Asbestos

[twomonkeys]

We are just starting an owner builder extension. Hubby started to pull off the cement board eaves and noticed there was a sticker saying small amounts of asbestos were present. The house was built in '81. I called the local demolition guy who was helpful but seemed happy for us to remove and dispose of ourselves, obviously taking the right precautions. He said any amount would be small but my understanding is even a small amount can be dangerous ? I guess I was a bit freaked by it at first and have since had varying feedback. In all, there is only a small amount... probably about 5 sq metres. Has anyone else been in this position and any advice as to how to proceed ?
Many thanks...

[mkc]

Hey Twomonkeys , like the name .
l have fake brick on my place and have just started looking into it myself . We can get away with taking of about the same amount as you around the bottom of the house -then rendering the rest .
l've had different feedback so l haven't touched yet . Some have said do it to the council guidlines and it's safe , others have said don't touch a drop - but l don't drink on the job anyway . Kidden .
Anyway not much help l know but we might find out more from here .
cheers.
Mkc

[normell]

Iv'e heard that have a hose, with fine spray onto the sheets, will stop any small air born particles. BUT always wear full overalls gloves & mask.

Please don't take this as gospel tho

Normell

[Christopha]

DO NOT CUT IT!!!!! Wear disposable overalls and good quality face masks, remove the sheeting as carefully as possible to avoid any particles becoming airborne if possible, Breaking the sheets won't cause much problem and once you have the horrible stuff down dispose of it as per the councils guidelines, remove the overalls and bin them wrapped in plastic...... DO NOT CUT!!!!!!!!

[Bluegum]

I have to agree with christpho on this (appologies there if i got your name wrong). I have just removed 30sqm from a bedroom at home. Wetting it down is and absolute must prior to romoving the sheets. It should be wrapped up in situ as then it can be moved safely through the house and outside. If its outside then I was told to spray it down with a fine spray as water traps the particles. After that lay it into a dunpster and wrap it as soon as you can. I had the fibro tested and it came back as white asbestos which I was told is the safest (if there is such a thing) of all the asbestos products.:eek:

[johnc]

Would agree with the above, but by '81 the asbestos is in very low quantities. These are the very end of asbestos use and are the sheets produced just prior to eliminating the stuff from building products altogether. The sheets may in fact contain no asbestos at all and should not contain any of the more dangerous end of the spectrum. Despite this it should be handled with care and you can enquire at your council about how to handle the stuff. We have the same product with a house of the same age, it was a surprise to find a sticker on a sheet after removing nearly all the lining of the bathroom. Needless to say some enquiries where made regarding risk which we are told should be minimal, previously I had believed it was an asbestos free house.


John.

[Sir Stinkalot]

Just out of interest .... and I know this would be difficult to answer .... but what level of exposure would be still considered safe?

It just makes me think that the product was used for many years ...... by many people. Did everybody who used a product containing asbestos end up with asbestosis or was it just the people with high levels of exposure?

I still think that it is best to take all measure to reduce exposure but just interested on what level of accidental exposure would be ok.

[ivanavitch]

Sir Stinky

Father in law worked in the electricity industry for years. He hates meeting up with old work mates because there is always another one who has been taken. This stuff does not discriminate. It gets the guys who worked with it all day, the storeman, the tealady or the missus at home washing the overalls.

So it can get people with small exposures. There are probably blokes out there who breathed it constantly with no effects. I wouldn't like to take bets on which camp you belong in. The ante could be a little high.

[deanp]

I just had a whole lot of the stuff removed yesterday by a professional. Blue azzy it was, apparently the worst you can have. I thought he'd be a bit carefull with the stuff removing it but all he did was put a crowbar through the panels and pulled it out and it broke up all over the place. Didn't wet it down either or clean up that well. Bit scaring seeing I have young children etc. Anyway I was in for another surprise...Big white ant infestation and just about to get into the roof timbers phew!!

[Eastie]

What level of exposure would be still considered safe?

