U Beaut and ethics!!

[Iain]

Despite the title this is not questioning Neils ethics but more from a finishing prospective.
I do a little restoration work on the side and this includes some French Polishing, so far so good, I use Shellac supplied by Neil, and a lot of elbow grease.
Now we enter the ethical side of matters, some people have an old piece and are not prepared to pay for polishing or cannot afford it and in this instance I am happy to use shellac with EEE paste and wax, I tell them that this is not French poliushing but is still what I would call a traditional finish.
Now comes the hard bit, for table tops and the like I have a passion for Hard Shellac, now given that this is a polymerised(sp) finish and I have applied it to an old piece of furniture and finished the same way as just plain shellac does this devalue the piece that I have just applied it to.
I like to think it is a natural product therefore traditional in the sense it is shellac based and the EEE and wax are also traditional and natural products.
I feel that using this product I have probably saved a nice piece of furniture being adulterated by some cretin with a tin of estapol and a paintbrush but by the same token have no desire to be burnt by the so called experts and devalue the piece in question.
Opinions please ladies and gentlemens............

[silentC]

Can Hard Shellac be repaired like the normal stuff?

[Iain]

Never had to try so I don't know but, I put some on a floor in a high traffic area about six months ago and it is fine still, and had all sorts of spills, this suggests that it cannot be cut back in the traditional manner but I still like it for tabletops.

[masoth]

" ......... does this devalue the piece that I have just applied it to."

Absolutely not!

Ethically, the only point I can make is that you should, if asked, explain what you've done with the piece, and what the "technical" differences are.

Remember, experts are drips under pressure, and often self-appointed.

soth

[TassieKiwi]

I guess you could use old classic vehicles as an analogy. One could insist on 1930's paint technology over the $20k panel reso job ( where they used modern rust treatment/mig/tig/filler), or modern duco/clearcoat/power buff/polymer polish. Still a classic, and better protected to last another 100 years, without detracting from the object.

You're not ladling on 2-pot laquer, but using an 'enhanced' natural product. I guess you need to explain to the punters?

[Eastie]

Why not just follow the directions Neil has given relating to this product and apply it over the top of a couple of coats of normal, unhardened shallac?

Just a wild guess, but I recon he's thought of this and thus the advice...

[Markw]

By declaring to the owner, of the modification to the piece by using these products you have met your due dilligence. Proof of this is another matter. Maybe a document of understanding and a signed approval by the owner to continue would certainly save your bacon if someone got nasty at a later date.

[rsser]

I understand it is harder to repair than the normal stuff and wonder how many standard shellac coats would be needed (following Eastie's point) to put a softer base under it to make removal/repair easier.

[Sturdee]

I believe that what you are doing is perfectly okay. Hard shellac is still shellac and has been used for centuries. There are many old time recipes around for making hard shellac so it is an authentic shellac finish.

The only difference is that it is not french polished which you are telling your clients. BTW I understand that you can french polish using hard shellac.

Peter.

[Shedhand]

I guess at the end of the day it all comes down to the willingness and /or the ability of the client/owner to keep the piece looking its best. If they haven't got the enthusiasm or desire then the hard shellac will be a selling point and is what I'd be telling them. In addition I don't believe the type of traditional natural organic finish will affect the value. It wouldn't if I was a buyer.
My threepence ha'penny worth.
Cheers

[ubeaut]

Hard shellac has been around for well over 150 years in one form or another. Ours is just a more modern day version of an old principal. Admittedly a bit tougher but none the less it is still shellac. If applied with a rubber as other shellac, it is French polish. If brushed on like other shellacs it is a shellac finish.

The only major problem as I see it lies in the fact that it is only available in the Dewaxed White (bleached shellac) form and not in the traditional brown shellac that most antiques are commonly finished with.

However, if I was doing a table top for a client I would be explaining what I was applying and why, also the fact that it is still a traditional shellac or french polished finish with a hardener added to help preserve and protect the natural beauty of the timber from the modern rigours of ignorant, untrained owners, their children and their guests, etc.

Cheers - Neil

[Iain]

Thanks everyone and Neil, the 150 years pretty much covers a lot, I just want to cover my backside when explaining that this is pretty much the same as shellac but a lot more durable, without the added nasties such as estapol, not that I am suggesting that this is anything like estapol
Unfortunately some peasants like to make a song and dance about something of which they know nothing and I think this would be a classic case in question.