Attitudes to the road toll

[MAPLEMAN]

maybe not


but then, very few of us would have been habitual car thieves

What ever you reckon mate...MM

[aldav]

I haven't read this whole thread so apologize in advance if this has already been covered. Start rant.

Some of the stupidest drivers I see are the ones who take no action (read slow down) when they can see the potential for an accident immediately in front of them. Yes, it's like they're in a hurry to get there to see how much havoc can be created. Two cases in point:
1. Following 3 other vehicles spaced about 100 metres apart on the Hume Hwy in Southern NSW. Car second in line starts to veer off to the left shoulder of the road, corrects it's course, but my radar is instantly on high alert. Shortly after it veers completely off the road into the long grass (don't ask me how he didn't find something to hit in there), does a couple of 180's and veers back on to the road still traveling at speed. Car number 3 behind him doesn't slow at all, still doing 110kmh. He could have gone anywhere! I'd slowed so much he was still well ahead when he pulled back on to the road.
2. New Years Eve about 11:00pm traveling South on the Princes Hwy in a line of traffic coming in to Bomaderry. Driver two cars ahead has made several moves that indicate he is very keen to pass. Pulls out to overtake as we're approaching the 70 speed limit signs, car coming the other way has to pull partially off the road to avoid a collision. Driver in front of me doesn't slacken his pace at all, I'm dropping back steadily at the first sign of the other drivers indiscretion.

As long as there are drivers as dumb as these people with a drivers licence the road toll has no hope of coming down. Don't get me started about the ones that can't stay on their side of the road regardless of how slow they go.

Rant over.

[DavidG]

My father taught me a few things about driving.
No point in being dead right.
Time is a friend. The more you have between you and an incident the better.

[Dibbers]

So I'm on another forum unrelated to Woodwork (My NRL teams fan forum actually), and in the Politics Thread (dangerous thing to follow that, almost as fraught with danger as the Religion Thread!) there was a post that i thought was highly applicable to this discussion. Its a bit of a read, but a pretty decent summary by a seemingly ignored subject matter expert of sorts.

This is a letter written to the PM by the CEO of Toll about recent fatalities involving trucks.....its a bit of a read, but is well worth it.


11 January 2018

The Hon Malcolm Turnbull MP Prime Minister Parliament House CANBERRA ACT 2600


Dear Prime Minister

Recent media reports have highlighted what we in the transport industry already know all too well - Australia has a dire road safety problem. In the five years to 2016, more than 1,000 people were killed in truck crashes. Our approach to heavy vehicles in this country is core to tackling this issue.

We have heard from many experts across government and academia on what needs to be done to improve road safety, and we thank them for their important contributions. I write to you to as the leader of Australia’s largest transport and logistics company, Toll Group, and the former leader of Linfox, the second largest transport company. I’ve worked in the trucking business since I was 13 years old, and am a second generation industry veteran with my mother having run a highly successful transport business.

I offer you a different perspective to this important discussion on what must be done to improve safety on our roads. I bring you an operator’s perspective.

We must begin by addressing six critical areas.

Firstly, we must have one rule book across Australia. Starting with the basics - we are yet to have a consistent definition of what a “heavy vehicle” is. Sometimes it’s a vehicle above 12 tonnes (for work and rest hours), sometimes above 12 tonnes and manufactured after 1997 (for speed limiters – except in NSW), and sometimes a vehicle above 4.5 tonnes (mass, dimension and load restraint). Compliance starts with clarity of the rules. A truck should be any vehicle 4.5 tonnes and above. Period.

On the life and death matter of driver fatigue, our current state-based system allows drivers to drive for up to 17 hours in a 24 hour period in Western Australia and up to 18 hours in the Northern Territory – a workday that would be illegal for a driver in any other state. This leaves time for a maximum of only 6 to 7 hours of rest in a 24 hour period – resulting in the physiological equivalent of a blood alcohol concentration of 0.05. We do not accept drunk driving. We should not accept fatigued driving.

Further, the maximum speed limit for trucks between 4.5 and 12 tonne varies from 100 km/h in NSW to 130 km/h in the Northern Territory. Any truck driver making the slightest error in judgement at 130 km/h will certainly have a devastating outcome for the driver and anyone unfortunate enough to be in the vicinity.

It is time for a genuinely national approach to heavy vehicle regulation, including for heavy vehicle driver licensing. A national driver licensing system can stipulate the skills and competencies required to safely drive a heavy vehicle, including how to restrain a load and how to fill out a work diary. A genuinely national system would mean that licence cancellation in one state means cancellation in all states. A targeted strategy will attract new drivers, arrest the decline in competent drivers and provide a career path for driving professionals.