Simple answer – absolutely zero exposure.
<O</O
Difficult answer – despite there being exposure standards such as 0.1 fibre per millilitre of air, no-one really knows. There are those that stand behind the view that one fibre has the potential to lead to mesothelioma or lung cancer, and then there is the other side who says if that is the case we are all doomed from exposure to normal background exposures such as generated from the old asbestos brake linings. I think the truth lies somewhere in between, albeit skewed cautiously towards the former. Historically asbestos disease, especially lung cancer, has predominantly been associated with high level industrial exposure. It was envisaged some years ago that given the early 1980’s phase out of asbestos that towards 2010 we’d be seeing a marked decrease in asbestos related disease. This is not the case. New cases of mesothelioma have continued to rise, and amongst populations not exposed to heavy industrial mining/use of asbestos. For those who have seen the dreadfully painful results of asbestos diseases the answer is typically simple - it’s not work the risk of taking shortcuts.<O

[Trav]

Stinky - my grandad dies of mesophilioma, but then he was a boilermaker in Perth and they used to work with this stuff all day.

Twomonkeys - perhaps I am a bit over sensitive about this, but why don't you pay someone to come and remove it? I had someone come and remove asbestos - it cost $400 or so, but they closed the room up with black plastic, wet it all down with water mixed with pva and took it all away. Best money I ever spent I think.

Trav

[Wildman]

Coming from an insurance perspective with bulk data being aggregated over a long period of time, so far, the percentage of people exposed to asbestos who go on to develop mesothelioma is actually suprisingly low, 10-15% however in that 10-15%, even very slight exposure can result in disease. This number is likely to change a bit over time, however exposure may not necessarily be the death sentence made out in the media considering how widespread usage of asbestos was.

Regardless, 15% is the chance of dying in the first round of russian roulette. Anyone played that? At least you wouldnt feel any pain unlike mesothelioma.

Spraying with a dilute PVA solution will bond surface fibres safely even after the board dries out again. Dont use power tools for anything. Punch nails through the board to get sheets off as safely as possible without breaking them. Punch the nails well into the timber beneath, seal with pva solution and leave them there rather than try to pull them out. Dont just wear a mask, wear a respirator class P1 or P2 and spray the area with pva solution after you have finished your clean up.

Cheers
Ben

[rmcpb]

Couldn't agree any more with Wildman. Full protective gear, only takes one fibre to spoil your life!! Keep everything moist to keep dust to a mimimum, spray panels with dilute pva to lock fibres down after removal, wrap in heavy duty plastic and seal up asap. The cleanup is an absolute must, all dust must be removed, any rags used must be wrapped up in plastic and disposed of.

As for PPE disposable overalls and respirator. Dispose of the overalls and respirator cartridges at the end as for the panels and rags.

Cleanup and disposal are the really important steps that are often forgotten in the whole process.

Keep kids away during the process, I know they like to watch distruction but this time its completely out of the question.

Ever thought of getting a qualified person to do the job, I did, best $1000 I ever spent.

Good luck.

[twomonkeys]

OK... second attempt .

Thanks so much for your replies. Very helpful. Yes, I did look into professional removal but we don't have anyone local. I spoke to the nearest operator who visits from time to time and he was helpful but very much indicated it was something we could do on our own (he works mostly with government authorities). He gave us some good pointers, most of which have been covered in this post.

I am now quite concerned about the amount of sheeting we have around the house and I cringe :eek: just thinking back to the bathroom reno we did some 5 years ago and how we handled the cement sheeting (completely ignorant then).

Is it worth getting it all removed (ie. for us the rest of the eaves, a carport, shed, laundry etc) or is it best to leave well and good alone.

Thanks again..... cheers

[womble]

I just had a whole lot of the stuff removed yesterday by a professional. Blue azzy it was, apparently the worst you can have. I thought he'd be a bit carefull with the stuff removing it but all he did was put a crowbar through the panels and pulled it out and it broke up all over the place. Didn't wet it down either or clean up that well. Bit scaring seeing I have young children etc. Anyway I was in for another surprise...Big white ant infestation and just about to get into the roof timbers phew!!

that DOES NOT sound professional to me!! whiteants are the least of your worries if there's blue fibres in the house now...