More Sorry Suggestions

[astrid]

get over you, dazzler,
This apology is about the representitives of the non indiginous australian people saying sorry for the destruction of another culture, by deliberately breaking up the ties that held that culture together, its not about you, or your grandad.
If any one of you has read one book on this subject, not the herald or the australian, but has bothered to go to the library and read one book,
then you may be entitled to an opinion


Astrid

[RETIRED]

Keep it nice kiddies or this thread may disappear.

[Burnsy]

We apologise for giving you doctors and free medical care,which allows you to survive and multiply so that you can demand apologies.
We apologise for helping you to read and teaching you the english langauage and thus we opened up to you the entire European civilisation,thought and enterprise.
We feel that we must apolgise for building hundreds of homes for you ,which you have vandalised and destroyed.
We apologise for giving you law and order which has helped tp prevent you from slaughtering one another and using the unfortunate for food purposes.
We apologise for developing large farms and properties ,which today feed you people, where before, you had the benefits of living off the land and staving during droughts.
We apologise for providing you with warm clothing made of fabrics to replace animal skins you used before.

etc etc etc

I thought I had said everything I wanted but no there's more............

I have received the email with the above on it from at least 10 people. Most of these people I believe to be very compasionate and non-discriminatory. The fact that these type of people are sending on this message that we all really know is inappropriate and should not be condoned really does show that many Australians are not comfortable with the current situation and are of the belief that saying sorry is not the answer. As I said earlier, I don't believe that the Australian public as a whole are going to stomach the whole sorry thing without demanding that some changes occur in regard to the equality of all Australians.

Personally, I believe that John Howard was right with not saying sorry as a nation and with intervention as well. I think sorry needs to come from individuals and actions always speak louder than words in this regard. I also think intervention should have been Australia wide and without race boundaries. There are plenty of Anglo Australians that should have their benefits and children removed from them today as they are creating a cycle of abuse that appears to keep getting bigger with each generation (and the generations are getting larger and closer together).

[johnc]

I don't have a problem with the Government saying sorry for past injustices and errors. From forced removals sometimes without adequate justification and for the massacres often handed out by local pastoralists, with tacit approval from the authorities at the time. This is a side show to the very real problems faced by the Aboriginal community and sorry seems to be a hurdle that must be cleared. The real issues are the intractible ones of health, education, opportunity and attitiude. The indiginous community also has to face up to the fact that it is part of the problem as well and rather than the odd claim for compensation realise that a lot of money is being thrown at the problem and they now need to become part of the solution. This will be a very long road and one not helped by bleating on about who should be saying sorry. It is time the debate moved onto what needs to be done and the past allowed to rest.

[astrid]

so, burnsy, have you read one book.

Astrid

Johnc I agree in ageneral sense, but sorry has to be said,

[wayfarer]

EDIT>>>

Personally, I believe that John Howard was right with not saying sorry as a nation and with intervention as well. I think sorry needs to come from individuals and actions always speak louder than words in this regard. I also think intervention should have been Australia wide and without race boundaries. There are plenty of Anglo Australians that should have their benefits and children removed from them today as they are creating a cycle of abuse that appears to keep getting bigger with each generation (and the generations are getting larger and closer together).

The NSW Dept of Community Services (DOCS), while it doesn't have a great record, does remove children from dangerous families as often as it can. It's not restricted to ethic groups as far as I know.
I don't know how removing benefits helps people; just the opposite I'd imagine.

[wayfarer]

I don't have a problem with the Government saying sorry for past injustices and errors. From forced removals sometimes without adequate justification and for the massacres often handed out by local pastoralists, with tacit approval from the authorities at the time. This is a side show to the very real problems faced by the Aboriginal community and sorry seems to be a hurdle that must be cleared. The real issues are the intractible ones of health, education, opportunity and attitiude. The indiginous community also has to face up to the fact that it is part of the problem as well and rather than the odd claim for compensation realise that a lot of money is being thrown at the problem and they now need to become part of the solution. This will be a very long road and one not helped by bleating on about who should be saying sorry. It is time the debate moved onto what needs to be done and the past allowed to rest.

