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  1. #1
    Join Date
    Apr 2002
    Location
    Brisbane
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    0

    Default orbital swirls arggggh

    My little orbital sander is in discrace.

    I'm preparing some stock for a cabinet I'm making & I used my little palm sander to do a few bits of clean up on the pannels prior to futher processing.

    After grain filling & was running the random orbit over them to progress the finish.

    ARRRGH, look at those swirls.

    the orbital sander had left these uggly swirly wounds all over the place that took me some time to sand out.

    Now I supose I'm spoilt, i very rarely use the orbital for anything but edges, the random orbit does the flats for me so well.

    I now understand how people can get such uggly swirly marks all over the place that are sooooo hard to get out.

    beware your orbital sander and go easy with the gritt if you don't want swirls even 120 gritt can make a real mess.

    long live random orbit sanders

  2. #2
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Location
    Fife, Scotland
    Age
    60
    Posts
    11

    Default

    There is nothing worse.

    The thing that puzzles me is how two sanders fitted with the same paper, like the sanders I have can give different results.

    The cheap one makes a mess and the other more professional one can sand all day with no swirls.
    What is it that more expensive orbitals do that a cheap one does not?

    Cheers,
    Raymond.

  3. #3
    Join Date
    Jan 2002
    Location
    Yinnar, Victoria, Australia
    Age
    66
    Posts
    247

    Default

    At arough guess smiffy, the expensive ones RANDOM orbital sand where as the cheap ones ORBITAL sand.
    I try and do new things twice.. the first time to see if I can do it.. the second time to see if I like it
    Kev

  4. #4
    Join Date
    Feb 2003
    Location
    Garvoc VIC AUSTRALIA
    Posts
    3,208

    Default

    smiffy.
    I think it might be the speed.
    I got a cheap arlec OS from kmart, its a crap quality tool but its a lot higher speed than any other cheap orbital I have ever encountered and it gives a great finish

    Now if the infernal thing had better sheet holding clamps it would be an excellent tool, but sandpaper falling off all the time grrrrr.

    So my ROS is preferred
    Regards, Bob Thomas

    www.wombatsawmill.com

  5. #5
    Join Date
    Apr 2004
    Location
    McLaren Vale
    Age
    66
    Posts
    32

    Default

    I was so glad to see this post, as I had been wondering about the difference between orbital and ROS.

    I had also been thinking about purchasing a generic brand ROS for about $40 from Bunnings, but after reading all the previous posts, looks as that may not be a good idea.

    Do all ROS's have round disks, and if not, what is the preference? Any recommended brand?

    Thanks guys.

  6. #6
    Join Date
    Mar 2004
    Location
    Hornsby, NSW
    Age
    50
    Posts
    91

    Default

    mmcbain,

    Most ROS I know of have round sanding disks, usually 5" (125mm) or 6" (150mm).

    I have a bosch PEX400AE and am very happy with it, although you will find a range of opinions on ROS if you search through previous posts.

    If you are going to use it heaps, go for a good quality brand and hold on to it for years or if you want to take part in todays disposable society, get an elcheapo and throw it away after you have finished the job.

    Cheers
    Slavo

  7. #7
    Join Date
    Apr 2002
    Location
    Brisbane
    Posts
    0

    Default

    Any ros is better than none that said

    My mate chris had the cheap bosch ros & it was fine & beaut but he recently upgraded to the metabo duo after using mine & is a definite convert.

    The matabo goes for arround $375 on the street there were good deals last wood show on them.

    the festo machines have a real good rep and makita make one similar but my vote goes to the metabo.

    cheers

  8. #8
    Join Date
    Jul 1999
    Location
    Brisbane, Qld.
    Age
    48
    Posts
    579

    Default

    I won't go past Festo, When I was running my business I was running mine averaging 9hrs per day 5.5 days a week and never had a problem sanding the finest of dust particles. Metabo ran a close second but bearings were an issue with the fine dust and also comfort. I still have and use regurlarly my very first festo its replacement (i got on sale one day) is still sitting in its original packaging waiting for the old one to die, hasn't happened yet.....I would have gone through dozens of cheaper alternatives in the mean time..

