Advice Pls - Neighbour wants to put drainage on my property

[Bleedin Thumb]

Les may be right (I don't beleive he is) -but what is done is done. Now you are allowing surface water to enter your neighbours property which is illegal.

Do as Mick, Sturdee and others are telling you - work with your neighbour and fix the problem.

[silentC]

Now just a cotton pickin' minute. The situation as I understand it is that at some point before this wall was built, there was open access for run off to run from one property to the next and there was no issue because it was allowed to disperse across a wide area. Both back yards would be wet (because it is raining) but no-one was pointing fingers about who's water it was.

Now the neighbour comes along and builds a retaining wall for most of the length of the property, giving this same water nowhere to go except through a single point at one end of the wall. Somehow this is not the neighbour's fault? Isn't he responsible for the change in the natural flow of the water? Isn't it his wall that has created the problem?

I've heard this idea before that you must prevent storm water from your property from flowing onto adjoining properties. I believe that refers to collected water, so you can't empty a gutter or a downpipe onto a neighbour's land of course. Natural run off is a different story. Does every property in Sydney have a spoon drain running the length of the boundary to make sure that no water falling on one property makes it to the next? No, I didn't think so.

I disagree that it's anyone's problem but the neighbour's and I think the fact he's offered to pay to fix it indicates he has realised this. He might have even sought advice on it himself.

As to whether you should let him do it, I don't see any problem with it. But I have doubts that it is going to work because you're talking about a large amount of surface run off during a storm and no ag pipe under 4" of blue metal and 3" of turf is going to handle that. It's not going to have time to percolate down into the drain. You need a surface drain. I reckon a pit at the worst point is the best option.

[johnc]

I do understand what it is like to deal with a difficult and irrational neighbour. In this case I'd question the Ag line as others have said and consider a pit with PVC to the kerb. Have another chat to the plumber and check with the council. However it does seem like a reasonable deal, just a bit unfortunate that in all liklihood he will not respond to any issues you have. You are on a bit of a no win here, but at least he is offering to pay, which may mean he has taken advice, who knows.

[bricks]

Alot of people are telling you that it's your resonsibility, I don't think so.

Why? Because when the retaining wall was built it should have ( being in an area prone to ponding and flooding) had an ag line installed underneath to facilitate the removal of stormwater from the foundations of the retaining wall.

The ag drain for his retaining wall will have to go onto his side of the property- Check with your local building regulator.

The reason is that you should be able to do whatever you like to your property without his becoming structuraly unsound. The ag drain should have been there in the first place.

But if he'ss going to pay for it, I'd get one put in on your side so that your backyard is protected too.

As silent C said, use a pit if you can-

[Vernonv]

I tend to agree with SilentC, that there is a distinction between stormwater (collected on the roof) and natural run off, and from the description it sounds like the neighbour has altered the flow of the natural runoff on his own property.
I reckon he created his own problem, however if you can assist him to rectify it, then I think you should considered it.

[HappyHammer]

I think you should tell him you've taken advice and he needs to take down his wall and re-build it as it should have been in the first place with adequate drainage.

If he'd come to you and said

"Look mate any chance of doing me a favour to sort out this water problem only I'll have have to take down the whole wall and start again otherwise. I'm happy to pay for it and make sure you're garden is put back to how it was before."

I'd have agreed that it seems like a reasonable request and to work with him to sort it out. But he is obviously a total tosser, losing his rag and sending over his wife so I'd tell him to get stuffed no great loss from what you've said so far.

HH.

[juan]

he is obviously a total tosser, losing his rag and sending over his wife so I'd tell him to get stuffed no great loss from what you've said so far.

This is not the manner to resolve differences with neighbours. Why inflame an already tense situation. From my experience women are more than capable of firing up situations and I suspect the wife did not need too much sending over. You may live next to this family for years and it would be better to sit down over a beer and work out an amicable solution to the problem than getting involved in arguments and with lawyers and the like. A financial contribution by you offered in good faith will go a long way towards building a better relationship with the family. We often get a little fired up over big issues like this and often both parties genuinely believe they are the agrieved party.

Get the facts correct from the authorities and then sit down rationally and discuss how the problem can be solved amicably is my advice. You never know you might find out the couple are great neighbours who will make living there so much more enjoyable.

Cheers

[HappyHammer]

This is not the manner to resolve differences with neighbours. Why inflame an already tense situation. From my experience women are more than capable of firing up situations and I suspect the wife did not need too much sending over. You may live next to this family for years and it would be better to sit down over a beer and work out an amicable solution to the problem than getting involved in arguments and with lawyers and the like. A financial contribution by you offered in good faith will go a long way towards building a better relationship with the family. We often get a little fired up over big issues like this and often both parties genuinely believe they are the agrieved party.

