Plasma or LCD? Which home theatre??

[Driver]

I'm ready to be corrected (inevitable, probably by Driver) but the $2K diff is somewhere around a week's or more work after the Gov steals their tax.

Not biting, me old Bodger. I know nothing about this stuff. When it comes to TV, I'm just a viewer.

However, one thought does occur. The prices are still high while the technology is comparatively new (whether because of R & D costs, market conditions, competition or a combination of all these things). They will keep dropping as the technology matures and as manufacturing volumes increase (especially in China). I reckon they've probably got some way to go yet.

[dazzler]

Cripes. Tassie and Daz, why are you guys blatting on about cold, snow etc. I was out in it all day today. Shorts and bare top until about 4.30.

On Plasma v LCD. If you go to a reputable dealer in such things you'll find that LCD is the recommendation. Less heat, longer life, more reliable. I decided they were both still way over priced so spent my hard-earned on a very nice widescreen Loewe CRT. I couldn't be happier. It'll last about 10 years and buy that time we'll all be watching holograms. And I'll be too old to care.

Coz I'm Soft!

[Shedhand]

Coz I'm Soft!

Oops. I just remembered where you live. Does get cold up on the snow line. Unlike the sunny eastern shore...down by the beach...

[Gumby]

42" in size and above - definitely Plasma. They don't make plasmas under that anyway. The problem with larger LCDs is that they project fantastic still images but are not good at moving images, like watching the footy. It has slight tails on the image, like when you move a mouse across the computer screen, it leaves an image for a short time. Move the mouse around and you'll get the idea.

Plasma life is good if you get a Japanese made product. JVC, Panasonic etc. In 10 years you'll be changing over again anyway so why worry about screen life beyond that. Most will do 80,000 hours so they'l outlast their useful lifespan anyway.

Don't buy cheap !

Needless to say, we have a JVC 42" Plasma with Pioneer surround sound - bloody brillaint!

I don't like some of those projectors. A mate has one in a special theatre room but it's too big. You have to keep moving your head to watch it all and can't take in the whole screen at once. Kind of like watching tennis or sitting in the front row at the picture theatre.

[Glenn_M]

I went through all this about 8 months back before I decided. Like Sheddy says most good dealers seem to recommend LCD over plasma because of heat related issues. I couldn't afford the size LCD I wanted with the refresh rate I wanted so looked elsewhere.

I was looking to spend a bit less than you and wanted to view HDTV as well. Given that most of the plasma's in my price range were about 480 vertical pixels this is less than SDTV or HDTV therefore (in my opinion) the digital signals rescaled to the plasma resolution did not look so good.

In the end I got a Hitachi LCD widescreen home theatre projector and a 82 inch screen for movies. Watching the news etc and the kids viewing still done on the panasonic CRT.

The Hitachi is one of the new breed of HT projectors and doesn't suffer from the requirement for darkened rooms like Ashore mentioned (which was certainly a problem with earlier projectors) As long as the screen doesn't get direct sunlight (mine doesn't) all is good. No problem watching during the day although there is no doubt the picture is better with the curtains closed or at night.

Replacement bulbs about $350 but I've not needed one yet (touch wood).

All in all I'd say consider what you want the gear for (for us it was movies and sport) and look around to see what looks best for you. For any projection (front or rear) the LCD vs DLP issue is a personal choice rather than anything else.

Get what works best for you.

Cheers and happy viewing!

[woodbe]

I don't like some of those projectors. A mate has one in a special theatre room but it's too big. You have to keep moving your head to watch it all and can't take in the whole screen at once. Kind of like watching tennis or sitting in the front row at the picture theatre.

Yes. that's a good clue.

You have to size the projected image so that the closest seats are 1.5x screen width away from the screen, otherwise people go batty trying to keep up with the action. (people with 20/20 eyesight will probably see pixels if they are too close as well)

In some rooms without a lot of depth, that means you have to reduce the image size.

Just goes to show that if you don't take the time to research what you are doing, or buy from the wrong joint, you can land up with an expensive but less than optimal solution..

woodbe.

