Entertainment Unit Nightmare! Which Paint?

[EagerBeaver71]

Its been 3 months since I started this project, 3 months of trial and error after error... I bought a cheap piece of furniture from the Salvation Army which looked perfect for an entertainment unit. it had a nasty thick brown high gloss paint varnish on it which I stripped off. Unerneath was a kind of wooden laminate which didnt matter because it was going to be painted over.

Ultimately I wanted the top and support beams(the pieces of wood on the front of the unit attached to the shelves etc) a nice black flat semi-gloss, the rest all in black Satin. Because my wife and I didnt want much smell in the house we decided to go waterbased paint, So I applied Waterbased Taubmans 3 in 1 primer/undercoat, sanded it back to a very smooth finish (sanding waterbased paint is an #### of a job). I noticed I was going to have a problem with waterbased because of it drying so quickly so I bought some Flotrol.

After I was happy with the primer/undercoat I started to apply the Dulux Aquanamel Black Gloss with a roller. After trying out different proportions of Aquanamel/flotrol/water & sanding it back over a dozen times not to mention the different ways of application Roller/Brush/sponge brush I wasnt going to get a smooth finish because of the quick drying time of the waterbased paint. I spoke to a few people at bunnings who told me the only way to get a completly smooth finish was with a spray gun.

So I bought the Wagner W670 Fine Sprayer, along with more Aquanamel paint. After several spraying attempts using different ratio's of water/flotrol to thin the paint I gave up on waterbased paint. I have since stripped the unit back to bare wood again...

Can someone please recommend the best paint to use for the job. I really want to make use of my W670 spray gun as I would say that would give the best finish, my only dilemma is what paint to use. The top of the entertainment Unit is bigger than a flat pannel door. Would spray can paint be better?

IMG_0409.jpgIMG_2089.jpgIMG_2107.jpg

[Kev Y.]

Sheeny71, welcome to the mad house.

As I see it the only way you are going to get a nice smooth finish in a paint is to either use an enamel based (turps) paint or even a lacquer based (faster drying )paint. The only point I agree with in the bunnings statement is that a spray gun will give you a better finish - IF you have used a spray gun before. All bunnings did for you was make you spend more money in their store.

I have used a similar type spray unit before (the old BEAVER spray gun) and they will do a passable job for you.

I would suggest you go down to your local paint supplier ( not the hardware store OR the big green shed ) and talk to someone who deals only in paints.

Your second pic looks like you were painting inside! not a good idea with a spray unit, if you have a shed or access to one do the praying in there, as a last resort spray outside but pick a calm still day or you could find yourself cutting overspray from your car or even worse your neighbors car.

As for the paint smell, unless you are extremely sensitive to the smell of fresh paint you could leave the unit outside until most of the paint volatiles have dispersed, which could take a few days.

Kev

[Master Splinter]

I'd suggest an acrylic enamel...ie car spray paint. It dries fast (minutes...so no solvent smell after about 15 minutes) and gives about an 8/10 finish*. If you want a glossier finish, you need to compound it, which can bring it up to a piano gloss. For best results, use an all car finish process (automotive primer, spray putty, topcoat) and you can have it looking like better than new.


*with a spray gun and compressor. Don't know about airless spray.

[EagerBeaver71]

Hi Kev, Thanks for your're reply and valued advice. A few new developments, Ive taken the cabinet apart to make it easier to paint, only a small amount of vaneer came away when taking the bottom part off so that wont be a problem filling. The top and bottom was joined with 8 dowel mortice joints to give it more strength along with the ususal screws so no problem reassembling it again.

As for the painting of the unit, would I get a better finish with aerosol spray or the Wagner spray gun?, I am new to spray painting but have learned a great deal with this project and would say I'm quite confident in using the spray gun now.

Another question, because I'm originally from England I really dont know my away around the range of products you Aussies have at Bunnings/Masters. Can you recommend me a good wood glue and filler for fixing the vaneer and filling the cracks?.

Many Thanks

[EagerBeaver71]

I'd suggest an acrylic enamel...ie car spray paint. It dries fast (minutes...so no solvent smell after about 15 minutes) and gives about an 8/10 finish*. If you want a glossier finish, you need to compound it, which can bring it up to a piano gloss. For best results, use an all car finish process (automotive primer, spray putty, topcoat) and you can have it looking like better than new.


*with a spray gun and compressor. Don't know about airless spray.

Hi Splinter, Thanks for you're reply. I'm more resigned to an oil/solvent based finish now but I like the idea of using the spray putty. Can you recommend any products for filling cracks and fixing vaneers?

