in Sydney a few weeks ago and it was said afterwards that many people had seen her but chose to ignore her.

And your point is?

he had spent 100's of hours training and spent thousands of $$$$$'s to do this. If he didn't do it this time then he may not get the opportunity to get his 15 minutes of fame

Fantastic




Bingo, this is my 2345th post.

[Iain]

Iain,

Again, I would say that saving them would be the only decent thing to do. No way would I stop and judge someone in that situation. So far as I am concerned, not helping would be aiding in their deaths and I am not willing to aid in anyone's death, thanks very much.

Read carefully grasshopper, that was not the question, I was merely raising someone elses point not quoting what I would do.

[Groggy]

Not enough information is available so it would make sense to rely on the judgement of 40 experienced climbers and guides.

Climbing Everest is not about climbing, it is about logistics, planning, endurance and practice. Practice because the environment is so extreme that everything a person does needs to be a reflex.

Most climbers die because relatively simple rules have been broken - failure to notify injuries or health problems earlier. Rushing out of camps to try to beat the weather before they have correctly acclimated to the altitude. Carrying insufficient oxygen, or failing to recognise excessive usage, takes out a few more. Mostly though, poorly prepared expeditions probably account for the majority.

What the report undoubtedly failed to mention is how many climbers die trying to improvise a rescue of a doomed climber.

Tough call, but the climbers all go up knowing the risks.

[Iain]

I was in the British forces for 6 years - and saw action to know that we were taught to get to the target and not to worry about injured colleagues (which was against my nature) as they would be taken care of by the follow up services. The motto was "YOU HAVE TO LOOK AFTER NUMBER ONE!!".

Regards
David

The point being?
This was not a combat area and the enemy are known to pick off anyone who stops to assist and rely upon the emotions of the colleagues of the fallen, but this has nothing whatsoever to do with a military or combat environment or exercise.

[silentC]

it would make sense to rely on the judgement of 40 experienced climbers and guides

How do you know they were experienced? They all paid their $75,000 to climb. Something tells me this issue has more to do with money than morals:

Mountain climbers are a significant source of tourist revenue for Nepal; they range from experienced mountaineers to relative novices who count on their paid guides to get them to the top. The Nepalese government also requires a permit from all prospective climbers; this carries a heavy fee.

Again, I'll rely on the assessments of Hillary and the scientist quoted in the paper. They could've saved him but for the desire to 'summit'.

[CameronPotter]

Read carefully grasshopper, that was not the question, I was merely raising someone elses point not quoting what I would do.

Don't worry,
I wasn't assuming that you were saying that you would let them die - I was simply answering your question.

You said:

And knowing their past attitude would you leave them or assist??????

I said:

I would say that saving them would be the only decent thing to do.

As for all of the other comments aboout not being resourced to save them...

If they were resourced well enough to get up and get back down again, surely they were well resourced enough to turn around and save one person... If there were 100 people all stuck up there, then you wouldn't have had the necessary oxygen/equipment etc to help them, but you could have saved one person.

I am with Silent, if the experts say it could have been done, then I probably agree. Out of interest, I don't know HEAPS about climbing, but I do know a little...

I reckon that it came down to money/fame/achievement. Shame that they didn't see saving someone's life as a bigger achievement.

Cam

[Iain]

I know nothing of climbing except on the roof on occassion, although I have climbed the Matterhorn in my younger days
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about 200 metres from the Rhine, more like a stroll through a paddock really

[CameronPotter]

about 200 metres from the Rhine, more like a stroll through a paddock really

Ahhh... But was it a steep paddock?