Professor problems, any advice on how to deal with him/it?

[Matt88s]

My organic professor has yet to grade any of our labs. We are now in what, week 10 or 11 of the semester? He teaches several sections, so he must have a veritable mountain of paperwork in his office, if we're lucky maybe he will be lost in a cave in or avalanche and we'll get a different instructor.

He is going to get to them though, he says so every week and has for the last month, so I know he is, honest. Personally I don't think he has time to get to them though, not before the end of this semester anyhow, and certainly not giving them the attention they deserve, and on top of all this, I don't think he should grade them. If he isn't going to return graded labs as feedback, so we can feel him out and figure out how he wants his labs formated, then he shouldn't be grading them 2/3 of the way though the semester. What if I've been making the same mistake on all of them all this time? What's he going to do, count off for every time when if he'd returned labs graded on time we could see what we were doing wrong, correct mistakes, step it up or down as needed, etc. At this point I think all that would be fair would be to give completion grades, if you were there and did the lab and turned in a report, then you get full points.

Our labs constitute 30% of our grade.

We have till 5:00pm on the 9th, if so inclined, to drop, change to audit, etc, after that date it won't happen without executive act of god type happening.

I talked with him again today. We hemmed and hawwed back and forth a bit, until finally he gave an equation we could use to give a rough idea of our grade in the class. For our lab grades he said just to use 85%, he didn't think they'd go lower than that. Then he said to be safe to use 80%. According to this formula I have a B in the class.

The guy is a skunk though, he's wack, a regular Dr Jekyll/Mr Hyde, one of my fellow classmates commented today he should be on medication.

I don't trust for a second that 80% is the bottom line. I'll get past the 9th, I'll get my grades back, and I'll be totally screwed and there won't be anything to do about it. So the only thing I see to do is drop if we don't have grades by the drop date. I have put so much time, effort, and $$ into this class though, I want to finish it just to spite him, its like if I quite he's won.

Another problem with quitting is he's the only one that teaches it at this campus and I swear I will sharpen the ends of paintbrushes and shove them into my brain via my eyeballs before I take this guy again. He causes pain on so many mental levels, he pushes buttons I didn't know I had, he is so unfair and sexist you almost can't believe your eyes and yet I have his tests and know his operandi modus so it almost makes no sense not to take him if I have to take it again, especially since I haven't actually learned anything in this class. This has been a learning experience like none other.

At this point I'm almost physically sick, I'm not seeing much hope of getting a grade before the 9th. I know I can pass the class, but I'm not willing to take less than a B. I can't. My GPA is a 3.25, if it goes any lower I won't stand a snowballs change in hell of getting into my program of choice, I'll spend the next three years reapplying and reapplying hoping to they will get tired of seeing my name and let me in. I've known people with 3.7 and higher that got turned down.

I know I could leverage around and complain to the right people and probably get grades, but I don't want to force his hand as I have no doubt if forced his grades will reflect that and for sure he will be .

And on top of all of this he seems like such a nice guy.

[q9]

Don't know what it's like there, but here the students have actually quite a lot of scope to complain and get things sorted properly.

Of course, you could just say he made a pass at you in exchange for grades That'd get something happening pretty quick smart

[joe greiner]

First of all, I'd advise against making up a story to force the issue; can't have a good outcome.

A lot depends on the nature of your school. You mentioned "at this campus." Does that mean a full-fledged university? If so, there'd be a graduate program in his specialty or close enough. Lab work would usually be graded by a graduate teaching assistant, and in this case, it appears he needs such assistance.

Write a memo to the prof, documenting the equation he provided, and thanking him for his advice. This might help to ensure against contrary results, without being overly belligerent.

Have another chat with him, to discuss the possibility of having a grad student assist in his workload, and follow up with a discussion with the department's dean to suggest assignment of such assistance.

You say you "have his tests." Did you get them from his previous students? As all you really need is feedback on your lab work, you could also discuss it with those students, even if you don't have copies of your submittals.

Without more knowledge of your program and stage of education, it's hard to add more. I hope some of this gives you something tasteful to chew on besides your innards.

Joe

[Matt88s]

First of all, I'd advise against making up a story to force the issue; can't have a good outcome.

A lot depends on the nature of your school. You mentioned "at this campus." Does that mean a full-fledged university? If so, there'd be a graduate program in his specialty or close enough. Lab work would usually be graded by a graduate teaching assistant, and in this case, it appears he needs such assistance.

Write a memo to the prof, documenting the equation he provided, and thanking him for his advice. This might help to ensure against contrary results, without being overly belligerent.

