Election

[echnidna]

Please stop this hypocritical union bashing nonsense.
How many registered trade unions or associations are there in this country?
How many indulge in Thuggish standover tactics of workers or bosses?
How many registered business's are there?
How many indulge in thuggish standover tactics of their employees or those trying to represent them?
Ever heard of a lockout guys?
How many of the union bashers on this forum have at sometime in their lives taken advantage of the benefits won by fights that others paid for.
Or do you donate the dough to your favorite charity?

As for the decline in membership, I was the delegate for many years and had a very reasonable working relationship with boss, membership was at 67%. It was the young ones who never suffered unequal pay for women,
two min toilet breaks for pregnant women, ETC ETC that refused to join because and I quote "I'll get the benefits anyway".

Is there any wonder that there is a bitter feeling toward those who ride the backs of others work?

Maybe some of you are too blinkered to see that your being manipulated by the interests of business, or you may run a business too small to afford a fair deal to your employees. In which case get out and get a job , and I hope its in an industry with a decent (in all senses) Union .

Astrid

Phew that was a rant

[Ashore]

Or the working conditions of overseas sailors befor the painters and dockers stepped in and refused to unload ships untill these conditions improved.

That was the MUA not the painters and dockers , they don't unload ships
To put the painters and dockers in any good light indicates to me that you have never had any dealings with that union , they are one of the reasons we now have only a handfull of australian manned ships on the Australian Coast and not the 100 or so we did have

To really throw the cat amongst the pidgions lets look at conditions on building sites befor the BLF and Gallhager.

Gallhager was put in to stop the Green Bans to make the union federal and remove the state controle to curb sharkey mundy who was one of the decent blokes and the reason much of sydneys heratige was saved Gallhager on the other hand showed himself as exactily what he was.

[astrid]

Thanks bob,
Astrid

Whatever, Ashore, my point is still that unions can do tremendously good things.

Astrid

[Geoff Dean]

my point is still that unions can do tremendously good things.

Astrid

As previously stated, my only dealings with unions have been when they have tried to extort, blackmail and standover me, and when that didn't work they then made sure that the over award payment that I had negotiated was removed.

If that is your idea of doing a tremendously good thing, then you can have it...I want nothing to do with it.

[rod@plasterbrok]

Thanks bob,
Astrid

Whatever, Ashore, my point is still that unions can do tremendously good things.

Astrid

Hmm. you would not be saying that Astrid if you had my experience with Unions.

They bloody mindedly destroyed my company in the 80's
http://blogs.news.com.au/heraldsun/a.../#commentsmore

[Ashore]

Whatever, Ashore, my point is still that unions can do tremendously good things.
Astrid

Whatever ... why not admit the two examples of unions doing good that you gave are possable two of the worst unions australia ever had to deal with
You say your point is that unions can do tremendously good things I would put it to you that in the past some unions have done tremendously good things when we lived in a diffrent era, and I for one are thankful for them, but we have progressed as a people and a nation the need of unions has decreased not gone completely by any means but decreased and surely we need to look at the present and the future and look not only at the old ways of doing things but give new ideas a try before saying we must go back to the way industrial relations were handled 30 - 40 - or more years ago.
Your pro union stance is just that yours and you have a right to it but please get your facts right and when you are wrong be big enough to admit it , and not with .."whatever"

[astrid]

sorry, you are correct in saying it was mundy who was BLF boss and yes was a good bloke and did tremendous things.

and my understanding is that the MUA (a Union) assisted overseas sailor with the assisstance of the PDU who do unload containers and refused to do so until conditions were improved for your less fortunate brothers.

dont nit pick
astrid

PS a rather more current example is the ACTU V James Hardy
want to nit pick that one?

[Waldo]

and my understanding is that the MUA (a Union) assisted overseas sailor with the assisstance of the PDU who do unload containers and refused to do so until conditions were improved for your less fortunate brothers.

Patricks wanted to bring in non-union labour (which as an employer, is their given right) who got paid better for various reasons and the MUA chucked a spit and said, "no you can't do that" and locked the place down. That about the guts of it Ashore?

[astrid]

For those who have lost businesses because of union action I am very sorry.
Actually this happened to my Dad (painter and sighnwriter) in the UK late sixties.
But he was grown up about it, conceded that his business was too small to be viable, Moved over here and landed me on you

He remained a Labour man all his life and pro Union.(mostly)

Astrid

[echnidna]

ok you union bashing bums,
what about keeping a balanced discussion,
do some picking on the bum employers as well

[silentC]

It's all becoming clear

[silentC]

do some picking on the bum employers as well

Don't have any experiences to draw on. All of my employers have treated me well. I've been sacked once, but I deserved it. I've always had flexibility for personal business within the limits of employment requirements.

The only union I've ever been a member of was the FSU when I worked for Commonwealth Bank. When I joined, we had RDOs, paid overtime, 1 moving day per year, various discounts on bank services etc. By the time I left, all of that was gone. What was the point of being a member of the union?

Or perhaps Astrid thinks I didn't deserve to benefit from all those things anyway, since they had been fought for and won by members before my time.

[astrid]

silent,
maybe all those things went because the FSU is weak because people wont join.
Banking like Insurance tends to be a rather conservative industry.

Astrid

[silentC]

I think that's putting the cart before the horse. When I joined, Comm bank was still very much public service sector mentality despite privatisation and most of the employees were members - it was pretty much a given that you would join. I signed up because there were some benefits of membership, including cheap loans (which they got rid of) and a couple of other things.

The reason we lost all those things was because they had entered into an enterprise bargaining agreement and part of the deal for pay increases was to lose RDOs and some of the other benefits. I would have preferred the RDOs but no-one asked me - they negotiated them out of existence 'on my behalf'.

[Gra]

silent,
maybe all those things went because the FSU is weak because people wont join.
Banking like Insurance tends to be a rather conservative industry.

Astrid

no its because the FSU is a puppet of the banks. dont ask me how I know, but lets just say I am the only one on my floor that still has RDO's (Long term employment with one employer has its perks)