Top post!

[astrid]

Good point, wayfarer, but dont let them have an excuse to change the subject.
Astrid

[Wongo]

[astrid]

Thanks wongo, but stop sitting on the fence.

this is serious,
astrid

[Burnsy]

so, burnsy, have you read one book.

Astrid

Johnc I agree in ageneral sense, but sorry has to be said,

I have read a couple, actually have Grief Gaiety and Aborigines in front of me now. I am nowhere near full bottle on the topic and don't for a minute believe that removing all children without reason as was the policy was the right thing to do (I am sure it was best for some but nowhere near all) however I don't believe that the government saying sorry is going to help anyone. I think it could be the opposite. I may however be wrong and as JohnC has said it may well be what is needed to move forward.

The NSW Dept of Community Services (DOCS), while it doesn't have a great record, does remove children from dangerous families as often as it can. It's not restricted to ethic groups as far as I know.
I don't know how removing benefits helps people; just the opposite I'd imagine.

Same here Wayfarer, but it does not happen enough. I have worked with non-aboriginal children who are one of seven and mum is 24 and she was quoted as saying she does it for the money. By removal of benefits I really should have said management of benefits such as the use of finance cards that only allow for the purchase of certain goods through certain outlets to stop child benefits and other payments being squanded on alcohol and drugs.

[artme]

I'm with Astrid.
How many of you have had contact with people who were taken from their families?
How many of you have bothered to sit and discern the real issues?
The Aboriginal people of this country have been subjected to the rough end of the pineapple too many times. Read your history and learn about the disgraceful and supercillious manner in which these peolple were treated!!
Let me tell you a little story. An Aboriginal YACS worker I knew years ago, and had the pleasure of working with, was raised on a "mission".
At intervals "The Inspector" would drive to the "mission" unannounced.
Many in the community, on hearing his vehicle approaching over a nearby rattley bridge would simply take to the bush.
My mate's mother would line the family up at the end of the kitchen table and wait patiently as "The Inspector" freely inspected the house checking off a long list - beds made, clothes clean, floors swept eyc., etc., etc.,.
"The Inspector" would then sit at the table and write a report while the family watched in silence. The result of that report determined God knows what.
I cannot imagine the humiliation of such an experience once let alone time after time.
Another Aboriginal co-worker of mine was taken to Cootamundra for no other reason than the fact that she was an Aboriginal child. I was at a gathering one day of fellow workers, many of whom were Aboriginal. This was when this lady (in her forties!) finally learnt much about the blank pages in her life simply because she met another lady with a similar background and they had realtives in common. The excitement on later meeting up with long lost relatives can only be imagined.
When this happens with the rest of the population it is cause for celebration in the media. Why Not with Aboriginal people?
How many of us saw the program "The Leaving of Liverpool' and were apalled by the story it told?
How many of you have read Dee Brown's book "Bury my Heart at Wounded Knee"? If you haven't then I suggest you do and translate it straight to Australia and it's treatment of the Aboriginal inhabitants.
I don't feel retroguilt. It was nothing to do with me.I am not a religious peson in the sense that most of us understand. But I caannot sit this out and not feel some parallel with the parable of "the Good Samaritan." By that I mean I am not about to let something go by that is wrong on the grounds that it is not my fault or my problem.
For all those who wish to take a snide and despicable position on this issue then take a good look at the broader picture and at least try to work out what this apology really means.

[astrid]

Burnsie
I'm glad you have enough real interest to read books
but dont confuse the sad situations that some people end up in with the general issue of cultural geneoside

and many of those so called benefits, are the same as given to white folk under a different name.
beware of stuff read in the mainsteam.
my father in law thought koori aquaintance was getting free petrol.
He was a Telstra liney .
There has been so much mischievious misinformation put about, that it's hard to separate fact from fiction.

please keep on topic

Astrid

[flynnsart]

This is a very controversial subject I think I will just bite my tongue

Donna

[Jack E]

Astrid,

What is your experince or qualification on the subject?
Please note where I live, I believe I have a little experience on the topic.

Cheers, Jack