Attaching wood framing to solid brickwork

[silentC]

you are limited to one fixing every per stud

Yeah and don't you hate it when a 600mm cupboard just misses a stud on one side...

There's lot to be said for hanging cleats. I don't think they make pre-fab kitchens that way though...

[Bleedin Thumb]

Come to think of it IKEA does use some sort of mounting system.


https://www.woodworkforums.com/showthread.php?t=40617

[silentC]

Yep that's a jazzed-up version of hanging cleat. They're good for longer runs on stud walls with various smaller cabinet sizes because you can fix into every stud and it doesn't matter if a smaller cabinet only hits one stud (or none). Probably not worth the effort for a single cabinet, but then again...

[Bleedin Thumb]

Would you use hanging cleats for your base cabinets or just wall units?

Would they save time if attaching straight to brick? I've never seen them used before.

[silentC]

Only for the wall cabinets. The weight of the base cabinet is on the base, so you only need to screw to the wall to keep them in place.

The idea is that you construct the cabinet with a rear top rail that has a slight chamfer on the bottom (about 8-10 degrees), sloping up inwards. The cleat has a matching chamfer on the top sloping the other way. This locks them together when you hang the cabinet. You have a straight batten fixed to the wall near the bottom of the cabinet same thickness as the cleat and you screw the bottom of the cabinet to that. The side panels (or gables as some people call them) cover the gap between the wall and the back of the cabinet. You lose about 20mm or so in depth.

I'd imagine that if you were doing a long run, fixing a cleat would be quicker because you just cut it to the length of the run and plumb it up, then the cabinets just hang off it.

I don't expect many kitchen suppliers would be able to supply them like this though.

[Bleedin Thumb]

Thanks Silent, you know what a pain it is leveling the base cabinets, I thought that if you set your hanging cleat dead level, hang your base carcasses then just adjust the legs to hit the floor.

Oh well back to lying on the floor with a spirit level as a companion.

[silentC]

Being a bit of a cheap skate, I use a full length separate base which you level up and then sit the cabinets on top. Those legs are good if you want to use the clip on kickers but are a bit of a hassle to level unless you're doing it all the time and have a method.

[Bleedin Thumb]

Are you talking about a sheet of malamine that you leveled up first? What good thinking.. is it very noticable when you open the doors or did you recess it a bit ( used it as a top support for the kick board maybe).

I wish I'd thought of that.

[celeste]

Good thought...I could do the above but add a dimple (counter sunk) washer to allow for the plug sized hole. Can I use a mortar drill bit to drill through the wood or do they make bits that do wood and brick. Or do I have to pre drill the wood?
This is getting tedious, I intend to fit a pre-fab (IKEA) kitchen soon onto double brick. Thats why I'm trying to solve this little issue first.

(Thinks, blimey, should have bought non-brick!)

Hi all

OK now we know what you are doing - I install IKEA kitchens all the time.

1st forget that it is double brick, you only have to deal with one lot of bricks.
2nd I use green plugs and screws approx. 50mm and a 6.5mm masonry bit - you will find IKEA have excellant brackets etc for hang, so that accuracy is not that important.

For example the wall cabinets have a bracket that slides onto the screws, you tighten and put on the cover. steps - make cabinet, line up on wall level (I have been using milk crates with off cuts to get them at the right height 600 - 650 above the bench) mark hole location via the bracket, take down drill knock in plug - sorry brain freeze - can't remember if you put in screw b4 or after placing the cabinet back up - anyway slide cabinet into position, tighten and put cover.

There are no holes to drill in the IKEA Cabinets they're all set up.
You only need to drill holes in the walls. tho you do need a 5mm bit to extend the shelving holes right thru to attach cabinets together. I love IKEA. Sooooo easy. they even supply the screws for this. excellant.

I am 5ft nothing and hang them on my own. IKEA are really easy.

celeste

[silentC]

Are you talking about a sheet of malamine that you leveled up first? What good thinking.. is it very noticable when you open the doors or did you recess it a bit ( used it as a top support for the kick board maybe).

I wish I'd thought of that.

No, you just make the cabinets as usual but instead of fitting the adjustable legs, you make up a separate base which consists of a frame same footprint as the run of cabinets with the front edge inset by 100m from the front face of the cabinet. You make this up with MDF, chipboard or ply or whatever and it's the same height as you want your kickers to be (eg. 100mm). Then you put it in position on the floor and level it up, fix it to the wall and scribe (if necessary) and fit the kicker. Then you place your cabinets on top of it and screw them down to the base and back to the wall.

It gives you a level platform to work on and I reckon it's easier than winding those bloody feet up and down on individual cabinets until they're all level. But then like I say if you're doing it all the time it's probably easy. I suppose they use them for a reason.

The separate base is cheaper too because you can use up offcuts of the cabinet material and you don't need any special hardware.

People like the removable kickers because they can clean under them. Personally, if the kicker is scribed to the floor I can't see the need.

[journeyman Mick]

BT,
my method for fitting base cabinets, which I've arrived at after fitting them for quite a few years is a hybrid. I got myself a Stanley laser level which i set up top shoot a horizontal line on the wall the height of my kicker (usually 150mm, but it can vary +/- depending on requirements). I rip 15mm exterior ply into 150mm strips. I can get this in 3M long sheets which is handy for this. I use exterior ply because I don't ever want to get a waranty call back because someone has flooded their kitchen and the kickers are disintegrating. This ledge is fixed with appropriate fixings (screws, nails, nylon anchors, depending on wall)

I use a plastic leg assembly from Lincoln Sentry which has the leg folded into the base. I fit these in the workshop. I place the 1st base cabinet (usually an insside corner) on the ply ledge. Bend down whilst holding the cabinet against the wall and snap the feet down into position. I then use a short level to level the box front to back. Repeat for next box. I usually predrill the boxes in the workshop for screws through the sides to fix into adjacent boxes. I always fix through the inside of drawer carcasses as theses screws won't show at all. Any other screws I'll use white painted wafer heads as these look pretty neat.

I reckon this is the fastest way to fit them, and with the leg assemblies being about a dollar a pop it's cost effective.

Mick

[silentC]

Must get myself one of those laser levels. I suppose you could ping a chalk line using the water level and measure down to the kicker. Worth thinking about anyway...

[Bleedin Thumb]

Mick, that is by far the easiest way I've heard of doing it. I'm not familiar with the fold down legs but I get the picture.
The only drayback that I can see is fitting the kick boards - I take it that you use those plastic snap ons, which I find a bit dodgy.

I ended up using sikaflex to glue beading top and bottom for my kickers - a bit of a pain but I know that kids or brooms aren't going to dislodge them.

[journeyman Mick]

BT,
the plastic clips on the "Star" brand legs (the fold down ones I use) are quite positive in their engagement. I always seal the kicker to the floor with clear silicone to prevent water being drawn up into the board and swelling it up. I doubt very much it could be dislodged with a broom or mop. I find the kicker hard to unclip even before it's been sealed to the floor.

Mick

[rod1949]

Ankascrews, try em you'll love em they're absolutely brilliant. They are like using a self tapping screw into metal, but into concrete, brick etc http://www.ramset.com.au/public/Arti...lID=3&menuNo=4

I've used em to bolt down my steel framed house to the slab. The structural engineered plans said to use wait for it... 50mm x 10mm dynabolts, I thought that was a joke along with the problem of exploding the concrete as they would only be 30mm from the edge of the slab. So I sussed out what else was available and found / used these Ankascrews 75mm x 12mm. I was able to tighten them up till I was blue in the face with no slab damage.