Quote:
Originally Posted by djstimber
Just as soon as I can find it Dj.
:brick:
:D
(I knew someone would have a go when I typed "Mac")
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Quote:
Originally Posted by djstimber
Just as soon as I can find it Dj.
:brick:
:D
(I knew someone would have a go when I typed "Mac")
i'm getting the same thing using windows:?Quote:
Originally Posted by Waldo
We are trying out some new ideas for the forum display based on comments from the Melbourne WWW Show. If you haven't already please read Neils's announcement "Changes to (Rearranging) the Forums Front Page", it explains whats going on.
WB trying not using the chainsaw that might help:DQuote:
Originally Posted by Wood Butcher
or were you just pruning and taking the branches off got over exuberant.
Same as Waldo's page shot on PC using Firefox
G'day,
Can I put my hand up and say the collapsed version of the home page is fugly without being offensive to anyone. I can't see any recent posts in it, it was grat before but now :yuk:
Sorry :shrug:
Hmmmm, how do I put this.....Quote:
Originally Posted by Wood Butcher
Not happy Jan, we already had the option of collapsing forums we didn't want to see, now whole forum has been collapsed with no option to expand the sections we do want to see ( the little expand/collapse button is not present)
Guys, I know its not easy, both managing and moderating a forum, but sometimes "if it ain't broke don't fix it"
I know it is different but hang on a minute.
Everyone says "i know its not easy" or "I dont mean to be picky" but hey lets wait a couple of days until the changes are finished and let the people who maintain this forum without COST TO US the users finish what they started.
If you dont mean to be picky then dont say it!!!!!:U
I'm sure the gripeing and whinging is no encouragement to anyone.
I'm in favour of have a bit different screen to look at for a couple of days then giving comment when it is asked for.
Be positive not negative:2tsup::2tsup: Keep up the good work Neil:2tsup::2tsup:
Click on the Forum Header for the forum you want and all will be revealed. Give us a bit of time to sort it all out, it's a really massive work in progress and will take a little time to get right.
It will only be a few days at the most. A day or two of 10 hr days will fix it. Be patient. It will all work out for the best and if not I'll put it back the way it was. The way many complained about. Might make some appreciate it, for what it was or is or could be or whatever.
Cheers - Neil :)
Hmmph... I gotta learn to type faster. :~
Good comments Calm :U
The comment is not a hollow platitude, have experience at running a website and helping in a forum, at I might add, very great personal expense both financial and time.
Thanks Pusser. I think we will have to reserve judgment on this one. Now I come to think of it, I don't think I have been wrong before.:D must have been a moment of weakness when I wrote that.:)Quote:
Originally Posted by Pusser
Seriously, the guys are trying to improve things here for our benefit and I guess its very disheartening to have us criticizing their efforts before we have given them a chance to trial the changes out. Keep up the good work guys, we do really appreciate what you do for us. We also appreciate the freedom of speech to voice an opinion, even though it doesn't necessarily agree with management. :2tsup:
Hi
The new forum layout is NOT as easy to use as the previous layout. :no:
The subforums being listed in "paragraph" layout, ie in a "HORIZONTAL" list, is very awkward to use.
As a GUI design it is not clear and practical. The user has to scan down the "first list" - the forums - then horizontally along the second list - the sub forums.
What this does is cause the user to literally "READ" the horizontal list. This happens partly because we are "conditioned" to READ from left to right and partly because the interaction between the human eye and the brain cannot easily differentiate between different and separate items in a horizontal list. We as users have to READ the preceeding text and the succeeding text to be ABLE to ascertain the "separate items".
In a VERTICAL list, the eye-brain interaction is different. First we are ALREADY able to distinguish the separate items as they are already delimited by white space. In addition to this after several uses of such a list the brain will, without conscious effort on the part of the user, recognise "patterns" even though these "patterns" may be text. This means of course that the user no longer has to physically and literally READ the sub forum names as they are instantly recognised as a "pattern" and when we look for our sub forums we "see" them instantly.
This instant recognition will remain even if NEW sub forums are appended to the end of the list.
If new sub forums are added to the already "difficult to process" horizontal list, any familiarity gained through repeated reading, will be lost as the user now has to re-READ the new text.
Think of it this way, imagine how difficult it would be to find files on the computer if windows explorer had its directory(folder) tree in the left pane and listed ALL the files in the selected folder, in a HORIZONTAL format. NOW imagine what would happen if you added a few documents and a few spreadsheets to that folder. How much harder would it be to find a specific file if you were "READING" a file list in "paragraph" format!
While one or two sub forums are not too hard to differentiate, when there are more items the user then has to READ the info.