[Master Splinter]

I can't think of a spray putty that would work under an oil finish. One one hand, most spray putties can be used under a 2 pac finish...on the other, I don't know what the slow evaporating solvents in oil based enamel would do to it.

I'd go for either Timbermate (Bunnies, paint aisle) or marine epoxy (boat store, fiberglass and plastics shop) as a surface filler, and sand flat after it dries.

Glue wise, Titebond II or III is available from Masters at reasonable prices and is probably the best 'superior to standard PVA' glue you can find without buying industrial quantities. (If I was re-equipping my glue shelf, it'd be stocked with $2 store cyanoacrylate tubes, Titebond, and a good few liters of marine epoxy)

[EagerBeaver71]

I can't think of a spray putty that would work under an oil finish. One one hand, most spray putties can be used under a 2 pac finish...on the other, I don't know what the slow evaporating solvents in oil based enamel would do to it.

I'd go for either Timbermate (Bunnies, paint aisle) or marine epoxy (boat store, fiberglass and plastics shop) as a surface filler, and sand flat after it dries.

Glue wise, Titebond II or III is available from Masters at reasonable prices and is probably the best 'superior to standard PVA' glue you can find without buying industrial quantities. (If I was re-equipping my glue shelf, it'd be stocked with $2 store cyanoacrylate tubes, Titebond, and a good few liters of marine epoxy)

I found some Selleys "KWIK GRIP" contact adhesive, will this be ok?

[Master Splinter]

Here's a complete enumeration of the things that Kwik Grip is useful for, in a true woodworking sense:

* Nah, I got nuthin'.

If we expand woodworking into domestic house construction, we get:

*Attaching sheets of high pressure laminate to chipboard kitchen benchtop substrates.

(oh, and one more glue for my glue shelf, that I forgot - hide glue).

[EagerBeaver71]

Heres a link to my other thread to show you guys what sort of state the cabinet base is in after dismantling

https://www.woodworkforums.com/f173/h...-holes-163955/

[Master Splinter]

How to fill them - by the cheapest and easiest method:

1. Measure size of that piece of wood.
2. Go to a hardware store that cuts wood to size and get the nearest thickness of MDF cut to that size.
3. Transfer hole locations over.
4. Throw old piece into the trash.
5. Sand/route edges to match original (just sand the edge and round the arris very slightly if it's a square edge).
6. Paint.
7. Consider doing the same for all the other pieces; MDF is cheap and holds paint well with much less surface prep.

Any other approach isn't called for as it's not going to be showing the timber, and it's not like its a special veneer anyway.

[EagerBeaver71]

Hi Kev, Thanks for you're suggestion, I got another suggestion from the restoring thread. nrb advised using builders bog. Im abit more keen on this idea because none of the holes are any more than 3mm in depth, what do you think?

[Master Splinter]

Builders bog has its place. That place is a wheelie bin that's picked up and emptied by the trash people.

For the price stores are charging for builders bog these days, you are better off buying marine epoxy and getting some thickening powder for it. Marine epoxy is typically as runny as fairly warm honey, but you add fillers like sawdust or talc or aluminium powder (but not well mixed aluminium powder and iron oxide at a 1:3 mix!) to thicken it and bulk it out.

Polyester filler (builders bog) sticks well to polyester fiberglass resin and some plastics. It has pretty poor adhesion to wood compared to epoxy resins.

I'd doubt that (even a small tin of) bog will be cheaper than a new piece of MDF, even allowing for getting a hardware store to cut to size; the MDF route will also be less effort and give a significantly better finished result!

[EagerBeaver71]

Builders bog has its place. That place is a wheelie bin that's picked up and emptied by the trash people.

For the price stores are charging for builders bog these days, you are better off buying marine epoxy and getting some thickening powder for it. Marine epoxy is typically as runny as fairly warm honey, but you add fillers like sawdust or talc or aluminium powder (but not well mixed aluminium powder and iron oxide at a 1:3 mix!) to thicken it and bulk it out.

Polyester filler (builders bog) sticks well to polyester fiberglass resin and some plastics. It has pretty poor adhesion to wood compared to epoxy resins.

I'd doubt that (even a small tin of) bog will be cheaper than a new piece of MDF, even allowing for getting a hardware store to cut to size; the MDF route will also be less effort and give a significantly better finished result!

Hi Splinter, Me and the wife went to bunnings today, sadly they didnt have a peice as thick as the one we have, measurements are: 45cm x 220cm x 2.5cm thick. I would also have to get a router which I dont have yet, I'm still deciding on a shed for my workshop. I wish I had seen you're post earlier because I bought some of the builders bog and applied it to the holes... One thing I found with it was that it cures really quick...