H&F ST-12D AKA W454 12" Table Saw

[snapman007]

I wouldn't put money down on something that is NOT in stock.
The A$ will still get better against the $US.
Pay for something that u can touch.

[Bismar]

TBH, atm the price is less of an issue then having to wait for two months. I think i'll try ringing all the stores in Australia, to check if they are defintely out of stock.

[brisbanefitter]

they wont ask you to put money down, check the opst about coming clean, i should know.
bismar you can call all the stores in australia but be prepared to pay some freight, eg brisbane to melb, or perth to melb.
if it on the east coast it will be looked at but if not in sydney then expact to pay some if not all off the freight to get it from brisbane.
if in perth forget it unless you are willing to pay all of that freight to get it back again.

you have to remember that sydney is hq, that is where most of the H&F branches draw stock from. If its in brisbane, it will cost you to get back down again, especially if it landed in sydney first then was shipped to brisbane.
if it landed in brisbane first, it will still cost you some freight as brisbane doesnt often send stock to melbourne and to send it as a one off will be expensive.

i cant speak directly for the other branches or other sales guys but i kjnow in brisbane we will charge freight to draw from melbourne H&F stock, in most cases anyway it is normal practice.

[snapman007]

like I said, pay for something you can take home.

[Big Shed]

they wont ask you to put money down, check the opst about coming clean, i should know.

bismar you can call all the stores in australia but be prepared to pay some freight, eg brisbane to melb, or perth to melb.
if it on the east coast it will be looked at but if not in sydney then expact to pay some if not all off the freight to get it from brisbane.
if in perth forget it unless you are willing to pay all of that freight to get it back again.

you have to remember that sydney is hq, that is where most of the H&F branches draw stock from. If its in brisbane, it will cost you to get back down again, especially if it landed in sydney first then was shipped to brisbane.
if it landed in brisbane first, it will still cost you some freight as brisbane doesnt often send stock to melbourne and to send it as a one off will be expensive.

i cant speak directly for the other branches or other sales guys but i kjnow in brisbane we will charge freight to draw from melbourne H&F stock, in most cases anyway it is normal practice.

BF, you are obviously connected to H&F, but I would like to contradict you re the "they wont ask you to put money down" part.

When I was looking at the WL46 Wood Lathe H&F Melbourne would only take an order (again no stock) with a minimum of 10% deposit.

As I have had previous experience with promised delivery dates not being met, I respectfully declined.

[brisbanefitter]

Hi Big Shed,
I cant speak for the other branches or the people that work in them.
Here in Brisbane, it is normal for us to accept an order for something we dont have and not require a deposit provided it is not a special order item that is not part of our normal stock lines (this is usually large expensive machine tools or sheetmetal gear).
As the WL-46 lathe is not a special order (I assume you just wanted the standard one as it comes) then if you were in Brisbane we would in normal circumstance offer to backorder a machine and call when it arrives into stock.
If the buyer is adamant that they would like to put a deposit down or even sometimes pay in full for the item, we will oblige.
It is possible that Melbourne does things slightly different to Brisbane.
A possible reason I can think of perhaps is if stock is coming into Sydney in limited qty, perhaps the deposit is to secure a machine from this stock and have it transferred to Melbourne, but this is only speculation and I am in no way saying this is the case as I am not the guy who you spoke to in Melbourne and I do not know the reasoning behind it.

With regard to delivery dates, these do sometimes vary depending on a lot of things but mainly its getting it from the supplier in the qty we want, getting container space then space on a ship to get out here. Then there is customs and how long it sits on the docks at both ends.
We we order we get an eta from the supplier, which is entered into our operating system so we can all see when goods are due. The eta is based on whether they have to stock, and if everything from that end to this falls into place as it should.
This date is eta only and is not not until they actually ship (this also gets put into the system when an order is on its way). Once it has shipped, usually the date on the system is correct, plus or minus 1 week for the variables.
sometimes, yes, we do get a blowout on when goods arrive and often it is for reasons out of out control. It is not only frustrating for you the buyer but also for us as we want to supply the equipment at a time we have told the buyer it will be available.

hope this explained something

[Big Shed]

Thanks for that BF, it just goes to show that when you appear to speak for H&F, perhaps you should make it clear that you speak for/about H&F Brisbane as it is obvious that things are done slightly different in other states.