I would strongly suggest that the forum revert to a VERTICAL list of sub forums. :2tsup:
I second thatQuote:
Originally Posted by MrFixIt
Fiddling with a standard installation rarely makes things easier.
This is a common forum software product. Users get used to the way it works on other sites, then get confused/irritated when it has been "improved" to work in a different way.
The package defaults are pretty good, because of the number of sites in which it is installed, and the experience of those sites reflected to the developers.
Customisation actually works against ease of use and intuition.
:whs:Quote:
The new forum layout is NOT as easy to use as the previous layout. :no:
I would strongly suggest that the forum revert to a VERTICAL list of sub forums. :2tsup:
First off, like to express my appreciation to all those who have a part in running this amazing forum.
I had a couple of issues in mind when I opened this thread and have just sat and read it right through:doh: (Like, where has the last hour or so gone?) so I now know that first complaint is fixable (didnt like the white background), and my second one has just been covered by the previous couple of posts, and is to do with the horizontal listing of subforums.
Donna
Obviously the reason for listing them horizontally is to reduce the amount of vertical space the forum listing takes up. You can collapse the whole forum section so it only takes up one line, or if it has the sub forums listed, just a couple of lines. If you are interested in a particular forum section, you can expand it and all the individual forums are listed vertically, just as they always were. It even remembers your settings so you can collapse all the ones you never look at and just leave the ones that interest you expanded.
I don't see what the problem is. How do people read a newspaper if they have trouble reading the names of forums horizontally?
Change for the better I reckon, or will be when it's finished.
I've got one site that people all over the world use and they all pay for the privilege. So many times people have complained about something, so we fix it, only to have someone else complain about the fix. These people are paying for access to the site, so I suppose we have to listen to them, but a lot of the time we just make unilateral decisions that we believe are for the greater good, despite what some paying users feel, like it or lump it.
For a free site, well I guess there's a point where you might be prepared to listen and improve, but at the end of the day, let's just say my attitude would be a bit less amenable than these guys have been to date.
I don't know why you lot are complaining about the improvements.
I like them as I use the "New Post" search facility and others on the top line and the "Currently active users" statistics. The bits in between is just stuff I have to scroll through and anything that reduces same is a great idea.
Looking great Neil.
Peter.
:whs:Quote:
Originally Posted by Sturdee
Have to agree with Peter:2tsup: Mainly use New Posts and iSpy, hardly ever look at the forum lists unless I am looking for a particular form to post a new thread.
Edit: Just had another look, all the whingeing seems to have resulted in the PTB going back to the old interface anyway.
yep, i agree with peter too:2tsup:.
quite whinging fella's.
Hi
ok, then...Quote:
Originally Posted by silentC
...WHY do the sub forums NEED to be listed horizontally?Quote:
You can collapse the whole forum section so it only takes up one line, or if it has the sub forums listed, just a couple of lines.
When reading a newspaper you are NOT looking for a specific sentence!Quote:
I don't see what the problem is. How do people read a newspaper if they have trouble reading the names of forums horizontally?
When people are providing a service (paid or not) they ARE providing a SERVICE! If the service providers don't listen to their users, their users will go elsewhere.Quote:
Change for the better I reckon, or will be when it's finished.
[snip]
For a free site, well I guess there's a point where you might be prepared to listen and improve, but at the end of the day, let's just say my attitude would be a bit less amenable than these guys have been to date.
My compliments AND appreciation go to Neil et all for the wonderful job they do and ARE DOING.
Let's get ONE thing straight here, *I* am NOT complaining, I am offering constructive criticism. If the forum maintains the design horizontal then I will have to adhere to their design. That STILL does not change the usability limit (as per my previous post) of horizontal lists.Quote:
Originally Posted by Sturdee
Me too many times, but NOT always.Quote:
I like them as I use the "New Post" search facility and others on the top line
This may be great for you, but what about new users???Quote:
The bits in between is just stuff I have to scroll through and anything that reduces same is a great idea.
How would/will they find out what the forum contains. The EASE with which a web site can be used/navigated is critical in how the users perceives the site.
Hi
Thanks Neil et Al for producing and maintaining a great forum.
Thank you for changing the format back to the previous layout. I don't know whether it is just on *MY* system or for all users, but I appreciate how it displays now.
I am sure new users would be happier with this vertical layout.
You are doing a great job :2tsup:
A few guidelines to help the admins:
Please, if you do not like something, say so.
Keep it brief.
Don't argue, don't defend. Let the admins look at individual comments. Arguments cloud the issue.
If you have a link to a 'good' design, post it.
