Surcare Sander v Festoon gear drive 8" sander

[Mark Damien]

Hi,
Firstly, is anyone using the Surcare 5" (smaller model) sander. If in Sydney I would like to come and see it in action
i am laminating table tops and want a perfect flat finish. I currently hand block sand, but looking to start a business. I want a great finish in a reasonable short time. I have discussed the Surcare and am looking to purchase.
Additionally, after a few sales, I also plan to but the Wood Wizz.
I have gone down many wrong paths before, so hopefully some experienced peop's can guide me to the best solution.
so,
For timber table tops would the Surcare be the best choice, over the Festoon gear drive 8" planetary sander, and
if I intend to purchase the Wood Wizz will that do it all, so should I just keep saving.
Any advice greatly appriciated

[ian]

Hi Mark

looks like this thread slipped though without anyone replying.

When you say "I want a perfect flat finish" what do you really mean?
I ask because I don't believe any portable sander will deliver "perfect flat" in "a reasonable short time".

If your intention is commercial scale manufacture of laminated table tops I suggest you need to be investigating
1. timber preparation methods that produce boards of consistent thickness with square edges which have the machining marks removed PRIOR to glue up.
2. glue up methods that minimise or eliminate misalignment between adjacent boards or cupping across a glued-up top.
3. a two or three drum sander wide enough to sand your tops in one pass -- these sanders are available in sanding widths up to at least 1300mm.
4. an industrial scale dust collector big enough to keep collect all the dust from the drum sander.

you would probably then need to follow the drum sander with a random orbit sander using finer grits prior to applying your finish

[Xanthorrhoeas]

Hi Mark,

To add to what Ian has said:

Many domestic table tops are not absolutely flat and perfect - they only have to be smooth enough that a glass of beer or wine doesn't fall over!
The results from a Woodwiz with a sharp cutter are good but, remember that it is a router cutting small circles across the surface. They tend to leave very fine circular marks. It depends on your timber just how noticeable those are. I have removed the marks satisfactorily to my purposes using a Bosch 150 mm random orbit sander (professional Blue series). Now, that is not perfectly flat, but flat enough for a table top. I haven't had any criticisms.

When I laminate boards to get a wider table or board surface I do use a relatively inexpensive drum sander - 400 mm wide with open end that can sand up to close to 800 mm by reversing the board. There are also wider versions out there. As Ian has said there are some super-duper wide multi drum sanders that give a perfect finish. They are expensive and the sanding rolls for them are expensive so you would want to be sure that you really needed the table that flat before you invested in one. I full agree with Ian that a big, powerful dusty is also needed - preferably with wide diameter ducting as otherwise you do not pick up the fine dust that kills your lungs.

It is easy to invest more in fancy gear than you can't properly get a return on. In business it can pay to start with the simplest gear and trade up as turnover and profit makes it possible. Don't forget second hand gear too - many others have gone down the path and lost money, got bored, got old etc. and sell their gear at very reasonable price.

I am only a muck about woodworker but run an unrelated business so understand capital and repayments etc. Personally, I buy the best gear that I can afford but over the years I have traded in good gear for better gear. It will never pay for itself in money as I don't sell my products but it pays for itself in quality and enjoyment. In my business I buy only what will pay for itself - otherwise disaster looms.

Hope this helps.

Left photo: Oregon top laminated, drum sander plus 150 random orbital. RH photo Huon Pine, Woodwiz and 150 mm random orbital sander (sorry about the poor photo)

[Thylacene]

Many years ago I worked in a shop where table tops were made regularly, the gadget we used had a foot wide belt on a 5 foot carriage, and it ran about 3 inches above a movable table. We used a wooden concrete float to push the belt down onto the tabletop and moved the lower carriage back and forth to get full coverage. produced a great finish

[ian]

Many years ago I worked in a shop where table tops were made regularly, the gadget we used had a foot wide belt on a 5 foot carriage, and it ran about 3 inches above a movable table. We used a wooden concrete float to push the belt down onto the tabletop and moved the lower carriage back and forth to get full coverage. produced a great finish

I've used one of those. It was housed in a negative pressure room to try and capture most of the dust it generated.

It's called a wide belt sander. Getting an even surface -- one without gouges or that slopes from one end to the other -- takes some skill.

If Mark decides to down the wide belt sander route -- he will definitely need a large 3-phase dust extractor.

[Thylacene]

Yeah, this was the "good old days" where it was out on the floor and we had a dust collection hood that was over the belt, the belt carriage moved horizontally in relation to the tabletop and the lower carriage moved lengthwise. OH&S would probably shut you down for such things these days