Get the facts correct from the authorities and then sit down rationally and discuss how the problem can be solved amicably is my advice. You never know you might find out the couple are great neighbours who will make living there so much more enjoyable.

Cheers

And if that doesn't work and the bloke continues to be a tosser because he thinks he's got one over on you?

HH.

[les88]

When I lived in Sydney I had surface water running over the back yard, so a foot in from the fence I built a concrete wall 4 inches thick by 12 inches high. Worked a treat the water was diverted from my property. The building inspector knocked on the door.. what have you done here.. eh. Don't you know that you cannot divert surface water....no Sir. Well you can't get rid of the wall.. Yes Sir.
I now live on a slope and the water from 1/2 a mile away runs down thru all the yards, the lucky one lives on the top of the hill I am 3/4 the way down the bloke at the bottom is the worst off. A rubble drain will not stop surface water, It would have to be an open drain.
1. Tell him to extend his retaining wall to the street
2. Tell him to reduce the height of his wall so that the water is not diverted.
3. Tell the law that his retaining wall is causing the water to back up on your property
4. Let him waste his money by building an agg drain
5. If it was me I would tell him to get *****k
les

[pedro the swift]

I will agree with the people who state that since it seems to be ground water not storm water from gutters etc there is no onus on you to fix it. I will relate a somewhat similar problem on my place. We live halfway down hill and when it rains heavily (as it has been recently) water from our neighbours uphill floods the back of the yard and into the garden shed and then runs on into next next yard down hill.
There was an agg pipe in the ground which ran right around the rear perimeter to the road but this was blocked and ineffective. I replaced this pipe in a gravelled trench but it also blocked up with roots etc within a fairly short time.
Final answer was to place three drain grates parallel with neighbours fence connect them with 90mm flexible unslotted drain which ran right around perimeter to road.
This works fine but still cant cope with really heavy rain but clears the water away in a very short time. We still get a continous trickle of water along the the subsoil and through our retaining wall into the drains for weeks if not up to two months after heavy rain. There is reputed to be a spring further up the hill and the bloke three doors up has apparently put in a bore to use this water(not confirmed).
My opinion: I would let your neighbour dig his trench totally at his cost and make it clear to him you are doing him a great favour. Since it is only rain runoff you have no responsibility to do anything about it. If his wall is diverting the flow he created the problem by not having proper drainage installed at the start.
In a way it is to both your advantage to get rid of the excess water. Saves his wall and stops your backyard being sodden. But do not use slotted agg pipe. Get him to install drains grates and min 90mm pipe to the road way.

[echnidna]

I'd see a solicitor and make sure it cannot come back and bite you on the bum some time in the future but after that's sorted out let him pay for the drain.

[Hybrid]

UPDATE:

I went into my local council today and consulted with a council engineer. He was very helpful. He pulled up aerial photographs of my property and the neighbour's property which had contour infromation overlayed on the map. He was able to determine the natural fall of the land from this information.

After explaining the situation and the nature of the neighbour's retaining wall, he speculated that the wall would not have been approved by council and agreed that it would be blocking the natural flow. He was of the opinion that the neighbour is totally responsible for any action to rectify the situation.

He strongly recommended that a D.A be submitted to council prior to any trench or drain being created. This way council could advise if the solution was effective and met all relevant rules and regs. Also, this drainage system would be documented as being "approved" should I ever want to sell the property. He suggested that I be very careful in permitting any work to be carried out on my property at the request of a neighbour. He suggested that the neighbour should be undertaking the work on his side if he wanted to address this issue.

I am concerned on a couple of fronts. Firstly, the neighbour engaged a fencing contractor to provide quotation on the trench and drainage (didn't mention this in my original post). He may be a friend or something - not sure. I have real concerns about a fencing guy doing drainage. I would feel more comfortable about a plumber undertaking the work. Also I have my stormwater pipes running along the same area that this trench would be dug. I am worried that a carefree labourer may damage the PVC pipes and not worry about notifying me or fixing it.

Will be talking to a builder friend tomorrow to get his views on the way it should be done....

[silentC]

Sounds straight forward to me. It's his problem and he can fix it by putting a pit on his property at the point where the water is running around his wall. Tell him that in the interests of neighbourly relations you've decided you wont be seeking through the courts to have the wall removed, despite the fact it is causing drainage problems on your property.

I wouldn't let his fencing mate set foot on my property if I was you.

[dazzler]

Hi Hybrid

sorry if I sounded harsh........(dazzler said sorry ) but without the further info it did sound like trigger was all saddled up and ready to go

best of luck

dazzler

[Gingermick]

Just fill your land a little so it doesn't pond and all goes over the wall.
Does your block fall to the road?