Shanes Tip

[Shane Watson]

Another option to remove ( strip ) old finish ( Shellac etc ), rather than paint stripper. Is to Rub the old finish with Methylated Spirits and a course steel wool..
Rather messy, but not as toxic!!

Cheers

Shane....

[Mac Simmons]

Hi Shane,

Methylated Spirits, over here, is a combination of Ethyl, and Methly Alcohols.

Methyl Alcohol, is also known as Methanol, which is "Wood Alcohol", this is very a very poisonus, and toxic solvent.

Gloves, and a respirator should be used with these solvents.

Cheers,

Mac

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[Shane Watson]

Mac,

Don't know if we are talking the same thing. We use Methylated spirits to dilute Shellac flakes etcs. I think from memory you guys call it something different. I will check it out though. Geez, I have been using this stuff for years unprotected

Thanks Mac!!!

Cheers

Shane...

[Mac Simmons]

Hi Shane,
We use "Denatured Alcohol", which could be one of many combinations of solvents.

This is one formula, that is used.

90% Ethyl Alcohol, 7% Methanol, 5% Isopropyl Alcohol, 2.3% Methly Isobutyl Ketone
The denaturants being the Methonal,Isopropyl and the MIK.

I use 50% of Denatured Alcohol, and 50% of Lacquer Thinners, to remove Shellac finishes.

G'Day

Mac

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[Shane Watson]

Hi Mac,

Just got the MSDS on Metholayted spirits.

Unfortunately it dosn't give the ingrediants.
But does go on to say that it may cause mild skin irrations and possible dermatitas. Suggest's using gloves and goggles as well! I'll have to start!!

Obviously with all chemicals mild or toxic, all precautions should be followed.

I find it strange though, I have seen countless home decorating or DIY shows on TV that suggest using " Metho " to clean windows. And they never seem to be using gloves etc. And it usually isn't diluted down with water eiter.

Anyway, lets face it, it will still be certainly a lot safer than stripper. And if it can be used as an alternative, then well and good. I know I don't like using stripper, the ole' MC is enough to scare me off it!!

Cheers

Shane....

[lushy]

Metho is classed as a low toxic bit of gear as most alc

[Shane Watson]

Actually Mac, you may find this interesting!!

I have heard that you can purchase " Metho " chilled from pubs in some states of Australia! Aprantly some people don't mind a drop or two

Shane..

[ubeaut]

G'Day people.

I'm sorry folks, but you can't drink the metho it's got methanol (methyl alcohol), pyridine and traces of methyl violet in it to make the drinker throw up immediately. It is completely unpalatable. However they tell me if you strain it through a loaf of white bread then it can be drunk and I guess so would be the drinker. (I would suggest that this like the story of it being sold on ice is a complete fallacy, however I believe it was actually kept on ice many years ago before they started adding the poisons etc.) It is cheaper to buy good quality whisky than to remove these additives, and I'll warrant it would be a site tastier than the metho.

Methylated spirits is Ethanol. In Australia it is sold as 100%IMS (Industrial Methylated Spirits) or as 95% Methylated Spirits the latter being the one that is readily available. The 100%IMS must be asked for specifically and as a rule is not available in hardware shops etc..

Most commercially available premixed shellac is made using 95%. (Except for U-Beaut's which uses the 100%) 95% contains about 5% water along with the other mentioned nasties. 100% only contains the nasties.

Pure Ethanol is not available to the general public in Australia. It almost takes an act of parliament to give someone the rights to purchase and use it, the price is horrific and it can only be used under the strictest government supervision. Can't have the workers getting cheap booze.

To the best of my knowledge in the US the meths is known as Ethanol, Alcohol, Ethyl Alcohol or Denatured Alcohol. Most of the Oz metho is distilled from sugar by CSR. By the way if you are having trouble getting your shellac to melt down it is possible that there is more than 5% water in the brand of metho you buy. Some unscrupulous manufacturers have been known to use as much as 15 - 20% water possibly more. SHAME on them It would probably be best to stick with a well known brand name and steer clear of the cheaper brands. Or maybe see if you can purchase the 100% IMS. (Usually available from good paint suppliers in 4 litre tins occasionally in 1 litres)

Macs method of mixing thinners and meth probably has a little more merit for stripping and should also allow you to use it on old nitro finishes much more effectively. As for myself I prefer a good commercial stripper that can wash off in water. It only takes a few minutes to do what a metho wash will take hours to do.