    Cheers

  9. #9
    Join Date
    Mar 2003
    Location
    Sydney
    Posts
    29

    Default

    Hi All

    I also purchases a Bosch PEX400AE for about $150 at Bunnings and have been very happy with the results. I was going to purchase the smaller model for around $99 but was pursuaded to get the PEX400AE, and have newver regretted the decision. One thing that helped pusuade me towards the Bosch was the dust collection which seems to be excellent. When I empty the dustcollector and see the (almost talcum powder like) dust in there and almost non on the workpiece I think that is worth the premium over the el cheapos alone.

  10. #10
    Join Date
    Sep 2003
    Location
    Geraldton WA
    Posts
    54

    Default

    I've got a Bosch RAS, and actually hook it up to a household vac, rather then use the dust collection. It's great! no dust anywhere!!
    "Looking west with the land behind me as the sun tracks down to the sea, I have my bearings" Tim Winton

  11. #11
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Location
    Fife, Scotland
    Age
    60
    Posts
    11

    Default What about belt sanders?

    Sorry to deviate a wee bit away from the subject of this thread, but since we are on the subject of the differences between cheaper sanders, here goes....

    I can understand that more expensive random orbitals may do a better job than the cheapo ones maybe due to the way it randomizes its orbits.

    A belt sander on the other hand only drives a belt around, so surely the real tool here is the belt itself.
    I had a real job for my 'cheapest of the cheap' belt sander (£20 in our money) expecting it to fail. I sanded huge solid wood worktops for hours, the sander heated up alarmingly and it did have a tendancy to slow down a wee bit given some pressure, but other than that it did the job brilliantly.

    I half expected (and kind of hoped) that it would fail and thus have justification to get the Dewalt (£200) model I had my eye on. But damn, it is still doing its thing and I still have plenty of the dozen or so belts that came with it.
    Bloody good value for money then, because it happens to be about the same money to get that amount of belts.
    So what does a £200 belt sander have over a £20 one?

    The sander is a NUTOOL.
    My ROS is an ELU(remember them?) and between the two tools all my sanding needs are satisfied.

    Cheers,
    Ray.

  12. #12
    Join Date
    Jul 1999
    Location
    Brisbane, Qld.
    Age
    48
    Posts
    579

    Default

    The problem from a commercial view is the bearings. Besides ROS don't have belts, well not to my knowledge anyway. Once the fine dust gets into the bearings it won't last.

  13. #13
    Join Date
    Apr 2002
    Location
    Brisbane
    Posts
    0

    Default

    Your belt sander is a much more brutal device. I have one also.

    Probably one of the most important things to do to a belt sander is to flatten the platten and make sure it has a graphite slip cloth on the platten.

    a little tuning improved mine no end.

    one would ecpect the cheaper ones to be less well behaved.

    A belt sander can make a real serious mess if you aren't right on top of the method.
    forget the swirls, milimetre deep gouges.

    I use mine for general wood burchery.

  14. #14
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Location
    Fife, Scotland
    Age
    60
    Posts
    11

    Default

    What is that method Soundman?

    The worktops I mentioned I was sanding were 650mm wide made of two laminated planks. The source I bought the wood from were asked to dress it to 40mm but it was covered in deep planer marks and also actually ranged between 40mm and 43mm. As you can imagine after joining the two planks, I had big valleys and steps to take out as well as some pits where the suppliers planer did not touch the wood so it was all hairy. No to mention that I was sanding a particularily hard wood (Scottish ASH).

    I used a power planer to take some of the larger thickness differences away and then persevered with 60 grit on the belt sander for about 4 hours solid on a 3M length ...phew :eek:
    Then it was onto 100 grit for another two hours and finally 120 using the ROS.
    I wish I hired a floor sander.
    If you or anyone else can suggest a better way then I would be grateful.
    I was pleased with the result but it took a LOT of effort.

    I remember the days when I worked in a workshop with a large vertical belt sander with huge belts. The job would have been done in 10 minutes but then again my sanders belt is 75mm and the workshop machine was close to 1M.
    Ah...those were the days
    Last edited by Smiffy; 10th May 2004 at 07:55 AM.

  15. #15
    Join Date
    Apr 2004
    Location
    McLaren Vale
    Age
    66
    Posts
    32

    Thumbs up

    Thanks for all the info guys, I am much better informed and can now move to checking out equipment and actually know what I am looking for - a nice change.

    I must say as a new comer to woodworking / restoring, I am beginning to get quite excited about power tools ! !


    Cheers.

    Marls

    If you want more info, start another thread deidicated to your questions, pics.
    Last edited by Shane Watson; 10th May 2004 at 06:55 PM.

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