[Bodgy]

The cost of LCD is also coming down and a war between LCD and plasma is starting, which is the reason for the Plasma price drop, not the R&D being paid off- Marketing runs pricing in the retail market, not the accounts department

Bob, don't want to get into a shizt fignht, but you are only partly correct.

The price remains high until the original R&D costs and the tooling costs are mitigated, and the initial low volumes pick up. Once this is complete and the 'early adopters' have run out, then you are absolutely correct - marketing sets the margin. But not, to any great extent, at the beginning of the product life cycle.

Beginning of the curve is cost plus, the remainder is at market. Hence, in nearly all high tech product the price is set high originally, drops slightly then plateaus, and then progressively drops as the volumes rise and then bottoms out as it becomes a commodity.

In my view, plasma and LCD have not yet reached commodity status in Oz. In the US (the serious volume market) plasma is priced around 60% of what we pay, even at the Fling Slee level.

[Harry72]

"The problem with larger LCDs is that they project fantastic still images but are not good at moving images, like watching the footy. It has slight tails on the image, like when you move a mouse across the computer screen, it leaves an image for a short time. Move the mouse around and you'll get the idea."

Maybe on older first gen LCD's but not now, I got a large 24" LCD(Dell) on me pooter which I use for gaming... no image lag, PC games are way faster in complex fast moving images than any footy game!

Tazzy, I reckon with $8k to spend you could get a lcd/plazma and get a HT projector plus a hard drive TSbox with a small 5.1/dts sound system.

[Spelunx]

Hardly Normal has a Yamaha package just under $1k - looks ok, nice speakers etc.

Dennis

Hey Deninis.

It looks like you have some good advice re: plasma vs LCD, so I will concentrate on the above.

Do you already have an amp? or are you purchasing the amp and speakers? Do you listen to music at all? or is it purely for home theater?

In general, brands that make amps (Yamaha, Denon, etc) make really crappy speakers. The best speakers manufacturers make only speakers. That doesn't mean to have to spend a fortune, there are some excellent buys out there. I would generally advise not to go to the mass-market places like Hardley Normals, you will get mass-market gear and mass-market advice. In your price bracket, I would be turning to the specialist Hi-fi places for advice. Getting the right balance between the speakers is vital for good home theater.

Seeing as this is a woodwork website, there are a couple of good DIY speaker places on-line that are excellent value for money.

If you are interested, give me some more info, and I'll give you the best advice I can.

Cheers

[TassieKiwi]

Hey Deninis.


Do you already have an amp? or are you purchasing the amp and speakers? Do you listen to music at all? or is it purely for home theater?

Seeing as this is a woodwork website, there are a couple of good DIY speaker places on-line that are excellent value for money.

If you are interested, give me some more info, and I'll give you the best advice I can.

Cheers

Thanks for all of the responses people - I'm not alone on this!

Spenlux - I'm a bit of an audiophile, with Audiolab/Linn/Arcam/Nakamichi gear, albiet 10, no 16! yrs old. Picked up a 'Hi Fi' mag yesterday, loooong time since I've done that (marriage, renovations, kids, move countries,new job - what happened?) and the gear got the ol' juices flowing. They haven't forgotten how to charge tho' - 'Turned from solid carbon, mined by midget orcs at the centre of Mt Doom, to +/-0.0000000001mm, this will enhance your listening pleasure to orgasmic levels. Only $375 + gst.' It's a bloody turntable mat.

Anyway, maybe I should be combining the purchase with a bit of high end stuff. Anyone wanna buy some nice old stereo gear????

I'll compare the poineer and samsung today, and go from there. Fun looking, anyway. If the nippers aren't with me.

[woodbe]

don't want to get into a shizt fignht, but you are only partly correct.

Yea, sorry, I left out the bit where I reckon the R&D has been well and truly paid off on Plasma, which is why pricing is under marketing control. The US pricing situation supports that view.

