Built-in Advice

[Kiz]

Hi Everyone,

I was hoping to get some advice about built-ins...:confused:

I'm in a 1950s home... and in the hallway there is a four door old-fashioned built-in. The wall it is on is also my bedroom wall.

I was wanting to find out if it would be an easy job to switch the access for the cupboard, so it becomes a built-in for my bedroom and just a wall in the hallway.

Does that make sense?

I know absolutely nothing about this sort of stuff, but being in the country, getting a builder is next to impossible. I have a few mates who are a bit handy... but I just wanted to find out a bit more about what I would be getting myself in for.

If you need any more info, just let me know -- and I'll find out what I can.

Thanks so much for your help!

Cheers, Kiz

[namtrak]

Hi Everyone,

I was hoping to get some advice about built-ins...:confused:

I'm in a 1950s home... and in the hallway there is a four door old-fashioned built-in. The wall it is on is also my bedroom wall.

I was wanting to find out if it would be an easy job to switch the access for the cupboard, so it becomes a built-in for my bedroom and just a wall in the hallway.

Does that make sense?

I know absolutely nothing about this sort of stuff, but being in the country, getting a builder is next to impossible. I have a few mates who are a bit handy... but I just wanted to find out a bit more about what I would be getting myself in for.

If you need any more info, just let me know -- and I'll find out what I can.

Thanks so much for your help!

Cheers, Kiz

Sounds do-able - but photos would help

Cheers

[Barry_White]

Being a 50's house I dare say it wouldn't have roof trusses but would be a pitched roof so you would just have to make sure the top plate of where you want to put the door isn't load bearing e.g. have a look in the roof and see if there are any timbers sitting on the top plate like struts etc.

If there are you would have to put a decent head in the doorway. If there isn't any you would be able to cut your studs out to make your doorway.

[silentC]

There are only a couple of things I can think of that might cause you a problem:

1. The wall could be load-bearing. In a 1950's house there's good chance it is. In that case, you would have to look at alternative support for the roof. Probably switching it to the new bit of wall would be the way. You would have to dismantle the existing door opening and replace it with a full-height stud wall if that was the case.

2. There may be utilities running through the wall, most likely power but there could be water too, depending on the situation. You'd need to reroute these.

Otherwise, I agree it sounds do-able

[floobyduster]

The main thing you will have to check is to see if it is a load bearing wall - ie does it support the roof. If it does you would need to beef up the studs on either side of the cupboard and put a supporting beam across the top or as it is a 4 door wide cupboard a supporting post in the middle may suffice or reduce the size of a beam if needed. Hope that all makes sense.

[floobyduster]

Snap looks like great minds think alike

[journeyman Mick]

There are only a couple of things I can think of that might cause you a problem:

1. The wall could be load-bearing. In a 1950's house there's good chance it is. In that case, you would have to look at alternative support for the roof. Probably switching it to the new bit of wall would be the way. You would have to dismantle the existing door opening and replace it with a full-height stud wall if that was the case.

2. There may be utilities running through the wall, most likely power but there could be water too, depending on the situation. You'd need to reroute these.

Otherwise, I agree it sounds do-able

I'd add:

3. Are any of the walls clad in asbestos cement sheeting? You need to identify any asbestos present and take steps to ensure that your reno isn't going to kill you or your family or friends in the long run. (Sorry to sound so melodramatic, but this is serious stuff.)

Mick

[Honorary Bloke]

FWIW, if I understand what you want to do, then I think it is fairly simple. I am assuming that the built-in is now recessed into the wall with the back of it being your bedroom wall. If so, it doesn't matter what the wall is, because the cabinet is already there and you are not going to remove it, just switch the doors to the other side and gyprock what used to be the front and turn it into a wall. Right? Should be easy enough for anyone a bit handy. Save the doors for the other side. Cut out the gyprock covering it in the bedroom, add a face-frame for the doors and attach. On the hall side, cover with gyprock.

Or am I missing something?:confused:

[silentC]

Or am I missing something?

I think you are because the wall which is presently the back of the cupboard and to become the opening in the front of it could be holding up the roof, so if he just cuts a hole in it, he may get a surprise.

[Bleedin Thumb]

Does the fact that it may be load bearing matter as it is quite common to use a bulkhead above cupboards. you just span the opening with the bulkhead to take the load? Or am I blowing smoke?

[journeyman Mick]

BT,
you can buld a load bearing bulkhead, but you need to be aware of the loadbearing requirements of the wall before you go cutting an opening into it. . You'd need top prop the opening before cutting it and fit an appropriately sized head (and tie downs if required).

Mick

[Bleedin Thumb]

Mike how do you determine the load bearing on a wall besides looking at the roof frame and going "Yep dat looks heavy"
What I'm asking is
1. Is there any way of quantifying it without engaging an engineer?
2. Are there span tables with predetermined load bearing factors.

Surely builders are confronted with this situation all the time that is builders that haven't had these problems sorted by the architects (using engineers) before the builder comes along.
Cheers
Tony

[Barry_White]

Years ago when engineers never got involved in house frames all the old carpenters knew how to cut a roof and brace it using all the proper timbers.

It's only since the advent of trusses and radiata pine that engineers became involved in designing house frame. Most house house frames used to be made out of good old Australian hard wood.

There aren't many carpenters today that would know how to pitch a hand cut roof.

[journeyman Mick]

BT,
with a hand pitched roof, it's easy enough to see whether a wall is load bearing simply by getting up in the ceiling and having a look. There are span tables which will give member sizes dependant on type, span and stength grade. It will be harder to determine whether a wall is a bracing wall without having plans to look at and before any lining comes off. Bracing wall usually abut an exterior wall. They used to use diagonal battens cut into the studs to brace this wall, which would, in turn, prevent wind pressure from pushing in the exterior wall. Nowadays sheet bracing is used, ply or fibro usually or metal strapping.

Mick

[b1ueshift]

This discussion about load bearing elements may be getting a little bit ahead of itself. Does the back of the cupboard even go up to the ceiling?