saw stop inventor puts his finger into the blade

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Originally Posted by dennford

Now, should I be fortunate enough to be able to install saw stop in my shed, does that mean that I can forgo all these precautions - no - Not that I dont trust the system but because common sense tells me that the more precautions taken then the less chance of an accident, after all fingers in saw blades possibly only account for a fraction of table saw incidents.

Finally think of saw stop like you would a RCD in an electrical circuit, surely you wouldn't play with live electrickery just because the RCD is going to save you?

Denn

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I think Denn has summed it up pretty well.

The Saw Stop is the absolute last line of defence not the first.

I would quite happily "trade in" my Jet saw and get back the $3000.00 it cost me to get my finger reconstructed and buy a Saw Stop. But I will not trade in all my precautions and safety measures just because I have a Saw Stop.

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Originally Posted by Ruddigar

He's seen the demo....didn't buy it.

Typical Chinese - always want 'best price' :bowdown:

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Cos I don't need one and no I am actually very easy on prices. :U

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Originally Posted by Fencepost2

A very powerful - and scary - demonstration.
Two things worry me about it. First, the engineering and set up have to be exactly right for it to work. I would be worried that an electrical contact might fail, or that something might jam in the mechanism that swings into the blade. Next I would worry that the assurance that it is a safe saw might lead to more casual and risky use.'

None-the-less the invention looks like saving a lot of fingers, even though with improper set up or over confidence it may be only 99% instead of 100%.

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Exactly, a slight mishap can lead to devastating results. But nevertheless, its usefull and a good safety device. Daring man!

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Originally Posted by The Bleeder

I think Denn has summed it up pretty well.

The Saw Stop is the absolute last line of defence not the first.

I would quite happily "trade in" my Jet saw and get back the $3000.00 it cost me to get my finger reconstructed and buy a Saw Stop. But I will not trade in all my precautions and safety measures just because I have a Saw Stop.

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I will be starting to set up up my next workshop in about three months as we just purchased a house yesterday (need to keep the economy going :D)

My wife hated my last table saw it was cheap Asian one did the job and I sold it and will be buying another saw.

The wife being a theater Nurse has seen plenty of missing and damaged digits in her years of service and plenty of other injuries and hates me using table and circular saws.

I showed her the SawStop some time ago when we were back in Brisbane before we moved and last night she asked what I will need to spend on the workshop I said I will need a Table Saw and she instantly asked will it have that thing that stops the saw if you touch it, I explained that it wont be cheap and her answear was either is you having a long period off work.

I am a hobby user I take care when using tools never cut myself once but have come close I am sure, It could happen and using this as the last line of defense is the way to think about it yes we are human we make mistakes loose concentration really snit happens when you least expect it.

Maybe auto defibrillator should be sold with it as well :D I think after you relise what you have set it off your more then likely to have a heart attack.

So whats the cost of one of these units need to work out the budget.

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Originally Posted by WillyInBris

Maybe auto defibrillator should be sold with it as well :D I think after you relise what you have set it off your more then likely to have a heart attack.

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Do you think it could be factory fitted. Might have to see Ruddigar about it.

The costings for a triggering of the function fail to account for the time and labour taken to replace the parts and in a commercial operation the down time on the machine.
then consider the workplace idiots who inconsideratly of deliberatly trigger the function.

If the workplace has strict maintenance procedures it is likley that the user will be unqualified to replace the cartridge and that will introduce more down time till a serviceman or maintenance fitter can come and "repair the machine".

I estimate in real terms that the cost of trigering the function would end up somewhere arround $500 to 600 in a commercial situation. Which is about 1/6 the value of the machine as I understand it.
It only takes a couple of nucance or vexatious triggers for the machine to become very expensive.

My main beef with the concept is that it is a "safey device" that actulay causes damage to the machine and the tooling in its operation.

Of course there is the old marketing line... and that is what it is, pure and simple....."If ****** saves one ***** its worth it". Sorry that line never cut any ice with me. Because it is a maketing line dependent on an emotional plea and never counts the other costs.

I can see that this item will have a market particularly in the politiclay correct nanny society we are living in but I still think it is a flawed technology.

I ask you would you have airbags in your car if activation of the airbags in you average family car cost $5000 and you had to pay for it?

cheers

Bit like air bags on a motor bike

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Originally Posted by soundman

I estimate in real terms that the cost of trigering the function would end up somewhere arround $500 to 600 in a commercial situation. Which is about 1/6 the value of the machine as I understand it.

