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This link takes you to a transcript of a speech given on Monday by the President of Columbia University as he introduced the President of Iran, Mahmoud Ahmadinejad.
It's one of histories great and bravest speeches and one you'll never forget.
http://www.azstarnet.com/sn/hourlyupdate/202820.php
Ross... sorry to disagree with you mate... but it showed an appalling level of and degree of discourtesy and disrespect to someone that the Uni INVITED to speak... he wasnt asked he didnt ask he was INVITED by the Uni to give a speach... and was insulted abused denigrated and verbally castigated by someone who should have known better... an incident of increadible bad taste.
If you invite someone to give a talk then it behoves you as the representative of that invite to treat the invitee to a degree of respect and dignity that is their due.
That he is the figurehead president of Iran is irrelevent what is relevent is that from the day he landed in the USA he has been treated with total disrespect and shown a total lack of regard for international decorum by the USA
The fact that the Ayotolla runs Iran and he is simply a figurehead leader with little power in his country is as I said irrelevent... he is seen for all intents and purposes as a dignitary or his country and should be shown due respect.
Tell me Ross how would you feel if it was Howard who was invited to the USA and upon landing in New York felt the need to spend some time mourning the losses at ground zero upon arrival you are turned away... for no other reason than hes Australian... no other reason... Iran had nothing to do with 9/11 nothing at all... neither by the way did China Japan the Netherlands, Saudi Arabia and a multitude of other countries but their dignitaries their representatives have ALL without fail ALL of them been allowed to visit ground zero and pay their respects on behalf of their countries... but the president of Iran is not allowed to? That is insulting demeaning and inflamitory on an international level
Then to cap it off hes... lets again say its Howard... hes invited that is they ASKED him to come and give a speach to the faculty and students and he does... but BEFORE Howard has a chance to say ANYTHING AT ALL the chancellor stands up and verbally abuses castigates denigrates not only Howard the man Howard the PM but also Australia the country
HOW THE HELL WOULD YOU FEEL? Pretty damned shocked Id think then angry as hell
I wonder how bush or the USA would feel if it was Bush who that was done to? not to bloody happy is my bet... but this bloke has to take it on the chin and just walk away??? bloody hell my hats of to him for containing his temper and fury at the insults.
Bollinger should have his ass kicked to high heaven for his comments... not made out to be some sort of demigod of brilliance for insulting a visiting dignitary of another country! Its called respect something that is sadly lacking in most of whats coming out of the states at present... but then its to be expected if the leadership has equally little respect it only follows that it flows down to those other tin gods in positions of "power"
The one who stood out was the president for his quiet spoken respect and dignity especially since it was mere minutes since he and his country was verbally abused by this moron
Good speach? MY ASS... IT WAS APPALLING AND INSULTING!
Thanks for the strong response, Dingo. I see where you're coming from. I think though that this isn't just an American response to a Middle Eastern (read oil-controlling) Arab leader. To me it's a lesson in free speech given to a despodic dictator who won't allow free speech in his own nation.
Yes, even though I'm an ardent Leftie, and oppose a lot of John Howard's conservative views, like you I would be horrified and angry if he was treated like that. But to misquote some American Presidential candidate in a debate a few years ago: "Mahmoud Ahmadinejad ain't no John Howard".
Mahmoud Ahmadinejad's a murdering dictator along Saddam Hussein lines. These people rule by terror, by killing off people who say (or are imagined to say) the "wrong thing".
I thought that Bollinger "gave it to him straight" in a way that was beyond the ability of political leaders who have to toe the diplomatic line. His was a heartfelt and frank critique of Ahmadinejad's humanity, stupidity (this idiot denied the Holocaust, called 911 into question, and suggested that there were no homosexuals in Iran), ignorance and agenda.
Ding, great response, could not have said it better myself, no.....correction, could not have said it half as well:2tsup:.
Ding is correct.
What has been proven here? NOTHING other than what has been voiced by Ding.
IF the guy is so bad (and I'm not disputing that) WHY was he even allowed into the country? An all round appalling state of affairs I'd say.
Glad we've got Border Patrol watching over us.:2tsup:
P
:cool:
I heard some of the speech on the radio the other day.
Disgusting display. Why did they even invite him to talk? If they were so hell bent on insulting him, they could have done that from home.
woodbe.
Got to agree with the Dingo on this one
TM
G'day,
I like everyone else have to and whole heartedly agree with Dingo. I saw the story on SBS news and was appalled by the "speech" given by President of the Uni.
I saw the speech on the tube, and part of Ahmadinejad's responses. My first sense was approval of Bollinger, but I'm persuaded that Shane (WD) has a much more enlightened take on it; especially considering that he was invited to be sandbagged.
Even so, CBS' 60 minutes had a more polite interview with him last Sunday, and he seemed utterly incapable of giving a straight answer to anything. Particularly galling was his "gentle" smile while saying, in effect, "You people are all arzoles."
USA doesn't have the prerogative of refusing his entry. He was visiting the UN; I think Iran is still a member.
Joe
Ross Im sorry but this is quite incorrect
Mahmoud is a figurehead... a mouthpeice of the Ayotolla who RUNS Iran... Ayotolla Kahamini (Gawd I have trouble spelling that blasted name) is the POWER AND RULER of Iran supreme mufti if you will... Mahmoud is a president in name only has no power to enact laws to control people the army or anything else a figurehead of a more acceptable sort to westerners than the hardline Ayotola.Quote:
Mahmoud Ahmadinejad's a murdering dictator along Saddam Hussein lines. These people rule by terror, by killing off people who say (or are imagined to say) the "wrong thing".
