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Hi all,
I recently bought some Danish Oil which has a strong citrus smell.
1/ Do all Danish Oils have this smell?
2/ Will the smell remain on the timber?
I intend (if I ever actually finish this coffee table:-) to finish it with DO followed by Trad wax but I don't want it smelling like a fruit shop:(.
All advice gratefully received.
Cheers,
Papillon.
p.s. Thanks to all the forumites whose brains I have quietly picked so far.:2tsup:
HI,
The smell will go away (mostly). A little bit of residue smell will remain. its teh citrus oils they use that makes the smell. anything that sez "natural citrus oils ... etc etc... ." will have the smell.
I recokn its quite pleasant. can be overpowering thou - I leave my items out in the sun fora few days to help the drying and smell removal.
I dont know which brand DO that you use ... I use Rustins and don't have the citrus smell that you describe. It does have a smell but it is quite plesant.
Following your danish oil I would use the Ubeaut EEE and then traditional wax. This is the finish that I use on bandsaw boxes and they come up a treat. The smell of the traditional wax over rides the danish oil.
I don't mind the citrus smell, but I'm not sure I want to live with it constantly.
I have Organoil DO. I read in here somewhere that it was reputed to be good, and it is available locally. Rustins certainly seems to be the DO of choice on these forums though.
Why do you use EEE under the Trad Wax, from what I have read I thought EEE was intended mainly as a cut and polish or a finishing coat?
I hope that last line doesn't sound picky, it's not meant to be. It's just that this is my first attempt at making something decent, and at oil and wax finishes, so I'm trying to learn as much as I can before I start, instead of rushing in and stuffing things up like I have a habit of doing.
Cheers,
Papillon.
I have used the Organoil previously and I like the smell. The finish from the Organoil can be wonderful, however you really need to follow the instructions well. I used it on my dining table legs and it worked well however looking at it now, a few years later it is looking dry (for want of a better word). I am not saying that the Organoil isn't good .... more that I wasn't good enough for the finish. The smell will go away quite quickly after some drying time.
I use the Rustins as I find it so simple to get good results. I simply sand and then apply a few coats with a rag. I use the EEE as a fine cutting compound after the final coat of the danish oil. The traditional wax is used over this for the final finish. The EEE is not a finish in itself.
To be honest I am not sure if the EEE is really doing much after the final coat of the danish oil, or for that matter if the traditional wax over the danish oil is a wise move, but at the end of the day it seems to work for what I am after so I am happy to stick with it until 1. it fails or 2. I find something better. Also it supports the forum leader :)
In my opinion the oil finsh is much better than any estapol finish as the touch doesnt have the plastic feel. Take your time with the Organoil and it should come up a treat.
Thanks SS,
I think I might skip the EEE and try the Trad Wax straight over the oil, that looks to be our Benevolent Dictators preferred choice, and since you aren't entirely convinced about it......
I intend to take plenty of time on the finish on this project. That's one thing that everyone seems to agree on.
I have already told the birthday girl that her present is going to be rather late, but hopefully worth the wait.
Now if only I could identify the timber I'm using:?:?
Cheers,
Papillon.
The EEE really needs to be power buffed to work efficiently, it can be done by hand if your keen...
Pap, EEE is a polish using it after the oil will increase the shine and smooth the surface.
IMHO the shine EEE leaves is equivalent to 2000~2500 W&D.
Hi Harry,
I bought one of Neils Swansdown Mops for polishing with. I must try it on a test piece soon and see how I go.
If I am using Trad Wax for the topcoat wouldn't it be more important to get the shine on that? I would have thought that fine polishing on the oil coat would get lost under the wax coat.
Cheers,
Papillon.
The wax helps protect the shine obtained by the EEE.
EEE would remove the trad wax with one wipe:)
The wax isnt really a top coat, its more of a temporary protective layer that needs to be refurbished every now and then.
OK, I get it. In that case since the wax is only a protective coat, and needs regular maintenance, and DO is supposedly fairly impervious to damage as it polymerises in the timber strengthening the actual surface of the timber. (says he paraphrasing Neil)
This table being a very hard timber to begin with.
