feeling a bit deflated

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Originally Posted by Sturdee

In the circumstances, after their request for a lower price, I would go back to them with a non negotiable counter offer which is higher than the original quote. When asked why tell them it's because of the aggravation caused to you.

In any case this looks like he is going to be the client from hell and you'd be better of without him or get paid adequately for the troubles he will cause you.

Peter.

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I agree more with this reply than any of the others...increase, not merely sit on the original quote! Show the true value you place in your work/services!
In addition to the aggravation (or more likely, insult) they've caused, you could add the usual increases in on-costs that have occurred since the original quote. Fuel, electricity, materials! It should finally get the point across to them that you aren't doing it for their pleasure alone, but as a business. Hopefully they'll withdraw from the negotiations and find someone else, who'll do one of two things: take it on for their price and get shafted in the process (no longer your problem), or come up with a quote well above yours which will prove your worth.
Anyway, one thing I've learned from taking on public art commissions, always add a buffer to the quote!:rolleyes: It can then work as something for negotiation, or more likely as a contingency, for when things go pear-shaped (delays, increases in materials above original quotes, reworking parts for the fluff-up fairy:-).

As for David's problem with catering, I can't believe someone would baulk at that! Even a basic buffet for a wedding costs at least $35 per head. You couldn't get a fried food meal for a poor student at the Refectory here for $6. Again, quote The Castle's best line...

Cheers

I wouldn't suggest you resort to requoting at a higher price or build in a fudge factor. Regardless of how you feel about this upstart, those actions can only cause resentment, which can never be helpful. Explain to the customer that you have a policy of not compromising on either price or quality, because the two can only go hand in hand. Then,whether he accepts your quote or walks away, you retain your dignity and you won't lose sleep.

Keith

If you can afford to let the job go, tell him to F off.... if he's a pain in the asre now imagine what it will be like once he see's the project in progress... further insults to your intelligence and working capacity...

AS a preface to the following comment let me state that I am a hobbyist and thankfully dont have to put up with the sort of crap that you proffi's do. (I feel for you all...)

--------> FLAME UP-------> this whole sitaution $heets me.... so many of the professional cabinetmakers are so hard up that they underquote and take SHeet from customers. As an industry a collective stance needs to be made - if they dont like it they should off to Ikea or freedom furniture....



its like asking woolies for a discount because you've always shopped there!

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Originally Posted by tomartyr

I wouldn't suggest you resort to requoting at a higher price or build in a fudge factor. Regardless of how you feel about this upstart, those actions can only cause resentment, which can never be helpful. Explain to the customer that you have a policy of not compromising on either price or quality, because the two can only go hand in hand. Then,whether he accepts your quote or walks away, you retain your dignity and you won't lose sleep.

Keith

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I think this is the soundest bit of advice. From the sounds of it, you're not trying to tell him to sod off - you just want to set the ground rules for dealing with you. You offer X quality at Y price. just like every one else. Including McDonalds (maybe mention that they don't negotiate either :) ).

Cheers,
Dave

My 2 bobs worth - dont lower your price because this client is only going to be picky when it is finished and want somethng changed - if only just to have a "win" against you.

Tel him thats your quote , you are busy but should be able to fit it in before christmas - and see how it goes.

I dont think you are losing much if they go elsewhere. They know the quality of your work and shouldnt insult you by asking for a discount.

Good luck

Hi Michael,

I guess the bit that really doesn't sit well with me is the use of customer family connections in order to be, lets say.....emotionally persuasive. Just a little unclear where the privelege is for you here -the factor that makes it worthwhile dropping your price. Call me a plastic toy short of a happy meal by all means, but I'm completely missing the logic that seems to equate to you having done great work for the father before, so now you're being asked to do more great work for the son........but cheaper? Isn't it more the norm that once the quality of someone's work is established the price increases? I really don't know, but something tells me that if this is how things are starting out, it could be posible trouble. :rolleyes:

Hi Michael

I agree with most of what the others have said, but a few more points....