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Compared to the cost of a lost finger, both in down time and increases in insurance premiums. :?

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Originally Posted by soundman

I ask you would you have airbags in your car if activation of the airbags in you average family car cost $5000 and you had to pay for it?

cheers

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In general, an airbag deployment only occurs when the collision is so severe that you are at risk of serious or fatal injuries. So I would be happy to pay $5000 to keep what little brains I possess somewhat operational :)

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Originally Posted by soundman

I ask you would you have airbags in your car if activation of the airbags in you average family car cost $5000 and you had to pay for it?

cheers

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Yes

Oh I forgot to mention the air bags go off if you get in the car with wet shoes.:D

cheers

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Originally Posted by soundman

The costings for a triggering of the function fail to account for the time and labour taken to replace the parts and in a commercial operation the down time on the machine.
then consider the workplace idiots who inconsideratly of deliberatly trigger the function.

If the workplace has strict maintenance procedures it is likley that the user will be unqualified to replace the cartridge and that will introduce more down time till a serviceman or maintenance fitter can come and "repair the machine".

I estimate in real terms that the cost of trigering the function would end up somewhere arround $500 to 600 in a commercial situation. Which is about 1/6 the value of the machine as I understand it.
It only takes a couple of nucance or vexatious triggers for the machine to become very expensive.

My main beef with the concept is that it is a "safey device" that actulay causes damage to the machine and the tooling in its operation.

Of course there is the old marketing line... and that is what it is, pure and simple....."If ****** saves one ***** its worth it". Sorry that line never cut any ice with me. Because it is a maketing line dependent on an emotional plea and never counts the other costs.

I can see that this item will have a market particularly in the politiclay correct nanny society we are living in but I still think it is a flawed technology.

I ask you would you have airbags in your car if activation of the airbags in you average family car cost $5000 and you had to pay for it?

cheers

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I normally agree with you Soundman but not this one:D The price seems insignificant compared with the potential to save serious injury. Simple cctv could eliminate deliberate triggering, and I can't see a better way of stopping a blade spinning at 5000rpm.

Cheers
Michael

When you consider that with proper methods and procedures the risk of putting your finger or hand into a saw blade is very low, that puts the whole thing in a different perspective.

If the device did not operate by damaging its self my opinion would be different.

So add anothe $2000 for the closed circuit television and the ongoing costs of supervising it, not to mention the workplace relations problems that introducing CCTV would introduce.

If proper guards and work holding procedures are in place your fingers should go no where near the blade.

Like certain other "safety devices" this one may lead to a false sence of security.

I am sure there will be plenty of people who will not understand what it does not protect against.


cheers

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Originally Posted by soundman

When you consider that with proper methods and procedures the risk of putting your finger or hand into a saw blade is very low, that puts the whole thing in a different perspective.

If the device did not operate by damaging its self my opinion would be different.

So add anothe $2000 for the closed circuit television and the ongoing costs of supervising it, not to mention the workplace relations problems that introducing CCTV would introduce.

If proper guards and work holding procedures are in place your fingers should go no where near the blade.

Like certain other "safety devices" this one may lead to a false sence of security.

I am sure there will be plenty of people who will not understand what it does not protect against.


cheers

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I've seen a couple of joineries that already have cctv, it's more common than you think. And it does not have to be anymore than a small recording loop that is not supervised but suspended at the time of injury. Very simple stuff, no issues. The number of injuries bears out that proper procedures aren't always enough. Injuries don't always happen at the time of the intended cut.
Cheers
Michael

I have seen the saw stop in operation and do think that it is a great idea. I am a hobbiest in wood working. So getting one to use once a month is a little hard to justify. Time will tell.

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Originally Posted by soundman

If the workplace has strict maintenance procedures it is likley that the user will be unqualified to replace the cartridge and that will introduce more down time till a serviceman or maintenance fitter can come and "repair the machine".

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Changing the cartridge is as easy as changing the blade. I can have the machine up and running within two minutes, but to be fair, you should allow a whole five minutes ( :oo: ) if you've never done it before.

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Originally Posted by soundman

My main beef with the concept is that it is a "safey device" that actulay causes damage to the machine and the tooling in its operation.

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Tooling, yes. Machine, no. I sold a machine that had nearly 100 demo's performed on it. There is nothing wrong with that machine.

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Originally Posted by soundman

I still think it is a flawed technology.

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Based on?