Would I then be better to forget the wax and simply use well applied DO, polished with EEE if necessary just to get a suitable finish?
Sigh... So many question, and only one lifetime to learn.
Cheers,
Papillon.
p.s. I'm hoping to get a soft natural look and feel rather than something glassy and plastic.
A "coating" is any material that protects and enhances the wood, there are many other coatings that certainly give better protection then wax.
I think that "wax" is the only coating that is used directly on the wood as a coating, and also is used on top of many other protective coatings. So, waxes do have a place in finishing.
Papillon,
Agree with the others that the smell will go away. But I could not resist posting that I know a lady who absolutely loves the smell of danish oil, orange oil, organoil etc. No names but she has begged me for a box or anything just to have the smell (scent) in her home.
Carry Pine
The Rustins DO has been my finish of choice and once hardened I haven't noticed any smell.
A recent review in Aust Wood Review rated Organoil DO highly and I've started to use it. This stuff does have the citrus smell while wet; can't comment on dry since the test piece is now elsewhere.
I've not been a fan of Organoil Hard burnishing oil on my wood turnings since for me and others it raised the grain after a couple of weeks. Some posters to this forum have found ways of avoiding that apparently however.
Carry Pine, there are citrus based furniture treatments used on a soft rag as a wipeover (eg. Howards) that your friend might like.
Hi Ern,
It was the mention by someone of that review that prompted me to try the Organoil, and I am convinced now that she smell will abate in time. I figured it probably would but there is no harm in asking I reckon.
Here in Hervey Bay we don't have a huge choice in products and brands, so I need to track down some decent mail order mobs for the stuff that U-Beaut don't sell (Suggestions Welcome:D)
Now I just have to figure out if I want to wax over the DO or not:?
I'm thinking that whilst there are some definite dos and don't s, there are also a heck of a lot of grey area variations.
Ah well, it's the same old story I guess.
The more you learn the more you realize how little you know.:D
Thanks to everyone for your input, that's what makes this forum so great.:2tsup:
Feel free to keep it coming.
Cheers,
Papillon.
Indeed Butterfly; many variables and variations are possible.
- I do recall the smell of the Hard Burnishing oil abating.
- If you want a bit more gloss in your DO finish, then do a power buff on the final coat after its dried; for more, wet sand your final coat; for more than that still, a wax top coat. Usually I find after the second 'wash' coat and wipe-off it is clear how much of a lustre you'll have and can then try one of the above if you want more.
- I'm not convinced there's any improvement in the durability of a DO finish by adding a wax topcoat. Sometimes when the piece has sat for a bit and I notice open pores, I'll do a wax just for appearance sake.
- from memory, such as it is, Timbecon sell Organoil stuff by mail order, and Carroll's Woodcraft used to and may still.
Good luck.
PS .. If there's a Bunnings in the region, they may stock Howards and Gilly Stephenson's products.
The latter do a pretty good Cabinet Makers wax. It's harder than Ubeaut Trad Wax and takes more effort but the results are good.
And, of course, The Woodsmith stocks all the Rustin's products. :)
We do have a Bunnies Superstore in 'The Bay' and they carry both Organoil and Gilly Stephenson's products.
Whilst I am truly a newbie at this I thought all the evidence seemed to point that way myself.Quote:
I'm not convinced there's any improvement in the durability of a DO finish by adding a wax topcoat.
Thanks Ern and Skew for the suppliers, a quick look tells me they will be a great help.
A greenie to you both for that:2tsup:
Even buying glue locally is a PITA.
I ask "Do you have any Alaphatic resin glue?"
They hear "Have you seen a two headed Martian swamp crawler?"
At least that's what the silly look on their faces suggests.
Not just Bunnies I might add, the staff at our local store are pretty good actually.
Compared to the Mitre 5 they are absolute geniuses.
They were even happy to listen when I explained why I wanted Industrial Methylated Spirits to make shellac, not the household stuff.
Hmmm.... another thing I have to track down that nobody has heard of up here.
Cheers,
Papillon.