If you have a strange display, a screen shot really helps understanding the issue (ta Waldo :2tsup:)
If it ain't broke don't fix it. I'll repeat what has already been said - there have been complaints, to some members it 'is broke'. Comments indicate people are finding it congested and hard to navigate with all the forums listed. This is an attempt to simplify the navigation of the forums and group forums that should have been grouped long ago.
Don't die in a ditch over this; some things will be trialled and junked, some things kept. We need your help to keep the comments simple and focussed. That way the admins/mods don't have to sort through the 'chaff'.
Thank you all for the comments so far.
Talk about being singled out........
The trench has already been dug so here comes my defence.(Sry Groggy)
The option was already available for users to collapse the forums they did not want to see, the option to see forums we did want to see was removed instead.
Glad to see return of the ability to choose, rather than mandatory view.
Aghherrrrum . . . where's the saftey forum gone?
If they listened to and tried to please EVERY user, and this goes especially for the noisy ones, they would be basket cases.Quote:
If the service providers don't listen to their users, their users will go elsewhere.
Bob, look here. For some reason it is not displaying, we'll get it fixed.Quote:
Originally Posted by BobL
This post is directed to those asking for constructive feedback about the forum namely Neil n mods.
For me I believe the dress up has gone way to far Overcomplication n doubling up of information + Illogical Subsections has made things annoying and overcomplicated n confusing for me.................
I'm a great believer in:
Keep
It
Simple
Stupid
And as such if i could wave a magic Wand I Would return things to how they were earlier in the year just adding the ability to collapse sections were not interested in. Theres a hell of a lot of stuff now thats possibly well beyond the spirit of what perhaps was the original intention for the Aussie Woodwork Forum
Change is positive but theres sometimes a fine line between change thats progressive and change for changes sake! My plee is that the powers that be dont allow to many cooks to spoil the broth!
Bring back the benevolent dictatorship!
REgards Lou:cool:
www.sawmillcreek.orgQuote:
Originally Posted by Groggy
Looks good, works well.
Not as many laughable/lovable characters, though :)
Thanks - and although I was skeptical - the new site is growing on me!Quote:
Originally Posted by Groggy
Another thing that I have noticed since the new Wiki-blog default page has been up, is that google search is not at the bottom of the page, unlike the U-beauts page
One thing that is annoying me...
When i log on the page changes to the wiki-blog default and i have to change it back everytime i log on.....
Is there a way for me to set it up so i only get the u-beaut page type...
ps. im not a computer literate IT ninja so might be skipping right over it?
Set the skin to U-Beauts it in your User CP (top left side of nav bar on every screen) and don't log off, just leave. This will automatically log you off the site but won't clear the cookies on your computer which hold the information re your page skins, etc.
Much quicker and easier and a lot less annoying.
Cheers - Neil :U
Just posted a new thread ad noticed that you now add 10 piccies per post, rather than the old 5.
Beauty!:2tsup:
Hi
Content deleted by author.
This was inappropriate content and I apologise to all that may have been ofended.
Hells bells Neil, there must be times when you think "What the 'ell am I doing this for, whingers you can try to ignore its the bl*** whiners saying Iam not complaining but....
Fair crap man your not paying for the priviledge of this site, accept what the powers that be (Who, incidentally, do this for nothing, sometimes for the accolades) do, if you dont like it leave/shudup/pissorf. But for a site that has hours of commitment in its running, all done by co-erced(?):D volenteers there sure are a lot of belly achers around
I like the new format, yes it will take time to use the new system but thats life suckers.:o
I think it's great that you can collapse a whole section if you're not interested in it, and equally great that you can still see a list of the sub-forums in case you're looking for something. Some text books are laid out this way, with a full table of contents listing in the front and then a summary listing under each chapter heading, so you can go to the heading you want and then scan the sub-listing and straight away see what topics are covered. Having them laid out horizontally means it doesn't take up a lot of vertical space. The shape of your screen lends itself to horizontal presentation. Obviously the sponsor logos still need to presented to honour the sponsorship arrangement. They appear in the collapsed view and also in the expanded view next to the sponsored forum. If there was a way of suppressing them from the summary in the expanded view, then that would obviously be better, but the page would probably need to be refreshed to do it because changing the whole area using DHTML would be a bit jarring and would confuse some browsers.
Trivial issues like spacing and hyper link underlining are just matters of style and not really important in the scheme of things to the majority of people. I'm fussier than most with these things in my own work, being a bit pedantic, but in all honesty very few users I've come across notice.
Yep thats right and we would still be driving a FX holden with no power steering and other extras including carpet.Quote:
Originally Posted by MrFixIt