The National Heavy Vehicle Regulator was supposed to deliver one rule book. It hasn’t. Western Australia and the Northern Territory have refused to sign up to the national law. And so today Australian road freight operators are subject to multiple and overlapping rules at the local council, state and national level. Let’s look to aviation for inspiration on how this can be achieved. This industry is subject to one set of rules. No exceptions. We must follow.

Secondly, we must introduce an operator licensing system. Where operators in maritime, rail and aviation must all demonstrate their safety and competence before they can operate, in road transport virtually anyone with a truck, a driver and an ABN can be a road freight operator. This makes Australia unusual: most comparable countries have an operator licensing system for road transport. For example, in the UK, road transport operators must pass a “fit and proper” person test, prove they have the funds to maintain vehicles, and employ transport managers who understand what compliance looks like.

Third, the solution to the road toll cannot and will not come solely from industry. The community, government, enforcement and road safety bodies must do their part too. Through NTI data, we know that in 93% of fatalities involving a truck, the other party was at fault. Yet national and state road safety strategies are silent on how light vehicle drivers can “share the road” safely with trucks. There is an opportunity to ensure that drivers are educated on driving safely around trucks, such as safe stopping distances and over-taking, as part of licensing schemes.

Fourth, by pulling the right policy levers, government can incentivise and reward safe behaviours from heavy vehicle operators. Discounted registration and stamp duty fees could be offered to operators with sound safety records. Government can also mandate investment in newer, safer more sustainable fleet. Technologies such as autonomous emergency braking systems, lane departure warning systems and electronic stability control can save up to 104 lives per year but are taking too long to become standard in the fleet. The average age of a heavy rigid truck in Australia is 15.7 years. The average age of an articulated truck is 11.9 years. An operator licensing system could stipulate a maximum vehicle age or offer subsidies/incentives to safe operators to deploy these lifesaving technologies.

Fifth, mandate telematics, which includes GPS and black box technology, for all new heavy vehicles. Enforcement of the rules is tough in Australia because of the vast distances between towns. There are not enough police to catch every driver and operator that puts other road users at risk. Mandatory telematics on every vehicle will identify operators that systematically and deliberately speed, overload vehicles and push fatigue limits. Removing operators that refuse to do the right thing protects the community and allows good operators to remain competitive.

Finally, we must ensure that operators such as Toll Group are actively engaged in any debate and policy development pertaining to road safety and heavy vehicles. Any discussion on heavy vehicle regulation must draw on private sector expertise to truly understand how we can overcome the obstacles that are holding us back from creating safer roads for our community.

To recap, I call on the government to make the following six points a priority to affect real improvements in driving the road toll down:

(1) Have one rule book for heavy vehicles and heavy vehicle drivers across the country. No variations, no exceptions. This must cover a standard definition of a heavy vehicle as well as a national approach to: mandatory stationary rest times for heavy vehicle drivers, speed limits for heavy vehicles and a driver licensing system
(2) Introduce a national operator licensing system
(3) Enhance community understanding of how to drive safely around trucks, including through the graduated licensing system and education campaigns
(4) Incentivise and reward safe, modern fleets with life-saving technologies
(5) Make telematics mandatory for regulatory purposes.
(6) Draw on private sector expertise from transport operators in any discussion on improving road safety outcomes pertaining to heavy vehicles

I am sending this letter to all Road and Road Safety Ministers across Australia with the view to driving collaboration across governments. As Australia’s largest provider of road freight logistics, Toll stands ready to work with all governments to make these six points a reality.

In our view, we don’t need any further research, studies and committees. We have immediate, critical opportunities before us today that, when implemented, will save lives. We know what needs to be done. It is time for action.

Yours sincerely,




CC: Hon Barnaby Joyce, Deputy Prime Minister and Minister for Infrastructure and Transport Peter Fox, Executive Chairman of Linfox Pty Ltd James Chessell, National Editor, The Age and Sydney Morning Herald Tony Sheldon, National Secretary Transport Workers Union Michael Kilgariff Chief Executive & Managing Director, Australian Logistics Council Geoff Crouch, Chair, Australian Trucking Association

[Mr Brush]

My father taught me a few things about driving.
No point in being dead right.
Time is a friend. The more you have between you and an incident the better.

Yup.....the object of the game is not to get involved in other people's accidents. For example, when stopped in a row of traffic at roadwork, I always leave enough space to the car in front and have an escape route planned in case something comes up too fast behind and can't stop. Recent tragic accident where a truck ran up the back of a row of stationary cars at speed (2 dead) illustrates the point, unfortunately. Also, when overtaking trucks on the freeway, don't drive alongside them for any longer than you have to - gas it to get past quickly, then ease off when you are well past, and pull back into the LH lane. I'd rather exceed the speed limit by 10km/h for a very short spell than drive alongside a gently weaving tanker full of flammable liquid any longer than I have to.

A lot of the every near misses I've witnessed over the holidays involve people misjudging the speed of oncoming traffic before pulling out in front of it. Possibly this is more part-time drivers on the road at this time of year?

