Home tinting acrylic lacquer

[Ambrosia]

Arron,

When you were spraying the lacquer, what did you do with the gun between coats? A complete clean-up of the gun or is there a trick to keep the gun usable between coats?


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[Arron]

I didn’t do anything because I didn’t need to. When I finished a coat I just made sure there was a bit of product in the gun, then hung it up, and then 20 or so minutes later when it was time for the next coat I just picked the gun up, shot a couple of squirts into the atmosphere to make sure everything was OK, and then did the next coat.

I guess when I did those two test squirts, if I thought there was a problem I would have tipped the product out into a clean cup, tipped some thinner into the gun and squirted that through into a rag, then put the product back into the gun and kept going. I suppose I’m relying mainly on sound to know if the gun is clean or obstructed.

Sometimes when spraying pre-cat lacquer I have just left the gun full of product for a few days, then carried on as before with no problem. I’m not sure whether you can do the same with acrylic lacquer - but the thinners are similar so probably you can.

Every now and then I give the guns a complete clean and lube, but actually it’s not the path the product takes through the gun that causes the problem, it’s mostly the cup, and especially the threads where the lid screws on, that cause most of the grief. Also, grunge along the shaft of the needle.

Talking gravity fed guns here.

Cheers
Arron

[PaintMan]

Hi Arron,
as a retired paint chemist I wanted to add a couple of comments.
1-Using very small amounts of architectural tinters such as a little black,yellow oxide and red oxide sourced from a paint shop is a good way to go and is something I also do. The main issue is to make sure you are only adding small amounts as these water based tinters contain high levels of surfactants to make them compatible with both water and solvent based paints.
2-Making stronger or deeper colours requires the use of light or clear bases and most autoshops have proprietory systems in order to make these colours.
3-I have made several furniture items that are a mixture of white painted surfaces and clear finished blackwood. I use auto acrylic primer followed by acrylic topcoats on painted surfaces and N/C based sanding sealer followed by N/C Precat topcoats for the clear finishing. These items have been is use now for over 8 years without any issues.
4-I would likewise suggest you need to pay close attention to the ambient conditions with wet or high humidity best avoided even if spraying in your garage. I use HVLP spray guns that help minimise overspray and using good quality reducers from a recognised industrial supplier is also important as some lower quality thinners cause application and drying problems.
5-Good drying is important and as you know most repair shops use heaters/drying lamps so in regard to the primer/topcoat I would leave the primer 24 hrs then apply the topcoat acrylic. I would also leave the final topcoat at least 24hrs before sanding or buffing. If you are sanding I would recommend you use wet sanding as the water makes it much easier. Also remember several thin coats usually give you a better result than thick coats that take longer to dry. Cheers Paintman

[Arron]

Hi Arron,
as a retired paint chemist I wanted to add a couple of comments.
1-Using very small amounts of architectural tinters such as a little black,yellow oxide and red oxide sourced from a paint shop is a good way to go and is something I also do. The main issue is to make sure you are only adding small amounts as these water based tinters contain high levels of surfactants to make them compatible with both water and solvent based paints.
2-Making stronger or deeper colours requires the use of light or clear bases and most autoshops have proprietory systems in order to make these colours.
3-I have made several furniture items that are a mixture of white painted surfaces and clear finished blackwood. I use auto acrylic primer followed by acrylic topcoats on painted surfaces and N/C based sanding sealer followed by N/C Precat topcoats for the clear finishing. These items have been is use now for over 8 years without any issues.
4-I would likewise suggest you need to pay close attention to the ambient conditions with wet or high humidity best avoided even if spraying in your garage. I use HVLP spray guns that help minimise overspray and using good quality reducers from a recognised industrial supplier is also important as some lower quality thinners cause application and drying problems.
5-Good drying is important and as you know most repair shops use heaters/drying lamps so in regard to the primer/topcoat I would leave the primer 24 hrs then apply the topcoat acrylic. I would also leave the final topcoat at least 24hrs before sanding or buffing. If you are sanding I would recommend you use wet sanding as the water makes it much easier. Also remember several thin coats usually give you a better result than thick coats that take longer to dry. Cheers Paintman

Thanks Paintman. I’m very pleased to see someone with your background come along. It’s hard working all this stuff out as an amateur and a chemistry-ignoramus - it’s hard to find people to ask questions of and we quickly learn that the people selling the products are not often well informed.

