Unions, loathe em, love em or balance

[Groggy]

Unions exist to stop employers bullying and abusing workers.

Occasionally unions have bullied and abused workers who don't want to join a union.

Maybe non-union type workers need an anti-union! Problem is though, the anti-union would abuse its power by bullying pro-union workers from joining unions.

Ok, jokes aside, the problem with this whole issue is the refusal by some to accept that unions and employees rights are not intrinsically linked - they aren't. Fundamentally, the unions are simply a mechanism of convenience used by employees to put their perspective to the employers. When the unions cease to represent the workers and provide value to the workers it is only natural the workers will drift away.

This is not to say that unions are not trying where they can, it may be a reflection of a changed employment environment and other forces that are at play to protect worker's rights and conditions. The unions may make their position a lot weaker by abusing their powers and occasionally bullying the membership.

To stretch a long bow, the discussion is a little similar to the need to have a Defence force. Do you need it in time of peace? Some Defence forces are bad and stage coups, but not all. It really depends on the authority given to them by the people. Not everyone wants a Defence force or believes in violence, but in times of conflict everyone benefits from it. The peacenicks are not left to defend themselves. The overall view though, is that a Defence force is a handy thing to have ready, just in case of bad times. So, with unions, maybe they are a handy thing to have, the major problem we have is getting them to behave.

[rodp]

Hi Astrid,
Good question
"Would any of you feel safe working on a skyrise, mine, or on the docks(and Im not talking about subbies) without any union representation or presence?
I would have often felt a lot safer if their was not a union presence, a whole lot safer, luckly unlike some I did not have a family.

[silentC]

Problem with giving control of workplace to civil servants

I didn't say controlled by the government, I said funded by the government - similar to legal aid. I'm trying to think of a way of having the independent representation given by unions without the membership issue.

We have the Arbitration Commission but if that was working properly, we wouldn't need unions at all.