Have another chat with him, to discuss the possibility of having a grad student assist in his workload, and follow up with a discussion with the department's dean to suggest assignment of such assistance.

You say you "have his tests." Did you get them from his previous students? As all you really need is feedback on your lab work, you could also discuss it with those students, even if you don't have copies of your submittals.

Without more knowledge of your program and stage of education, it's hard to add more. I hope some of this gives you something tasteful to chew on besides your innards.

Joe

I agree, lying or making things up can't have a good outcome.

I'm at a Community college. It's fairly good sized though, usually sees 30,000+ students annually, and has four campuses spread across the area, one downtown, and one to the north, one to the west, and one to the southeast side of the city. It's really a nice place, has a very good reputation, class size is usually fairly small, the professors teach the labs, you get a lot of opportunities to ask one on one questions with the professors if you need, beautiful campuses and very wide open airy buildings. I've really enjoyed it for the most part, I'm almost done though, Physics II and Stat are what I have left, I'll graduate this spring. I'm applying to the DPT program at OU, and if I get in I'll be going there in the fall.

So anyhow, no grad students to help him, though really, after I thought about it, he really doesn't have that much to do. Even if he is teaching 5 classes, there are probably only 20 people left in each class, thats about how many are left in ours, quite a few have already dropped, either couldn't take him or were not doing well. Well, after doing that math on that one in my head, 20X5= 100, 100X10 lab reports per student = 1000 lab reports that need grading.

Getting behind on things is a biotch now isn't it? That isn't really my fault though...

I have his exams only because I've been taking them all semester. Whether he makes new ones or not every semester I don't know, maybe he does and maybe thats why all the questions have been rephrased and paraphrased to the point you can't understand or recognize them. Or maybe its because he uses an old edition of the textbook. Who knows. If I have to take it again though, as much as I don't even want to think about taking it with him, the only other choice would be going to the metro campus, downtown, in rush hour, for some reason its scheduled at 5:30?? and although this prof is a screwball, I at least know that he is and would have some idea of what to expect.

I'm just really peaved because I feel like I've been just shooting in the dark when there was no need to be. It's like we're getting graded on how well we can read his mind. It was never made clear how he wanted his labs formatted, all my other chem professors were very clear how they wanted them right down to giving out sample lab reports, and that was how they wanted them and what they graded on was according to how you followed format (and if you did things correctly) and this guy acts like he doesn't care, and when I asked him about them (several times) I couldn't get a coherent answer, he is the type of person that if you asked him if the sky was blue or green he would say Yes.

He cares though, I know he does, he's going to pull out his red pen and go, what kind of an idiot wrote this report? They clearly have no clue how to write a lab report, he's going to cover it in red ink, and continue on grading like this, totally oblivious to the fact that that he never told us how he wanted them formatted and he never returned any so how should we know?

This isn't totally correct though, somewhere around week 8 he gave us an outline. It's totally opposite to what I've been doing right down to which side of the paper you put your name on, (right, I always put it on the left). So I'm thinking what I've been doing is nothing like what he wants, although he has never made what he wants clear, so I'm really peaved that he has a way he wants things, that he didn't tell us what he wanted, and that I've probably been doing things wrong, and I'm probably going to get a bad grade. I tried, I always try, in Chem II I would churn out 8-10 page reports because that was what was expected. I asked him several times about it, I want to do well in this class, I want to learn this stuff, or at least I used to, now I'm just kind of hovering in limbo, waiting, wondering why to even try since I'm almost sure its all been for naught and I'll probably end up dropping.

[Groggy]

I agree with what Joe said earlier. Tell him what your issues are and I would also mention that you are concerned about your GPA, especially given that you are not able to correct any previous errors or omissions in previous work because you have received no guidance to correct your ways.

You need the feedback to 'learn', otherwise each assignment reflects the same benchmark attempt.

I strongly suggest you also keep a record of all correspondence and a diary of conversations.

[Matt88s]

Well its over. I quit. I can't take it anymore.

The few people in the class, buddies from previous classes, that would say, "hang in there, we're going to make it", well, they've all dropped now so, uh, I guess we're not going to make it. My old chem II lab partner is still there and I hate to leave her, she's sweet, but she'll be fine, he's nice to the girls, he has some F-ed up problem with the guys though.

I feel screwed, gypped, denied. This was supposed to be me against Organic, not me against the professor.

Organic is said to be a bit of a weeding class, the tough make it and the weak don't. I wanted to see how I would measure up, I was going to make an A and kick ass and take names, that was my attitude going into the class, I was there learn, I was there to win.

