Food safe oil - polish?

[Evanism]

I spent a little more time to read the issues about it after these posts.

BobL is correct in pointing out that this is incidental contamination of food and that there are 100 other ways to die other than bulk ingestion from your chicken absorbing trace quantities off your chopping board.

I also thought about what was meant by "safe". Would I use it on my face every day? No. Dip my hands into it repeatedly daily as part of a job... no. I wouldn't eat it, but there are foods that are made with it such as "glossy" candies (its how it looks glossy apparently). We must also remind ourselves this isn't 1945 where uranium toothpaste, spraying kids with DDT and lead-based makeup was all the rage: http://nymag.com/thecut/2013/12/most...-the-ages.html .... we seem to know a bit more about things now.

Thinking about the nature of oils - mineral, avocado, nut, olive etc, they are all essentially the same thing. Hydrocarbons. What difference is one hydro over another? (Im asking as a question, as I don't know) One of the serious things to think about is that mineral oil is utterly inert. Nothing can grow in it. Not bacteria, viruses, fungus, nothing. When its made, it is heated and purified in an precise industrial process. Id imagine the end product is about as pure, clean and chemically homogeneous as you can get.

Comparing this with oils obtained from smaller organic or home processes are going to leave a product that isn't so... industrial. The olive oil will have Certain Beasties squashed in as part of the crushing, the nut and fruit oils will have other impurities. When I read about what to treat chop boards with, it was these impurities that create rancidity and other unwanted side effects. Being a food product it will decompose. Part of the board-soaking process injects these into the timber.....

But the chopping boards had me really stumped for ages. A kitchen store had me make an array of cutting boards, about 30 all up (it didn't "work out" with them. They were too hard to satisfy) and it was a real quandary what to finish them with. They needed something other than a very good polish sanding. I was watching a Russian dude who has a Youtube chanel (MTM woodworking http://mtmwood.com/ ) and he soaks his in a bath which I've since replicated https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V2t8jXV3fNI . His videos are seriously impressive to watch on a dreary afternoon: https://www.youtube.com/user/mtmwood/

[WhatMomKnows]

Thanks Evanism for the links...I even went and watched th video over at mtmwood.com....I appreciate your information. It looks like he soaks purely in mineral oil. wow! I will still be using my MIX of oils that I have already bought. But now I will look at Mineral oil with in a new light. I like when my eyes get opened like that....pretty cool indeed. Oh, and yes, MY wood projects are for HOME Use Only....at least for now. I live in the USA

[Evanism]

Whatmumknows, I was thinking about your potato bin. You might be better off with nitrocellulose. Its sprayed on. Its 100% natural - it's made by dissolving cotton in nitric acid.

It dries fast, clear, silky smooth, solid, is impreable and its water, oil and most things proof. It is also amazingly easy to apply.

[Robson Valley]

Give me the molecular structures for every one of the so-called "mineral oils" that everybody has mentioned so far. Next, let's sit down to understand what humans can digest, what they can pass and what interferes with the most mundane of human biochemical processes.

Relax. Can you show me the LD50 for mineral oil for humans? I think not.
Who cares? Use olive oil. Be happy. Have another glass of vino.

All other claims are ludicrous. Most are simple threats such as the claim that mineral oil is bad because it is contaminated. Contaminated with what? Plutonium?
I remind you that SubWay uses a plasticizer in their bun dough which is common in flexible plastics.

[TongueTied]

Has anyone come across Ecowood Oil. I got some at a little shop in Maleny but it seems to be available at Masters. It claims to be food safe and made from nut oils and citrus.

[ian]

I believe Ecowood Oil is made in Germany.

