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hi, I want to dissolve some shellac flakes, and the recommended stuff is 100% denatured absolute alcohol as used for mixing French Polish.
Can anyone please tell me where I might be able to get some at a local shop? Is this the same stuff as industrial alcohol?
A reputable paint shop should be able to held you.
Sceneys is the brand on mine and it is labelled for french polishing
Many (or possibly most?) people use methylated spirits as a substitute.
hi antiphile, in Neil Ellis' Polisher's Handbook, he strongly advises against using ordinary domestic methylated spirits, as it can contain up to 5 % water, and lots of other additives which do not permit a good finish.Quote:
Originally Posted by antiphile
He says that the best stuff to use is 100% IMS ( Industrial Methylated Spirits), which is what I am chasing.
Also found out that the white de-waxed shellac flakes have a poor shelf life, even weeks in a hot climate like NQ) and need to be kept refrigerated, whereas the liquid form has a shelf life of up to 18 months.
I tried to get the 500ml liquid form from Carbatec, but they wanted $70 for just postage. Also their flakes have gone out of the ballpark at $65 for a small bag. What is going on?
Found the best source and with reasonable prices to be Carrol's Woodcraft Supplies
Have checked out Ubeaut's prices. They sponsor this forum for us as well as having very hi quality products at good prices. Have a look at U-Beaut Polishes - WHITE SHELLAC
Cheers
Phil
Should have mentioned are the Ubeaut retail outlet for Neil - he referred me to them
As mentioned earlier by another person, try a paint shop. I get 20lt drums of it from them. They have to order it in but they new what I was talking about when asking for 100% IMS.
I asked this question years back. Here is the reply from Neil.
Industrial Methylated Spirits or 100% IMS sometimes sold as Ethanol all the same thing. !00% isn't pure alcohol it is denatured alcohol with no addition of water. 95% is a misnomer as it could have up to 20% or more of water in it. Ordinary everyday or no name stuff is as a rule bloody useless as it could have as much as 45% water in it. To be sold as metho it only has to be OP (Over Proof) which means it will burn when a match is put to it, around 55% ethanol (meths)
To find out if your metho has water in it put a little into a bottle or jar and add a little mineral turpentine, shove a lid on and shake the living daylights out of it and if it clouds up (even a little) it has been watered down. If it clouds up a lot then it has been watered down a lot and really isn't suitable for mixing with shellac.
White shellac is the ideal thing for carvings as it will not change the colour of the timber any more than wetting the wood with water. One weak coat (8 parts metho to 1 part shellac) will seal the timber and raise the grain from the sanding this can be sanded off after about half an hour then a second coat of half strength shellac leave it to dry and wax or better still buff with EEE Ultra Shine for a beautiful sheen that will not overpower the carving but instead will bring it to life.
As a woodcarver and finisher I should know. I've used this process on many carvings over the years and it is by far the best, easiest, fastest and most beautiful finish for woodcarvings. Below is one I prepared earlier.
Crappy picture but you'll get the idea.
One of 3 Coats of Arms I carved for the Supreme Courts in Melb roughly 3ft high x 3inches thick, Huon pine, finished with the above method. Still have a brilliant glow to them today.
Cheers - Neil
thanks schaf, this is quite valuable information
Hi Dengue," Paint Right" stores sell it here in 1 & 4 litre bottles straight off the shelf, don't know if they operate up there though.
The thread has pulled the old chemistry from years ago. Methalated Spirits is Methanol and poisonous. Ethanol is what we drink. Used in a lab years ago as a drying agent and had to sign customs slips and keep a log of its use. I would think it would very difficult to purchase Ethanol.
nah, it's quite easyQuote:
Originally Posted by Homeleigh
the hard part is separating it from the unleaded
Aldi were selling BIO_ETHANOL FUEL for one of their specials, an ethanol fuel burner. The MSDS said it was 100% ethanol. The burners were withdrawn from sale for safety reasons and I haven't seen the fuel for sale again.
Hi again schaff
I just tried you method of testing the purity of the metho I have in the shed. Nothing but the best for me!! :doh:
It's from Bunnings and is the Digger Brand. I didn't even have to shake it before it turned very cloudy. I could probably use it as a coffee whitener to have with my morning cigarette. But then again, something tells me that might be a bad idea. :?
Looks likeI'll be looking for IMS over the coming days. Thanks again
Phil
Thanks for the info about Paint Right, 3ts, much appreciated. Unfortunately Paint Right have Qld stores only at Cairns, Gladstone, Bundaberg, Maryborough, Ipswich & Paddington (Brisbane city). No shops in Townsville, and Cairns is a 5 hour drive
Until now I have been using Diggers Brand from Bunnings which seems to be nearly half water. So for the last 3 days I've been visiting specialist paint stores, all the big hardware stores I can find etc etc with no luck.
This morning, out of desperation I went to Saddingtons (Broadmeadow) and the guy behind the counter must have taken pity on me. He rang up lots of places and found a chemical company that could supply him with IMS 100. The drawback is the smallest quantity he could get from them was a 20 litre drum. So the upshot is I have 12 litres too much of this stuff! Of course if no-one else is interested, I'll just keep it and never have to order any more until I die 'cos I'm sure it won't "go off".
However, if anyone is interested in buying a litre or more, and picking it up from Charlestown (adjacent to Newcastle, NSW) let me know. I've got the receipt in the garage, but from memory it cost $166.16 (of course I'll double check later I haven't overstated the price and you'll be very welcome to see the receipt). My calculator says that's $8.30 per litre and you'll have to bring you own container(s). I don't know whether that's too expensive or a good deal for IMS 100, so you might like to do some research to see if I'm ripping you off or not because this is the first time I've bought it and I was so happy to find some I probably lost all sense of reason! :doh:
Saddingtons said they expect to get it next Mon or Tues, so I should have it here (at Charlestown) in the latter part of next week. If you're interested, just reply to this thread. I admit I don't expect to be crushed in the rush, but if the 12 litres is over-subscribed, I'll do it according to the timestamp of the post in this thread.
Cheers
Phil
Do yourself a favour, decant the the stuff into smaller containers once you've started using what's in the 20lt drum, for example fill 3 5lt containers than 5 1lt containers. Reason for this, is that Metho absorbs moisture from the air, so once you've created air gap in container, it absorbs any moisture that is in the air and then next time you open it, more air in, more water absorbed, so by decanting into smaller bottles and sticking to just that one 1lt bottle you're not constantly opening the bigger one all the time. Use glass or plastic containers not metal containers as condensation does form on the inside of metal containers.Quote:
Originally Posted by antiphile
Ooops! Thanks for the tip, DJ. I would have never even thought of that, but now that you explain it, it makes sense. I've got plenty of one and 2 litre containers, but a few 5 litre one won't go astray.
Much appreciated
Phil
After a visit to Bunnings and Masters who only had the Diggers methylated spirits (claimed to be 95% ethanol - but after reading this thread I'm going to avoid that), I made multiple phone calls and finally ended up speaking to Paint Spot in Moorabbin. I double checked that we're talking about 100% ethanol for french polishing, and I've ordered a 4 litre bottle from them (1 litre bottles can also be ordered). It may take a week or so to get in, but at least it's available in reasonable quantities and not too far from me.
Hope that helps some of you out there.
I should have read this thread before buying some.... Charlestown is just up the road from me....
Anyway, I needed a small amount for a repair, and found some at my local Chemist - 95% pure...medical grade, for $9.20 per 250ml
It did the job, but was expensive !!
Geoff