I feel like I've been cheated out of that chance, even if I retake it, it won't be the same, I'll look like one of the failures that either couldn't cut it the first time around or didn't pay attention, didn't go to class, didn't seek help. I did though, I've only missed 1 lab all semester, I always went to class, I tried to get help, he wouldn't help though.

I'm in a daze, I don't know what happened. I feel sick.

This is going to really screw things up, I was supposed to graduate this spring, if I get into the DPT program I have to start in the fall. I have to. You can't just drop in, its a scheduled program. My financial aid is going to be yanked, my insurance is going to be effected, this is so wrong.

All I wanted was to do well, what happened? What the F happened?

I'm a good student, I show up on time, I pay attention, I've never been a troublemaker, I'm respectful, I say Sir, ?

I'm going in one last time tomorrow. See how things stand, take with him again about my grade.

It's over though, it's done. I'm can't take another day of his flipping back and forth, giving us guys hell but kissing up to the girls and helping them. I have to go up there to do the paperwork for the withdrawal anyhow though, so I might as well stop by and give it one last try, I don't know what I'm trying for and I'm so burned out and tired I wouldn't stay anyhow, I'm finished.
School is so wack, I guess in that perspective it prepares you for life. I'm so burned out, my schedule is screwed, I just want to drop out, get a bike maybe, go crazy for a while.

[RufflyRustic]

Matt, PLEASE don't give up just yet, you still have a fighting chance while you'r still in the class. If you give up now, when you've survived, yes SURVIVED so much already you put yourself into that position you've described above that you don't want to be in. Oh Please, I'm begging you.

Surely there is someone or department you can talk to, make a formal complaint to about this person. Are you able to talk to the others who were in this class and go and talk to someone in authority as a group. As a group you'd hold more sway and support each other through it all.

PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE Don't give!!!!!!!!

I do appreciate your feelings and the right to make your decision. Maybe go let off steam on a punching bag or something similiar if that's not your style. i don't know, kick a ball around, pine cones, mobile phone, .....


Wendy

[Cliff Rogers]

Yeah Matt, stick with it, get yourself a skirt & some makeup & turn up in drag.... psych the bugger out.

If he dares to ask, tell him.

[silentC]

For crying out loud, get over it. How are you going to be when you encounter a real challenge that involves someone's health or well being? You need to snap yourself out of this wallowing in despair crap and just get on with it.

Or maybe there's more to this 'weeding' business than you realise.

[dazzler]

Hi Matt

Go and turn on the telly and have a watch, no not the crap commercial channels, try PBS, and have a look at the world. You live in the most prosperous nation in the world - have a look at the rest of the world. They might bitch, but at least its about not having food or thier sister just being blown up.

You got nothing to whine about. Blunt but true .

Go with the flow, if hes as stupid as you think he is then this will show in the whole class and the matter will be reviewed by the school.

But sadly other than him being a slack a55, or maybe he is busy grading the 1000 papers you mentioned and hasent got around to you yet, there isnt that much tangible badness about him. Maybe Im missing something .

So relax, stop the tantrums and get back to work.

Oh, and welcome to the world.

[Matt88s]

But sadly other than him being a slack a55, or maybe he is busy grading the 1000 papers you mentioned and hasent got around to you yet, there isnt that much tangible badness about him. Maybe Im missing something .

I left a lot out. The labs are only the tip of the iceberg.

He has issues with the guys. He'll answer a question from a girl, and bend over backwards to make sure they have the concept, but if a guy asks, he'll either stare at them like you poor idiot and walk off without answering, (literally), or if you ask is it this or this he'll say, maybe, or give some answer that doesn't even make sense. I tried going to him for help early on in the semester when I got stuck on problems but he'd sit there and clam up and do the yes, no, maybe, I can't answer that, thing, so after a while I gave up. No sooner than I'd walk off a girl could wander up and ask a question and twenty minutes later he'd still be going gangbusters.

In lab, if he was mad, you just cringed because there were only four of us guys and we knew one of us was going to catch it, I never saw him go off on a girl, with us though it was just a matter of who and when. If a girl screwed up and messed up the lab you were working together on, guess who he'd take it out on, never mind you might have been on the other side of the lab when it happened, he'd treat you like it was your fault. If we had a question, we'd get one of the girls to ask it.