[WhatMomKnows]

Thank you for that information....REALLY....wow, I will study your information In the daytime....thanks. I think I am set for THIS project already, but it doesn't mean that I will not discount your information. I can use it on ANOTHER project...We make stuff every week!! Thanks so much Evanism

[WhatMomKnows]

You have Vino? Pass me a Glass!! Ya. I understand that many of the food we get is already contaminated....I DO have a NEW thought on Mineral oil after reading this lovely thread. I still like my coconut oil, olive oil, bee wax and more...but NOW I understand that Mineral Oil...is OK Too )
Now where is my glass! )

[BobL]

I've always wanted to make a cutting board out of an old whiskey barrel - that way any food I cut up on it would be whiskey flavoured.

An alternative might be to run a plane over the whiskey barrel wood and use the shavings to infuse olive oil - you know like the truffle oil.

If you want an oil that really sticks to wood (or anything for that matter) like a dunny bowl klingon then try chainsaw bar oil.
A few weeks ago I put a large chainsaw into the back of my van and the oil tank lid was not screwed down all the way so that it came open and a half litre or so of bar oil covered about 1/4 of the large rubber mat in the back of the van. This has happened several times before and my solution has been to throw a couple of buckets of fine sawdust into the back and work it back and forth with a broom. A few hours later I would park the van facing uphill and hose the back out. This not being deemed kosher by our local council I decided to try and wipe it up using toilet paper - 3 rolls later there was still oil on the rubber matting.

[soundman]

Back to this greewash notion of "mineral oil"
The process of refineing and seperating various products from crude or recycled oil is possibly one of THE most sofisticated industrial processes we have.

There is a staggering wide array of products derived ...... to associate claims and properties from one product with another that may seem similar is totally erronious.

The clean white mineral oil that is considered "Food Grade", even that which is not is vastly different from engine oil.

This Parafin oil... food grade or not..... is possibly one of the purest and chemically narrow products to come out of the oil processing system...... possibly one of the most chemically narrow products known to man.

They take crude or recycled oils and seperate a wide range of "fractions" from that very complex raw material and produce everything from tar to avation fuel ...... the end products are so wildly different from each other they must be considered completely unrelated ....... the fact that they came out of the ground mixed up as a soup is pretty much irrelivent.

Like making a food type soup where the water is as different to the meat, spices or cabbage as it is possible to be ..... the same can be said of the products that come out of crude oil.

Engine oil ..... which prudently should be considered a semi-toxic chemical in all its states, contains all sorts of chemicals and additives many of them not oil derived including heavy metals... even the base oil is still a fairly chemically complex product.

Parafin oil and parafin wax .... food grade or otherwise are peculear in their purity and chemical narrowness ....... this is necessary to achieve their colourless, odourless, tasteless nature ...... remember the human senses are capable or detecting very very small amounts of aromatic products ...... everybody involved at a modest level in the food industry knows how much very small concentrations of things in food can vary the taste and smell.

One thing that the greeies, hippies, health nuts and conspiracy theorists are realy good at is drawing unhelpfull conclusions, by associating irrelivent facts with a similar but not directly related thing or activity.

This causes problems right from bottled water thru to vaxination, cancer concepts and global warming.

TOO often this results in the overstating on one very low level risk at the cost of another far more present and frequent risk.

THE #1 thing that should be considered when thinking about cutting boards is the suitability of the timber used ..... there are many toxins and tainting products in various timbers .... I am concerned when I hear or see certain timbers used as cutting boards.

ther are timbers that have been known for their suitablity for food contact and others thet are very much illadvised.

Hoop pine for instance is the gold standard for food contact timbers .... which gives rise to one of it's alternative names " butter box pine" ..... it was specifically favoured because it did not taint or stain the butter it was uesd to contain.

I have seen and heard of Camphor Laurel used as cutting and food serving boards ...... I scratch my head ...... this is a product known to contain a toxic aromatic, that while it may not poison you, certainly would taint food left in contact, particularly on fairly fresh timber.

cheers

[Enfield Guy]

On Camphor Laurel, there are those who quote "university tests" that show low bacteria levels on Camphor boards compared to glass, plastic etc, but no other timber. Some makers then use this study to purport that Camphor boards are the best when in fact there has been no like for like testing against other timbers. Result = the consumer/purchaser is mislead.

