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15th August 2013, 07:37 PM #16GOLD MEMBER
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- the sawdust factory, FNQ
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Okay, good question. There is no simple answer... species and end use will dictate which is better.
Basicly there are only two valid reasons to quartersaw.
The first is that timber shrinks less radially then tangentally. So as your moisture content shifts with the seasons Q/S boards are going to swell and shrink through their thickness, rather then their width which is what backsawn boards will do. Generally speaking... in a modern house with modern sealants and coatings... this makes Q/S pointless except in certain limited applications. One is very fine furniture which might be expected to have a service life of hundreds of years. The other is traditional T&G plank on joist internal flooring where the underside of the planks is not likely to be sealed and is open to the outside environment (think traditional Queenslander style house)
The second - and this point is very relevant to this particular post - is that in collapse prone species it is easier to recondition Q/S boards in the kiln. Basicly some species suffer drying collapse... the boards come off saw looking good and by the time they dry they can look like a sheet of corrugated iron. (And it doesn't matter if we're kiln drying or air seasoning) The cure for this is a high temp steam cycle through a kiln, this reintroduces moisture into the dry timber in such a way that it can even out and get rid of the worst of the collapse. Tasmanian oaks, Victorian Ash, plenty of others, all are quartersawn for this reason.
Mountain grey gum - while I'm personally not familiar with it - per Bootle is prone to collapse. Ergo it will give a more consistant result if quartersawn.
Hope that helps
John
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20th August 2013, 09:55 PM #17Novice
- Join Date
- May 2011
- Location
- belgrave vic
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- 18
I like the idea of buying a simple thicknesser. On site dressing will help keep handling mucking around time down.
So.... does anybody see a problem with cutting 100x30?
Also.... im a little worried about the rough sawn finish being splintery when dried... is this valid? should i be laying the thicknessed side up? arrised edges seem easier to be able to do myself.
Is it ok to give a coat or two of oil after 3-4 mnths and before laying it?
very excited about this project!
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20th August 2013, 10:21 PM #18Banned
- Join Date
- Jul 2013
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- Perth
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- 628
Reeded
Reeded decking is reeded - so that it won't hold moisture against the joist and start rot.
People like to lay it with the reeded side upwards for grip - but it holds sand and is a nuisance to sweep. The reeded face is s'posed to be laid down onto the joist, for longevity, but fashion dictates that it mostly gets laid reeded side up!
The point being laid rough sawn - theres a tendency for the water to be trapped under the board and between the joist and for it to rot.
If your going to run it thru a machine to gauge & face it - why not reed that face - and get some extended life out of it?
Just a suggestion - others mileage will vary no doubt.
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21st August 2013, 08:13 AM #19
Also laying it reeded face up tends to make splinters more of an issue.
The way i see it the reeding is to reduce amount of moisture at the joist/decking point of contact, a smooth board increases the surface area as compared to a reeded board and thus the reeded board last longer.
Using a simple planer and making a reed face isn't as easy as it sounds. all boards need to be the exact same thickness and width, then two sprung loaded fences need to be made/used, to feed the boards through the planer so it will 'reed' the board true. All this after you eventually find someone to make the "reeded" cutting knives to custom fit your machine. I went down the track of trying to get knives made for my Carbatec planer and found it very difficult to say the least - yeah i could buy the carbatec fancy knives to make mouldings/skirtings but no bloody way I could find someone to make knives to cut decking, eventually after almost forgetting the idea totally, found someone hence why I now know the other issues faced with making 'profiled' decking using a simple thicknesser.
Best option by far (with limited tools) is to pick your best face, plane the back face of all boards to a uniform thickness, then knock top corners off with electric hand plane and lay your 'custom' deckingI love my Lucas!! ...just ask me!
Allan.
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21st August 2013, 09:22 AM #20Novice
- Join Date
- May 2011
- Location
- belgrave vic
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- 18
yeah, reeded schmeeded for this project...
so planed face up or down? the timber place i went to the other day said its best to lay the boards with the growth rings facing down like a frown. is this worth worrying about or just pick the best face?
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23rd August 2013, 12:56 PM #21Senior Member
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- Feb 2011
- Location
- Tasmania
- Posts
- 80
IMO thats the wrong way around, it is worth putting them down growth rings facing up (centre of tree facing up)(like a smily face). That way if boards cup a little, water will run off rather than sit in the cup.
I suppose if you talk about kiln dried timber (that is gonna absorb moisture) it is the other way around.
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4th October 2013, 08:53 PM #22Novice
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- May 2011
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- belgrave vic
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- 18
Well the milling is under way! But I'm a little disappointed in what's coming out the first tree i had milled was fairly solid but this one has a lot more 'feature'. There are plenty of gum veins and some rot started appearing in the centre. I can cut out the rot but not sure on weather using boards with gum veins is a no no? Will they hold water and rot?
it's getting cut at 100 x 30 @8m long as I was trying to avoid joins and use full lengths but I'm not sure this is an option with the boards that have come out still gonna have a crack at it
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4th October 2013, 09:37 PM #23.
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- Feb 2006
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- Perth
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Pics?
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5th October 2013, 10:03 PM #24Novice
- Join Date
- May 2011
- Location
- belgrave vic
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- 18
ok after much stuffing around hopefully here are some pics...
this is the top stack but is fairly indicative of lots of the pieces. if i wanted blemish free bits i reckon id be lucky to use 30%
its a massive haul from one tree, but not as good quality as the last one that was dropped. the top 3 rows on the left are bigger beams, the rest are the 100 x 30 boards, the length is 8m and its about 2 m wide. good front yard ornament
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6th October 2013, 10:02 AM #25GOLD MEMBER
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- Aug 2011
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- bilpin
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- 3,165
Those boards are going to need stickering right to the ends, otherwise you will be cutting off a lot of waste after drying.
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6th October 2013, 10:16 AM #26
I think it is bushmiller (not sure now) who has put up the best setup I've seen for layout out timber to dry - maybe do a search of his stuff and have a gander at the pics
I love my Lucas!! ...just ask me!
Allan.
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6th October 2013, 10:42 AM #27Novice
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- May 2011
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- belgrave vic
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- 18
Ah ok, well that's an easy fix I can jam some in the ends. Any thoughts on all the gum veins? Do I have to avoid using it outdoors laid flat?
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6th October 2013, 01:44 PM #28
Wood Newby
Al's right with the placement of stickers at the ends of the boards. There is a twofold reason. It supports the end of the board and it retards the rate of drying. For this latter reason the stickers at the each end of the stack are double the width or you can use two the same size placed alongside each other.
This is the thread Al referred to and it may give you some pointers. You'll need to go to page two for the stacking of timber.
https://www.woodworkforums.com/f132/b...ed-gum-170760/
This one might help too despite it's title .
https://www.woodworkforums.com/f132/h...timber-152476/
Also you will probably need to place some weight on the stack and cover the top to afford some protection against the elements.
Regards
PaulBushmiller;
"Power tends to corrupt. Absolute power corrupts, absolutely!"
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4th March 2020, 08:10 AM #29Banned
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- Feb 2020
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- England
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- 36
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- 2
Thanks for the tips. I was just planning to change the decking and any thoughts are useful.
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4th March 2020, 08:13 AM #30Banned
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- Feb 2020
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- England
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Thanks for the tips. I was planning to change the decking and any thoughts are useful.