In our classes we apply a coat of stripper and cover it with a cling wrap or tinfoil this stops it drying out too quickly and helps it to penetrate deeply. Five minutes later the cover is removed and the lot comes off easily, all the excess and stripped junk goes into the covering foil or cling wrap and is chucked into the bin. For turned sections we don't scrape but use a scrubbing brush and hot soapy water. This sets up a reaction with the stripper that helps it to clean of beautifully.

Bet there are a few out there with different ideas.

Cheers
Neil

[Shane Watson]

Well there you go, can't get much better than that for an explanation!! Good stuff Neil!!
Unfortunately, The true fact of it all, is that some people do resort to drinking Meths. Without going into it with detail, both in this post and my previous, I can say it does happen. Sad but true.
Also, the idea of using Meths to strip finish is that because Shellac is thinned/diluted by meths it will obviously work as a stripper ( maybe not as harsh or quick as stripper though ). Most home handy people don't stock stripper, but you could almost garuntee that they have some metho somewhere round the house.. Actually, I know a lot of refinishers that prefer this method over stripper due to it not being harsh on the timber and that once you've gone over it it can be refinished almost immediatly ( dependant of the finished look required. )
Ain't it just great we can all learn different methods. Expand our horizons!!
Oh, by the way, I would never suggest going out and buying a bottle of meths to have a taste!!!

Cheers

Shane.....

[Mac Simmons]

Hi Mates,

Let me try to explain about "Alcohols" over here.

"Ethanol" is made from grains, oats, barley, and other organic plants.
It is distilled into different types of drinking alcohols. (booze)

The Alcohol content, is counted as "Proofs". In other words, if it contains 90% of Alcohol it will state, it is 180 proof. (Proof is double the alcohol content)

As Ethanol Alcohol is used for different drinking liquors, there is a tax on all bottled "Alcohol Liquor".

If the Alcohol is "denatured" ( by adding almost any chemical that make the Alcohol poisinous, it is then called "Denatured Alcohols") There are no taxes paid on any "denatured alcohols".

Methanol, is Methyl Alcohol, or Wood Alcohol, it is a toxic (poisinous) alcohol, that is why it is added, to the Ethonal to "denature it", so it is NOT fit for consumption (to drink)

There are Alcohols that are sold over here, that do not contain any water, they are called Anhydrous Alcohols. (Absolute Alcohols)

As far as using water to wash off the remover or any other chemicals on woods.

Only some one, who uses a "flow over system" use water.

I personally, would never use water, it takes a while to completly dry out, it raises the moisture content in the woods, it also raises the woods grains. Plus it not that great, at removing most finishes "residue".


G'DAY

Mac

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[RETIRED]

Mac.

By crikeys mate, we might get you speaking Australian yet.

I refer to your G'DAY.

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Ian () Robertson
"We do good turns every day"






[This message has been edited by (edited 07 September 1999).]

[Mac Simmons]

Hi Ian,

It certainly would be better, then having a Brooklyn accent. ( as I have now.)

I find, that you all have a good sense of humor.

Which is something, I also enjoy.

G'day Mate

Mac

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[RETIRED]

Mac, Brooklyn Eh. My brother lives in Brooklyn some where. I'll have to check out his address and let you know. He's not a woodie (computer geek).

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Ian () Robertson
"We do good turns every day"

[Mac Simmons]

What a small world.

My family still lives there.

I live on Long Island. I have been out here about 30 years.

Are you originally from Australia?

G'day

Mac



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[RETIRED]

Mac

Are you originally from Australia?

Definately an Aussie and proud of it.

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Ian () Robertson
"We do good turns every day"