[Robson Valley]

Vegetable oil biochemistry changes with the number of carbon atoms in the fatty acid side chains. And, the number of double bonds between the carbons.
Those chains are 12 - 20 C long with C16 and C18 being the most common. Rarely saturated (all single bonds) there are one, two, sometimes 3 and rarely 4 double bonds
in each carbon atom chain. By contrast, animal fats are normally straight chains of carbons with single bonds.

[turpene]

If the greenies are keen on natural products, maybe the health food crowd would pay more for an MCT (medium chain triglyceride) oil finished cutting board. Coconut and palm kernel are the most common sources, but using palm kernel oil might upset the sustainability crowd. MCTs have 6-12 carbon atoms in the chain.

Though I hadn't considered it before I have some coconut and avocado oil, might give it a test run on some offcuts.

[Robson Valley]

Research all the veg oils and pick the one you like. Flavorless, tasteless, non-aromatic suggests it's quite pure (many are not).
Put the cutting board in a sheet pan.
Heat the oil to no more than 350F, 325F is a lot better.
Using a silicone basting brush, really slop it on.
You're using Charles' Law in gas physics to enable further penetration as the board & oil cools.

[ubeaut]

Lets get back to the original question....

hi folks,

anyone have any thoughts on whether a serving board (huon pine and blackwood) would benefit from a hit with a polisher after applying some of our esteemed leader's food safe oil (mineral oil)?

I am hoping for a glossier finish than a cutting board would normally get, as the surface shouldn't get chopped up - just planning to use it for a platter, keeping greasy takeaway containers off the table!

Cheers,

danny

Hello Danny (if you're still there after all the above)

Buffing won't help. The idea of the oil is to penetrate the surface of the timber and protect it from water, food smells, contamination, etc.

If you want a brighter shine for use as a serving board rather than a cutting board then you could use Aussie Oil. This is being used for serving and cutting boards that are being sent to Japan and I believe it's been trialled for use on the serving boards in The Scottish McHamburger joints.

There is no reason why the Aussie Oil can't be used over the FoodSafe Plus.

If the platter is to be turned the Aussie oil is fantastic as a Friction Polish.

Hope this is of some help.

Cheers - Neil
__________________________________________

As an aside, to add to all the above about mineral oil.

Our FoodSafe Plus is heavy pharmaceutical/medical grade Parrafin oil.

We go to extreme lengths to make sure it is uncontaminated. Even knocked back some from one supplier because it had been decanted into 200lt drums from a 1000lt container which meant it was no longer foodsafe.

Lanolin in a combination of possibly Coconut Oil, Walnut Oil, Bee Wax, Lemon Essential Oil, Vitamin E Oil and Rosemary Oil.

Lanolin - Toxic if ingested.
Coconut oil - Not sure that it's the right thing to be using on wood.
Walnot oil - Great for the multitude of people suffering from nut allergies.
Bees Wax - Good stuff but doesn't take too well to heat.
Lemon Essential Oil - Sure but ordinary lemon oil would be much cheaper and do the same job as would lemon essence and D'Limonene which is already in use by a growing number of polish manufacturers.... Not U-Beaut.
Vitamin E Oil - Of no use to the person using the board or the board unless it is suffering from bad complexion.
Rosemary Oil - Rosemary and Lemon oils may taint any food that is prepared on a board and make your board grow a really good head of hair.

I am not trying to put down you or your ideas. More power to you for trying to have a go at something new and different. However....

If you are going to go down this route you might just well apply some hand cream or moisturiser to your woodwork. Won't work but sure will smell good.

Applications for timber are not the same as applications for skin or essences, etc for internal health. By all means if this is what you want to do, go for it but please don't put ideas into the heads of others that what you are using may be better when clearly they are now.

As for things derived from petrol. You might want to bear in mind that most of the products you mention are stored and sold in plastics derived from petrochemicals unless they are in glass.