I'll apply wax over DO on my own newly turned tool-handles, but that's about it. I just slap a coat of DO on 'em - without bothering about wiping off any excess or recoating 'cos it's just to seal them, not make them look beautiful - then a day later give 'em a layer of wax to improve the grip until I "break them in."
I wouldn't bother with wax over anything I want to look good for the long term. :wink:
Yeah, I don't want to give 'em a table that needs attention on a regular basis, 'cos I know who's going to get stuck with that job:CQuote:
I wouldn't bother with wax over anything I want to look good for the long term. :wink:
Cheers,
Papillon.
For mail order gear try Northwoods, Carbatec, GPW and many others. I personally get my finishing gear from the Benevolent one at the Wood shows, but I am only a very small time backyard timber wrecker:U
I take no responsibility for your significant others reaction to the increase use of your credit card:U
Hi Pat,
Thanks for those links. I too am a small time operator.
My one completed w/w piece so far is an octagonal pine side table to duplicate (sort of) one we already had.
That little project took nearly 5 years:o. Everyone likes it, but I keep looking at it and shuddering at the workmanship, or lack thereof:-
I won't be spending too much for a while, just some essentials. The budget fairy has been on life support for a fair while up here, but there are signs of a possible slow recovery.:)
Cheers,
Papillon.
I wouldn't be too concerned over having to give the table the occassional attention. With the sandown mop and some traditional wax it could be given a quick image boost in less than half an hour. Once a year or so and your done.Quote:
Originally Posted by Papillon
It just depends on what you are comfortable with. At the end of the day a DO finish, with or without wax may not be the best finish given hot coffee cups and spills.
My experience with DO is without wax it can look a little flat .... with wax I like the soft shine that doesn't feel like plastic.
What would your preference for a finish be?Quote:
It just depends on what you are comfortable with. At the end of the day a DO finish, with or without wax may not be the best finish given hot coffee cups and spills.
This coffee table will be a gift to a young couple and will probably see some careless use.
I must admit, I have probably been a bit one eyed about an oil finish, without considering whether it was the most appropriate for the task.
Would I be better off using something else entirely?
Cheers,
Papillon.
Papillon,
Dont let me put you off your choice of finish ..... it would be the one that I would choose myself. Just throwing into the mix if it is the best finish for your chosen project.
Obviously there are pros and cons of each finish and it is just a matter of weighing them up. The advantage of the oil is that it soaks into the timber which helps to hide any scratches and the like, however it will not cope to well with spills. I had some bandsaw boxes on display and they got rained on ..... the finish was the DO, EEE and traditional wax, the spots of rain left visable marks. I am sure that they will be easy enough to buff out but as you have already mentioned you are looking for something set and forget. The straight DO may cope better with the spills.
The oil produces a very natural feel which I personally like, which is why I would use it ..... but for hard wearing finishes perhaps there is something better.
SS you have not put me off at all. In fact I sincerely thank you for throwing your opinion and experience into the ring. that is exactly the kind of advice/info. I was hoping to find.Quote:
Dont let me put you off your choice of finish ..... it would be the one that I would choose myself. Just throwing into the mix if it is the best finish for your chosen project.
I have always been a great believer in listening to conventional wisdom then thinking it over for myself.
Sometimes things are done the way they are for very good reasons, but often there is a better/different way if you are prepared to look at things with no bias, or from a different angle.
Cheers,
Papillon.
p.s a greenie to ya for your trouble:2tsup:
Papillon, I have the same problem here in The Valley (cue banjoes) when it comes to buying supplies. When I was after 1oo% meths staff at several stores looked really suss, like they thought I was going to go lie on a park bench and swig it out of a brown paper bag. I ended up finding it in a home decor store.Quote:
Originally Posted by Papillon
I use organoil DO, but it gives me asthma unless I have a fan on blowing it away from me whilst applying it; a few days later it smells nice and fresh, then its gone. Works well under Ubeaut tradwax. My jarrah coffee table takes a pounding, kids jumping on it and 'decorating' it with texta, hot coffee cups, total abuse, and it is remarkable how good the finish still looks!