Choosing floorboards...

[tobot]

Greetings

We've got a terrace house with no floorboards downstairs, so are planning to replace the yellow tongue (not nailed down) with floorboards. It's a big reno and after earlier masonry related disasters, I want to get it right.

Considerations are:

1. They will be 130mm x 19 to match upstairs board width, about 32m square.
2. They will be stained dark brown - say 50/50 walnut and black
3. Upstairs are Kauri, but I think we want Hardwood downstairs.
4. Also having a staircase built, but not ordered yet.
5. Subfloor is hardwood joists and bearers on dry sandy ground with 1-3 feet clearance.
6. I'd prefer no glue.
7. Have been considering remilled recycled timber, or new Standard grade.

We were thinking Blackbutt, but have seen some more economical timbers - Blackbutt seemed the most logical early on due to cost and colour for staining.

We want to match the treads of the yet to be constructed staircase to the floor as well.

Any thoughts and tips are appreciated!

[Gaza]

Greetings

We've got a terrace house with no floorboards downstairs, so are planning to replace the yellow tongue (not nailed down) with floorboards. It's a big reno and after earlier masonry related disasters, I want to get it right.

Considerations are:

1. They will be 130mm x 19 to match upstairs board width, about 32m square.
2. They will be stained dark brown - say 50/50 walnut and black
3. Upstairs are Kauri, but I think we want Hardwood downstairs.
4. Also having a staircase built, but not ordered yet.
5. Subfloor is hardwood joists and bearers on dry sandy ground with 1-3 feet clearance.
6. I'd prefer no glue. Why glue is recommended by all timber manufacturers.
7. Have been considering remilled recycled timber, or new Standard grade.It is a waste to stain recycled timber hiding all its natural features.

We were thinking Blackbutt, but have seen some more economical timbers - Blackbutt seemed the most logical early on due to cost and colour for staining. Australian Beach is light colour but cost less if applying dark stain result would be same.

We want to match the treads of the yet to be constructed staircase to the floor as well.

Any thoughts and tips are appreciated!

comments above

[glock40sw]

G'day.
Why no glue?

Why butcher great Aussie hardwood by staining it?

If you are keen on staining a floor use the Weed known as pine.

Staining hardwood........what a bloody waste
P.S. G'day Gaza.
You have been quiet.......Been Busy?

[tobot]

Okay.

So what DO you recommend to go with the very dark, approaching japanned, original Kauri boards upstairs? I haven't seen any timber in yards or showrooms that approaches this dark colour...

I'm not keen on sanding the Kauri boards back, because they have hundreds of remnant flathead nails from where ancient lino was installed in various high traffic places.

No Glue? Have a bit of a research into the off gassing of all our favourite construction adhesives. Include plywood and particle board in that research. Babies crawling about on freshly glued floor and skirting anyone? I'll leave the glue thanks, I'm just not keen on it. The floor upstairs is sound after 127 years without glue...

Your thoughts and jabs are still appreciated...

[glock40sw]

G'day.
The use of Adhesive is a common and recommended installation practice.

127 years ago, they did not has kiln dried flooring.
127 years ago, about the only glue they had was derived from animals.
127 years ago, they were not in any hurry to install the floor.
127 years ago, they used old growth trees to make their flooring. Not plantation or regrowth trees we have today.

127 years ago they didn't have to worry about supposed politically correct health issues.


Now... dark hardwoods.
You have Grey Ironbark. It is dark brown. a good tinted finish will darken it further and also the good thing is that most Eastern Australian Hardwoods darken with age naturally.

So..to the fixing of 130mm wide boards. If you top nail with 3 nails per board, with the 2 outside nails skewed at a 30 deg angle,then,Yes, you do not need to use adhesive.

Are your joists at 450mm centres?

It is advisable that the sand under the floor be covered with heavy duty plastic sheet and have all the joins taped with a high quality tape. This will prevent any moisture that gets to the sand from affecting the bottom of the floor. Perimiter drainage is advisable as well.

If you are having a cow about a little bit of glue, what finish do you intend to use on the floor.
Most floor finishes have solvents in them.

BTW.. Off gassing... You will find that your plastic car child seat gives off more fumes than the glue under the floor will. You DO secure your child in an approved restaint when driving, don't you?

All the best with your floor...

[Gaza]

fuller now have a new product that is "green adhesive" i myself have not used it and dont plan on using it. i am not going to risk a job to new product that is untested in an actual application. We have been using sika T55 for at least 6 yrs now and there is no problem with it.

some waterbased finhses off gas as well, bona has the smallest amount of hardner than other products.

[tobot]

Streuth.

I think I've just been "flamed"!

Trevor - are you saying that kiln dried, new sawn 130mm boards need to be glued due to an inherent tendency to change? In that case the glue sounds totally necessary whether I like it or not. Joists are at 450mm centres except where they are closer together to negotiate fireplaces etc.

Gaza - thanks for that info on glues. I'm not in a super hurry so I'll check it out.

What about Victorian Ash for floorboards? The stairmakers are keen to use it...

I'm considering a Tung Oil or similar finish - but not fixed yet.

This is great. Where else could I ask these questions? A bit like going down to the pub and talking about the politics of timber!

thankyou..

[glock40sw]

G'day.
No. you haven't been flamed...Not Yet anyway.

If a 130mm board is going to cup due to any onsite moisture related problems, The best glue in the world will not stop it from cupping.

Vic ash does take stain well. Is relatively cheap and easy to work. It looks like craap due to most of it being quarter sawn because of shrinkage issues during drying. All the hardwood from up here in God's country are Backsawn, thus giving the great figure and grain to the boards.

Have a look at Grey Ironbark. Do yourself a favour as Molly Meldrum used to say..

[jimc]

I had similar issues matching different species of timber...blackwood, grey ironbark, old growth ash (light chocolate brown) and brushbox. I seperated them with a Karri feature at all door frames where the different baords joined.

It looks a treat and the flooring flows very well. The apparant border makes a break and does not challange the eye when moving from one room to the next....even at a large doorway of 2.4 metres!

Install what you want but avoid staining.

A great non toxic finnish we used was whittle wax. All natural oils and waxes that can be refinished and copes well with young kids, family pets etc.

[Connollys]

Do yourself a favour and dont STAIN the boards a dark brown, it will drive you insane, you will never keep it clean. When the boards move (and they will) you will see white lines in between the boards. Grey Ironbark as Trevor suggested is an excellent choice or Qld Spotted Gum, they are not to dark and have a god variation of color so they wont date, the stained floor will. Good luck I hope you find a solution that fits what you want

Cheer