If you have a look around the back of a plasma that's been on for a few hours and peer into the many vents, you will realise how hot they run, and how complex they are to manufacture. Repeat the process for a LCD and you will see where I'm coming from.

woodbe.

[Spelunx]

Thanks for all of the responses people - I'm not alone on this!

Spenlux - I'm a bit of an audiophile, with Audiolab/Linn/Arcam/Nakamichi gear, albiet 10, no 16! yrs old. Picked up a 'Hi Fi' mag yesterday, loooong time since I've done that (marriage, renovations, kids, move countries,new job - what happened?) and the gear got the ol' juices flowing. They haven't forgotten how to charge tho' - 'Turned from solid carbon, mined by midget orcs at the centre of Mt Doom, to +/-0.0000000001mm, this will enhance your listening pleasure to orgasmic levels. Only $375 + gst.' It's a bloody turntable mat.

Anyway, maybe I should be combining the purchase with a bit of high end stuff. Anyone wanna buy some nice old stereo gear????

I'll compare the poineer and samsung today, and go from there. Fun looking, anyway. If the nippers aren't with me.

If your speakers are half-way decent, perhaps you can look into buying a new amp for the home theater? There are some awesome surround sound amps out there. For home theater, you really need a sub-woofer, it makes the movies come to life. It also helps a lot with music as well, because it frees up the speakers, allowing them the replicate the mid and high-ranges, with the sub taking the bass.

I bought a sub-woofer from theloudspeakerkit.com and put it together myself. really, really easy to do, and you can save big $$$. I finished mine with black vinyl wrap, but there are people out there who go nuts.

The important part of home theater is balance, the centre, front, surrounds and sub all have to work together. In particular the front three have to be, otherwise you get a change in tone or volume as a car travels from left to right across the screen.

Anyway, there is heaps of info out there for you to read...

good luck.

[Shedhand]

Thanks for all of the responses people - I'm not alone on this!

Spenlux - I'm a bit of an audiophile, with Audiolab/Linn/Arcam/Nakamichi gear, albiet 10, no 16! yrs old. Picked up a 'Hi Fi' mag yesterday, loooong time since I've done that (marriage, renovations, kids, move countries,new job - what happened?) and the gear got the ol' juices flowing. They haven't forgotten how to charge tho' - 'Turned from solid carbon, mined by midget orcs at the centre of Mt Doom, to +/-0.0000000001mm, this will enhance your listening pleasure to orgasmic levels. Only $375 + gst.' It's a bloody turntable mat.

Anyway, maybe I should be combining the purchase with a bit of high end stuff. Anyone wanna buy some nice old stereo gear????

I'll compare the poineer and samsung today, and go from there. Fun looking, anyway. If the nippers aren't with me.

Taz, g'day.
When I lived in Devonport I got pretty friendly with Paul Edwards - the guy who owned hi-fi house - and what he didn't know about home theatre and hi-fi wasn't worth knowing. I think he's closed down now but you might find him in the phone book. I think he lived at Ulverstone or Turners Beach. I reckon he'd be willing to give you some advice.
Cheers

[Carpenter]

I wouldn't claim to be an authority on the subject, but I've heard there's going to be big changes in the TV scene in the not too distant future. With the LCD manufacturers finally pulling out their finger & making big screen sizes to match plasma, its also pushed LCD technology along. Combine this with the passing of break even sales figures in terms of volume, we're now entering a point where the prices are going to plummet & technology will leap forward. I'd be holding out for a while.

[Iain]

Another thing to watch for is shifty dealers who will put on a fairly actionless but pretty DVD when selling said screen.
Take your own DVD with you, something like a Starwars scene, and remember where it is, the action bit.
They won't like it but you will get to see the lagging if there is any.
When I bought my home theatre system they put on Hotel California, bunch of blokes just sitting on the stage playing instruments, sounded good but no action, took in a DVD of my own and they started moaning about incompatability problems that could be encountered (which is absolute horse####e).
I refused to budge and watched my movie on their plasma, a good one, which I then didn't buy, only the amp and speakers, too damned expensive then.