Church Hall Floor

[chrisp]

I'm looking for advice on finishing a hardwood (vic ash variety) floor in a church hall. The flooring is about 50 years old and the existing finish has been completely worn away.

The hall is used for a number of purposes: coffee/tea after the Sunday service (with elderly people walking on it); badminton; dancing lessons; mother's group (with young children); and the occasional play performance (with metal ganged chairs dragged across the floor :eek: ) .

There is some contention as to what finish should be used. I understand from another thread that the wax used on the finish determines the suitability of the floor for the intended purpose.

What finish would you recommend, film or penetrating? What finish would be the easiest to maintain or refinish? And what wax would you recommend?

Any advice on this matter would be much appreciated.

Chris

[glock40sw]

For very heavy usage like you mention.
The best I can suggest is 2 pack polyurethane.

Hard and durable but will scratch. Not as bad as the other finishes.

[chrisp]

Trevor,

Thanks for the reply. What I was wondering though, would it be better to use a less durable finish (such as one-pack poly, water based or an oil finish) that would no doubt scratch easier but would it be easier to recoat?

I've heard that two-pack has to be completely stripped to refinish, where as one-pack only needs to be scuff sanded. Is this correct?

Chris

[glock40sw]

G'day Chris.

You may be right.

I never thought of that.
Give the blokes at Timber Queensland a call.
They are in the book.

[Sturdee]

There is some contention as to what finish should be used. I understand from another thread that the wax used on the finish determines the suitability of the floor for the intended purpose.

Chris

Chris,

From the intended use I think you need a non slip floor and wax applied on your final finish can give this to you.

But when you apply the wax DO NOT polish this out or buff it up but leave the wax surface as applied. Whilst the wax will be buffed up by the activities taking place it should remain a dull surface. If you polish out the wax it becomes smooth and shiny and extremely slippery.

Once it was been waxed get some of the granulated wax and regularly scatter a few handfulls around the floor when the floor seems to get too smooth. This will retain your non slip surface.

Most places where I go dancing each night they scatter wax flakes on the floor and that is all the maintenance it ever gets. Some places where they don't (usually Town halls - where the cleaners don't know) are too slippery for comfortable dancing.

Peter.

[Wood Butcher]

Remind me of a time when I helped a touring irish dancing troup set up in the local hall for a show. They were really concerned that the stage floor was way too slippery to dance on. I ran across the road to the shops and grabbed 4 litres of coke and a kilo of suger. Mixed it up and mopped the floor with it. That floor was a sticky as it gets. They loved it. Not sure if the cleaner was happy the next day when he came to clean the hall though

[chrisp]

Peter,

Thank you for your reply. The suitability of the floor for the various different purposes the hall is used for is a point of contention. I'm of the view that a non-slip surface is what is called for - I'm particularly concerned that the elderly and infirm to not take a slide on a slippery floor. (I suspect that badminton players would prefer a non-slip surface as well.)

I like the idea of the wax top coat, firstly for its non-slip properties, but also because I suspect that it could also be used as a sacrificial coating (for when the chairs are dragged across it).

As the existing floor is very much down to bare timber, you can probably guess that there has not been any sort of wax applied to this floor for a considerable period and I don't have any knowledge on floor waxes. Do you have any information on the sort of wax the dance halls use, either for the initial wax coating, or the flakes used for the subsequent top-up?

Chris

[Larry McCully]

howdy bro, i am a floor sander, also we use a comunity hall for our own church, it is a parquetry floor with single pac polyurathane on it . during the day , all sorts of activity are happening on it from day care to net ball to functions . we also drag chairs and tables across it....and i can tell you it is holding up under the treatment. the coating is about 3 years old, and i recon its got about another 3 to 5 years left before it will need another coat.Solvent based polyurathane is the most durable and is easy to apply. It is also reparable if it gets scratched. in your case i would not worry about any other finnish,or you will be forever maintaining it, ........GB

[Larry McCully]

i forgot to ask if you are intending to sand the floor before you recoat, because you will need to take the floor back to timber for you to have any sucess. you can not coat over a wax finish with polyurathane to easly. their is a process you can do that will allow poly to take to wax, but you will be better of if you resand and recoat.

[chrisp]

Larry,

Thank you for the replies (and the PM).

I intend that the church hall floor will be sanded to bare timber before refinishing. Actually, apart from the edges the finish is completely gone. One of the reasons I want to recoat the floor is that I get asked to remove the black stains on the floor where wet iron has been in contact with the floor. I can't see any point in removing the stains unless the floor is going to be recoated.

I've used 2-pack poly, one-pack (oil based?) poly, and water based floor finishes in a different application (my place ). From my limited experience, I prefer the one-pack finishes to the two-pack - I found they are much easier to apply and I don't want to completely re-strip the floors to recoat. My favorite so far has been the water based - incredibly easy, fast to apply and dry – and it the first time I’ve managed to reuse the same applicator for all coats!

For the church hall I was leaning towards a one-pack finish (either oil-based poly or water-based) for ease of refinishing. I was also interested to find out more about the waxes as well – a non-slip finish is important (and I’d have trouble with my conscience if someone was to slip and injure themselves). I'm hoping someone in the forum will have some info on suitable floor waxes.

Do you have any views or recommendations on re-finishing the one-pack coatings? Is it just a matter of scuff sanding and recoating? And, are the results okay?

Chris

[Sturdee]

Chris,

I have asked the promotor of one of the dances I go to about the waxes. Unfortunately he could not give specific details because it depends on the kind of floor finish that you use. How smooth and slippery it is etc and he would have to see and try out the floor first before giving out advice.


He advised that it is mainly a trial and error situation and he suggested that you try various waxes in small areas. It may be worth while to contact some of the larger cleaning supply companies and see if they have a rep specialising in floor surfaces who can give advice after having seen your floor.


He did tell me that when he hires the Springvale town hall for his annual dinner dance that the floor there is too smooth and fast so he scatters soap flakes around which makes the floor less slippery.


Sorry I can't be of more help.


Peter.

[jimc]

Sounds like a perfect situation to use Whittle Wax. Check out their website. They have applied this finished to hotel lobbies and dance floors around the world.

I can personally vouch for the tough finish...had it applied to my floors 18 months ago and my drive is crushed rock with no major ill effect.

The best bit is if a major scratch does occur....refinish that specific area only with wet and dry sand paper with more treatex.

check it out.

[Larry McCully]

hi mate, all finnishes are only a matter of a light sand back or a keying in the top coat only os a light scuffing as you call it. all minor scratches will disapear with any recoating of any finnish from oils to polys. it gets down to how much time you are prepared in maintaining the floor. as far as wax is concerned..... they are fine but any spillage of water will discoulor that spot, but a wipe with a waxy rag will bring it back. yes it can get slippery, but i have seen it used in a city council hall for a few years with success. for that application you will need to sand the floor and apply 2 x coats of tung oil , wait one week for it to harden, then apply a wax coating by mopping it on and buffing it in using a polyvac polishing machine. regular buffing will bring the floor back to looking like brand new, but it is a lot of work. a spirit wax is the best. their is another product you may want to consider....... orogan oil.... this product is flood coated on then buffed into the floor. this one is a penertrating oil with no film on top. you dont need to wax this one. it is fine for heavy traffic. but it still needs maintainance.