Certainly in Melbourne they will accept an order unless they get a deposit, I have tried the same argument about normal stock item etc, as you speak of above, and only got a shrug of the shoulders and the standard " company policy" reply.

[YeahNah]

Small update:

Something else for the Cons list. Taking the riving knife off is a pain in the butt. Putting it back on is slightly worse. It uses 2 hex screws and is a bit fiddly. Probably no worse than most table saws out there, but a small aggravation none the less.

Good news is the saw is going great and has been terrific to use.

[YeahNah]

Here are 8 photos of the saw being unloaded and put together:
1/ The delivered package
2/ Out of the crate, now t ounwrap
3/ I am so glad it's shipped with the wheels on!
4/ Inside view
5/ One wing on, one to go
6/ The fences rails are on
7/ Dad, the goal posts are meant to be verticle!
8/ Nearly done, now where's the turps (to clean the top, not to drink).

[Bismar]

Nice pics!

Another question, is that pallet attached to the plywood box?

Also roughly how big is the pallet? Will it fit in a trailer?

[YeahNah]

Another question, is that pallet attached to the plywood box?

Also roughly how big is the pallet? Will it fit in a trailer?

The plywood box is attached to the half pallet (which is around 750mm X 830mm). The half pallet just sits on the full pallet. a full pallet comfortably fits into a standard 6 X 4 trailer. Sliding the pallet out of the trailer could be a bittrickier than anything I had to do. I think you'd need a couple of mates to help.

[misd669]

does anybody know how this saw comparew to a mbs 300?
regards
michael

[YeahNah]

Without inspecting it in person, Carba-Tec 12" Cabinet Saw : CARBA-TEC looks very similar indeed.

Allot of H&F stuff seems to have a Carbatec equivilent and for that matter a Grizzly eqivilent. Can anyone confirm this is basically the same saw?

[Bismar]

So some $1870 later, i got a non existent (read earlier posts) table saw shipped from Brisbane. ($220 from Bris to Melb if anyone cares) Seems that it pays to call other branches, as either their inventory management system is shlte or well shlte.

I'll post pictures later, but its almost the same as YeahNah's. Just a few preliminary notes i'll like to add as i haven't finished putting it together (it was late and the mozzies were attacking).

- The Grizzly manual is pretty much spot on, although we got a stupid riving knife and blade guard.

- Why is it stupid? The riving knife does not go below the table which is silly.

- The manual is also a joke. It refers to the riving knife as seen on the Grizzly. They were so slack in fact, the original front page of the manual just says Tilting Arbor Saw with a picture. I say original because they stuck a page on it that says Hare and Forbes ST12D. I'll see if the picture has a brand on it later, but thats kinda hard as it involves holding it against a bright light.

- Table saw has a few scuffs on the outside, even though its brand new.

- The angle gauge on the front, doesn't fully approach zero, although using a digital protractor on the riving knife shows that its around 89.9º relative to the iron table.

So thats my rant for now, will update later.

Also an interesting note about Hare and Forbes in general. They seem to have a retarded choice in shipping companies. To have a truck ship out a product to you with a tail life/ engine crane, will cost you $110 an hour, with a MINIMUM of 3 hours. So thats $330 minimum.

Carbatec on the other hand quoted me under $150 for a truck with a tail lift.

WTH?

[YeahNah]

Hi Bismar

I am glad you got the saw in time for holiday's. A wait until February would have been no good.

I agree with your sentiments on the shipping info you get from H&F. I was quoted $800.00 from Dandenong to Moe (around 1hour 15 minutes in the car). Arranged it myself for a fraction of the cost.

The blade guard is a bit annoying, but I don't mind the riving knife. I prefer it to a splitter. A pain to take off etc, but otherwise pretty good.

The angle of the blade is pretty easy to adjust, just a hex bolt to adjust the positive stops at 90 and 45 degrees.

I am surprised the unit came scratched. Mine was so well packaged it was flawless. I think a phone call to H&F maybe warranted there.

I hope tomorrow treats you better than today has!