[doug3030]

...

Car second in line starts to veer off to the left shoulder of the road, corrects it's course, but my radar is instantly on high alert. ...

Driver in front of me doesn't slacken his pace at all, I'm dropping back steadily at the first sign of the other drivers indiscretion. ...

Congratulations Aldav, I see that you too are one of the few drivers who actually look further down the road than the bumper of the car in front.

[Twisted Tenon]

So I'm on another forum unrelated to Woodwork (My NRL teams fan forum actually), and in the Politics Thread (dangerous thing to follow that, almost as fraught with danger as the Religion Thread!) there was a post that i thought was highly applicable to this discussion. Its a bit of a read, but a pretty decent summary by a seemingly ignored subject matter expert of sorts.

I heard this person speaking about this on the ABC yesterday Dibbers. And immediately thought about the rest times allowed for truck drivers. This is something the industry itself could address by including sensible rest periods in the driver contracts. There should be a collaboration between the drivers, the industry and governments as a matter of urgency.

My favorite Paul Keating quote comes to mind though "In a two horse race, always back self interest"

TT

[Dibbers]

I heard this person speaking about this on the ABC yesterday Dibbers. And immediately thought about the rest times allowed for truck drivers. This is something the industry itself could address by including sensible rest periods in the driver contracts. There should be a collaboration between the drivers, the industry and governments as a matter of urgency.

My favorite Paul Keating quote comes to mind though "In a two horse race, always back self interest"

TT

When reading i definitely got a vibe of "remove the small players that can't afford to conform with these new rules give us and Linfox a duopoly", but at the same time, there are some very valid points in there.

The rest period piece can be changed by the industry, but when dollars are on the line, it'll go out the window. If its legislated and there are real financial penalties, then you're more likely to see real change.

I also agree with more education around driving around trucks... the amount of people i see on my drive into work through Sydney traffic jumping into a lane in front of a tanker trying to come to a stop at a red light on a down hill run is ridiculous! I once saw a truckie (and rightly so IMO) get out of his truck and abolutely give a driver hell for doing it! He wasn't being violent, but just letting them know what a sizable male appendage they were

[doug3030]

The rest period piece can be changed by the industry, but when dollars are on the line, it'll go out the window. If its legislated and there are real financial penalties, then you're more likely to see real change.

The critical thing here is who gets the "real financial penalties"?

If it's the drivers, then the trucking companies will continue to press for more productivity resulting in driver fatigue and falsified logbooks etc. There needs to be clear legislation on how the transport companies operate and severe penalties for them pushing drivers too hard.

[Dibbers]

The critical thing here is who gets the "real financial penalties"?

If it's the drivers, then the trucking companies will continue to press for more productivity resulting in driver fatigue and falsified logbooks etc. There needs to be clear legislation on how the transport companies operate and severe penalties for them pushing drivers too hard.

That's what i'm saying. They need to punish the companies not the drivers.

I like the "black box" idea too... but again, this favours larger companies with the financial ability to buy new rigs or fit out older rigs with these devices.

[Lappa]

Got to love our pollies.
News this morning that the Roads and Transport Minister wants to hook truck drivers to an electrical device that will give them an electric shock if they look sideways for more than two seconds.

[Bohdan]

Got to love our pollies.
News this morning that the Roads and Transport Minister wants to hook truck drivers to an electrical device that will give them an electric shock if they look sideways for more than two seconds.

So now at a T intersection they will start to pull out into heavy traffic without looking.

[doug3030]

Got to love our pollies.
News this morning that the Roads and Transport Minister wants to hook truck drivers to an electrical device that will give them an electric shock if they look sideways for more than two seconds.

How about a similar device that gives an electric shock to politicians who doze off in parliament?

[Twisted Tenon]

When reading i definitely got a vibe of "remove the small players that can't afford to conform with these new rules give us and Linfox a duopoly", but at the same time, there are some very valid points in there.

The rest period piece can be changed by the industry, but when dollars are on the line, it'll go out the window. If its legislated and there are real financial penalties, then you're more likely to see real change.

I also agree with more education around driving around trucks... the amount of people i see on my drive into work through Sydney traffic jumping into a lane in front of a tanker trying to come to a stop at a red light on a down hill run is ridiculous! I once saw a truckie (and rightly so IMO) get out of his truck and abolutely give a driver hell for doing it! He wasn't being violent, but just letting them know what a sizable male appendage they were

The vibe I got from listening to him speak was similar in that it was all about what the Guvmint should be doing about it. He spoke on all the points in the letter you posted but during the interview appeared to be shifting the blame away from the big owners.

TT

[FenceFurniture]

How about a similar device that gives an electric shock to politicians who doze off in parliament?

Nah, leave 'em asleep. They make much more sense that way.