The first couple weeks I was employed as a target and example for the class, I couldn't answer anything correctly, even when I answered things correctly. Our first lab we turned in was nothing more than a data chart. He's a stickler for turning in individual lab reports, but on this lab he said since you and your lab partner were going to have identical data and thus charts, it was ok to turn in identical lab reports. I even saw him accept one report that had been signed by both partners. When me and my lab partner turned in our lab reports, he said hey, these are identical, I'll just have to split the grade between you two. It caught me totally off guard but I recovered and we argued a few minutes, aside from the fact he said we could do it I also asked how we were supposed to make them look different. He said you could have changed the orientation to landscape on one and made it a different color. (then print it out on the labs black and white printer ) This was on a chart he drew out on the board and labeled EXACTLY how it was supposed to be, (one of the few clear instructions he has given).

On exams, if a guy has a question, he'll just stare at them or say, I can't answer that. If a girl comes up to him and asks a question, he won't answer it outright, but he will point them in the right direction. We've all had professors that did one or another, but he's the first I've seen to do both and depending on the sex of the asker.

Tomorrow's the last day we can drop. I don't trust him not to take his issues out on me with that 30% of my grade he still hasn't graded. I don't want to drop, but its the only smart thing I think I can do. I've already talked to the counselors, and the general consensus is that although it really sucks my only choices are to stick it out and take the grade he gives me or drop.

The DPT program I want to get into is very competitive. Very. The way it is now I'll have to fight my way in, and I'll be lucky to get in. If my GPA drops anymore my goose is cooked. I can't risk some bipolar schizophrenic professor messing up my life anymore than he already has.

If I could wait longer to drop I would, I can't though, if I don't drop tomorrow I'll have to take whatever grade he decides to give me. I don't trust him not to take it to a personal level so I'm bailing.

For crying out loud, get over it. How are you going to be when you encounter a real challenge that involves someone's health or well being? You need to snap yourself out of this wallowing in despair crap and just get on with it.

Or maybe there's more to this 'weeding' business than you realise.

You think that hasn't already crossed my mind?

As for real challenges, I do fine, give me a bloodied accident victim or like issue and I won't blink an eye. Give me a nut who's screwing with me and has me backed into a corner with a lose lose situation, yes, I get a bit down.

Yeah Matt, stick with it, get yourself a skirt & some makeup & turn up in drag.... psych the bugger out.

If he dares to ask, tell him.

I have come so close to doing this. He wouldn't find it funny though and I'd only make things worse.

Thanks Wendy. I did consider getting the classmates to band up and talk to him together, and even talked to a person or two about it, but by then my spirits and others were flagging, and some who dropped just couldn't stand to be around him any more regardless of their grade, and some weren't even aware he hadn't graded the labs yet and that they were worth 30% of our grade.

[echnidna]

There's two types of people in this world, when faced with certain defeat

Those who give up if they think they're stuffed

And those who would rather lose while trying than to surrender
These are the truly outstanding people of society.

If its important I wouldn't toss the towel in.
for starters
Seek some advice from another Professor in a different discipline

[dazzler]

On ya matt for standing up to us loud mouths here.

Many would have sulked and cried.

Best of luck mate!

[Brickie]

Do what they do in America, get a gun and grade youre own paper..

[Matt88s]

There's two types of people in this world, when faced with certain defeat

Those who give up if they think they're stuffed

And those who would rather lose while trying than to surrender
These are the truly outstanding people of society.

If its important I wouldn't toss the towel in.
for starters
Seek some advice from another Professor in a different discipline

My motto used to be Do or die trying. Over time though I watched a lot of my mates die trying, and it occurred to me, if you're dead, you can't fight. If you blow your GPA, no matter how hard you try, that college won't accept you.

However if you slink off and regroup, maybe sacrifice a battle, you can come back to win the war with a vengeance.

If I choose, I could finish teaching organic to myself, then next semester could take his class again, utilize the material I have, his exams I have, use what I know about him to make him very miserable for a semester while still getting my A.

Or I could get a totally different professor at a different campus, actually enjoy the class, get my degree, and right before I walk out the door, find him, look him in the eye and say, I won. There's a lot of options when you're still alive.

I have talked with another professor, and the counselors at school, about all this. He was a big help, but once again theres just not much that can really be done.

On ya matt for standing up to us loud mouths here.

Many would have sulked and cried.

Best of luck mate!

Thanks Dazzler, but really if this was the worst I ever got thrown at me I'd count myself lucky, you guys just offered a bit of constructive criticism and honestly it wasn't bad advice. When I'm feeling down, I often remind myself that I have a warm place to sleep and food to eat and thats more than a scary number of people have. It kind of puts things in perspective.

Cheers!