1. In my experience people who negotiate solely on cost still expect the same quality ....

2. If you cave on your quoted price you might be lucky (?) to secure further commissions from them in the future but at their price not yours ... you might also find a few referrals but these will also expect a discount based on the referee telling them that they negotiated you down.

3. In fairness to the party seeking the commission.... all things are negotiable but when you're told no this is it then that's it. Many businesses operate on the basis that there's a fudge factor built in and therefore they can ask for a discount, very few operate on the this is my best price, once only, basis. The probably expect that as all their other dealings are on this basis.

4. You need to stand firm on your price - your quality, experience and craftsmanship are what they are buying - the product/job itself is just the souvenir of that experience and skill.

5. Never give away a breakdown of how you arrived at your price.

FWIW my counsel would be to congratulate yourself on sticking to your price and let it go. Don't chase them. If they come back to you you have the upper hand - if they still want a discount well "sorry but I factor everything into my quote and give the best price - I don't factor in discounts that are a bonus to me if they are never asked for... I craft exquisite pieces at a fair price and that's the way it is (and btw your father knew that... that's why he came back!)". If they don't come back you've saved yourself problems with complaints after the job or changes during the work. You may think you've lost some money but in reality you've saved yourself time, money and more importantly piece of mind!

Oh and if they don't come back for 3 mths or more then I'd be looking at reviewing the quote in light of any additional costs for materials and whatever that may have occurred during that time (after all everything seems to be headed for price increases) and at that time you may want to consider what some of the other learned folk in here have suggested - a premium (for this client only) on top of what you would otherwise have quoted to compensate you for anguish or whatever (my dad used to do this with ppl who had stuffed him around on jobs he did - he'd add an item to the quote/bill noted as "S.A.F." - very few ppl asked what it was but those who did were told straight up 'that's a stuff around fee... you stuffed me about so I charged you for it' - never was this ever dropped and it was always paid!).

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Originally Posted by MALPT

4. You need to stand firm on your price - your quality, experience and craftsmanship are what they are buying - the product/job itself is just the souvenir of that experience and skill.

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Well said:2tsup:

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Originally Posted by underfoot

Yep, what everyone else said Mic.
I have a deal with a couple of friends in the same business (carving /sculpture)
if I'm having pricing dramas with annoying customers I will pass on contact details of other carvers who can do the job (my mates), and they will then double or triple my quote,

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hehe - thats cool:2tsup:

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Originally Posted by MALPT

...he'd add an item to the quote/bill noted as "S.A.F." - very few ppl asked what it was but those who did were told straight up 'that's a stuff around fee... you stuffed me about so I charged you for it' - never was this ever dropped and it was always paid!).

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Must remember that!:2tsup:

Hi Mike. They simply do not understand where you are coming from and want a cheaper price. Don't get drawn into an emotional debate over it, or read things into their comments that may not be there (intentionally). Simply stick to your guns and be polite (unless they are directly and intentionally rude). If they say "no thanks, price too high" that is fine, you've lost a customer. If it turns ugly they will badmouth you every chance they get, maybe causing the loss of many customers.

Short version, keep the hurt inside and be business-like, think for the long term without lowering your prices.

Good luck. :2tsup:

Thanks everyone for the feedback, I have read them all and taken it onboard. I got an email back from them today asking to proceed with the job at the quoted price, so I'm happy about that. Now it's time to get on with what I do best.

Thanks!

Cheers
Michael

Good Work! Onwards and upwards

After reading all that I am glad that they have proceeded with the original quote... just hope it all comes out well for you at the other end. I really like the "SAF" fee noted previously too:2tsup:, put it on the quote and then don't charge it if they are good customers.

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Originally Posted by corbs

After reading all that I am glad that they have proceeded with the original quote... just hope it all comes out well for you at the other end. I really like the "SAF" fee noted previously too:2tsup:, put it on the quote and then don't charge it if they are good customers.

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Exactly!!... Add in the SAF fee dont explain it you DONT have to!... thats your NDA (negotiated discount amount) do that and you get the job at your FIRST quote and your happy while the customer gets their "discount" and feels good... everyones happy... easy as :2tsup:

Shane