So a couple of questions.
What is meant by ‘architectural tints’. Do you mean the product in those paint tinting carousels we see in Bunnings and other hardware stores?

Also, could you tell us what product you used for your white painted furniture - preferably primer and topcoat, if you can remember. Was it an acrylic lacquer for auto use?

Cheers
Arron

[PaintMan]

Hi Arron,
yes they are the tinters or more correctly universal colorants . They are fine very concentrated pigment dispersions that can be added usually by the dispensing machine which has a very good accuracy to enable repetitive mixes to yield the same results using standardised formulas. In regard to the acrylic lacquers I used they were just standard auto products that I got from an industrial paint supplier here in Melbourne. I have previously used the std lines that are available from Autobarn outlets for both primer and topcoats. Most of the newer technologies in the auto refinish industry have now converted to industrial water based acrylics which are a bit more specific to use in regard to application conditions. That is why I still use the older standard solvent based acrylic lacquers that are relatively easier to use in home workshop conditions. I would also seek out a local specialist supplier in your area as they should be a big help in sourcing better quality products especially the reducers. Some reducer/thinner products I have seen are of very dubious quality and often contain reclaimed solvents and weaker mixtures that do not always give an acceptable result. Even what is sold now as mineral turps can be a lower aromatic solvent that when used with the clear brushable alkyd/urethane clears such as sold by Cabbot or Wattyl can yield milky finishes that are even more evident in colder conditions during winter. I got trapped with that issue just last year. Cheers, Paintman

[Arron]

OK, thanks very much for that
Cheers
Arron

[Arron]

Ok, it’s been two months of hard use for this little spray-painted dining table so now it time to evaluate the product.

I might not have clarified earlier in this thread, but the purpose of refinishing this little side-of-the-road find was to evaluate SCA (ie middle market) acrylic spray lacquer as a furniture painting medium. After years of making solid timber furniture, well decades really, I’m now completely over the stuff, and have largely lost enthusiasm for ‘brownware’. I’m wanting to experiment more with form and colour. Therefore I’ve been trying to learn how to do really high quality painting of furniture and built-in items. The main problem is finding a product. I understand that 2pac is beyond my reach, precat and nc are nice but environmentally irresponsible, and household enamel and acrylic paints look terrible. So I sprayed some high-wear furniture with acrylic lacquer to see how it would work out.

The result. Terrific. Good and hard wearing. Probably not good enough for a table top (and it wasn’t expected to be) but for a sideboard, or ocassional table or something in that range then very suitable. Resistance to scratches and knocks and stains very good, and marks able to be buffed off the finished product with a bit of car polish if need be. Nice, satiny hand-feel that doesn’t degrade quickly.

Would I use it for kitchen cabinets. At home, probably not. In our holiday home, definitely yes. Bathroom cabinets or vanities a definite yes. Wardrobes yes. Most furniture yes. Dining chairs no (legs get bashed around too much). Dining table top, no, unless it’s very much a formal table (ie meals only). Even thinking of spraying the trim in our new house (when we build it) with it - house would look amazing.

So I’ve found my preferred product, now I just need to work out how to get it tinted economically.

Cheers
Arron

[welfares]

Sorry to resurrect an old post.

Arron, how did you go with continued experimentation doing your own tinting?

I painted a car in Brilliant white several years ago, and it is..... so white, like, snowblind would be an appropriate colour.

I'm not sure supercheap still stock the 4L tins, but "high opacity white" is available from both repco and autopro (repco and motospray brands respectively).

The question was asked earlier in the thread about just getting them, or a shop to tint it, well, both those 4L above are about $90 a tin. 2L of tinted is $198 at supercheap, and 4L from other shops during my (brief) search have been around $300.
So if you can work out how to tint a tin of white to your satisfaction, happy day$.

I've painted a few things with spray tins with decent results, but 4L makes for a lot of spray cans.

Cheers Guys