In western society to say President is to invoke in people someone of supreme power and control such as president bush... commander in cheif... we westerners accept that its easier to handle than a religious zealot such as the Ayotolla... thus by having an appearance of acceptable western understood "leadership" Iran has some ability to approach the UN and industry etc to gain what they want or need... if say the Ayotolla or one of the mufti (note I hope Im right with that mufti term here but otherwise meaning another religious leader) were to attempt to do so they would fail automatically due to perceptions and historical events... so they put in place someone like Mahmoud who is acceptable to westerners.
The killings and such that occur in Iran are done under the orders of the Ayotolla who CONTROLS the country... Mahmoud does not control nor have a say in anything of substance in the country.
Iran is not the only country who would like to see an end to Israel... to remove it from the face of the earth... rightly or wrongly many other countries and people believe that it should not exist.
As to comments regarding the halocaust never happening... many a commentator and dignitary has expressed similar thoughts...
If you watch and listen to the comment about homosexuals in Iran you will see the smile as he says it... I believe he was making something called humor?... to lighten the mood of the speech... many speakers do that I personally believe that is what he was doing.
Imagine Ross how angry he must have been how insulted he must have felt... this person who was to introduce him was insulting and abusing him BEFORE he had even stood up and said a single word!!! And they had INVITED HIM!!
I was shocked and appalled that someone in Bollingers position would have the temerity and lack of good grace and common courtesy to do such a thing.
NO MATTER WHAT ELSE... Iranian President Mahmoud Ahmadinejad was an INVITED guest of the USA and an INVITED guest speaker at the University... INVITED... I dont know about you Ross but no one should treat an invited guest in such an underhanded and dispicable manner
President Mahmoud Ahmadinejad was the winner on the day for his good grace and quiet manner in the face of direct insult... and a far better man on the day than Bollinger ever has been or is likely to be given his comments.
Funny you say he called 9/11 into question Ross... funny in that the man WENT TO NEW YORK to where the towers once stood to PAY HIS RESPECTS as a person as a President of a foreign nation as a visiting foreign dignitary AND WAS DENIED ACCESS!!! Not a wonder he questions it!... as I said a great many dignitaries and envoys from many many nations around the world including such countries as Rawanda as Zimbabwe etc have gone there have paid their respects WITHOUT any hinderance or question! Yet now Iran is denied... then insulted and denigrated? good god man wouldnt you be a tad phissed off? Me Id be bloody furious!
But enough... sufficed to say that your saying "President Mahmoud Ahmadinejad is a despodic dictator who won't allow free speech in his own nation" is very incorrect... The Ayotolla RUNS Iran not the President so he hasnt the ability nor power to allow or disallow anything... and this "Mahmoud Ahmadinejad's a murdering dictator along Saddam Hussein lines. These people rule by terror, by killing off people who say (or are imagined to say) the "wrong thing". is again wrong... Saddam had SUPREME CONTROL of Iraq... he was the be all and end all he was the end of the line there was no one above him in Iraq... not so in Iran if you were to say "Ayotolla Kahameni (sp?) is a murdering dictator along Saddam Hussein lines. These people rule by terror, by killing off people who say (or are imagined to say) the "wrong thing". You would be correct but not Mahmoud Ahmadinejad's he is only a mouthpeice of the Ayotolla and a figurehead of "acceptability and normalisy" for westerners... thats it he has no power has no decree or ability to dictate to anyone that is the role of the SUPREME POWER in Iran the Ayotolla Kahameini (spelling PLEASE!)
Bollinger took the dias and tore strips of a VISITOR a GUEST and then proceeded to do the same for that visitors country!! It seems to me of late that many Americans on all levels seem to take the stand that they can and will say whatever they please to whoever they please and tuff shyte if they dont like it!! typical bully boy tactics of power hungry despots if you ask me... luckily you didnt eh?!
Sorry about this Ross but you are mistaken on several levels... nothing personal mate just wanted to straighten a few points you made... if however you dont believe me I suggest you simply google "Leader of Iran" then "Supreme leader of Iran" this will no doubt clear a few points up for you... and thats not meant to sound condescending either mate!!
Cheers
Shane
Sorry Joe I didnt see your post... probably cross posted eh? :doh:Quote:
Originally Posted by joe greiner
I didnt see the 60 minutes report with him... but do you not understand why he would feel like that toward the USA? It amazes me that he actually stayed there at all... As I said I cant comment on the interview simply because I didnt see it.
I dunno.
The Iranian President may be powerless, and the words he says and actions he takes may be deemed to be required for him to hold his position, but most people will not repeatedly spout such garbage if they don't agree with at least some of it.
I think he is just as bad as he appears, powerless or not.
On the other hand, what the University clown said was pretty gutless and derogatory, especially toward a head of state.
A greater and braver act would have been this.
"Ladies and Gentlemen, the President of Iran, Mahmoud Ahmadinejad".
And then just walked out of the room.
No nasty words. Just a simple unspoken statement that says "I don't like what you say, and I won't waste my time listening to it".
If the Uniclown is so much better than Mahmoud Ahmadinejad, why should he stoop to the same, nay lower level of behaviour? :?
No respect for either of them really. :no:
Frankly, it is felt in some circles that the uni prez was responding to political pressure. He had been castigated for allowing the bloke to be invited in the first place. So he didn't want to be seen as agreeing with him.
But Shane is right. If you invite him, you've invited him--so shut up. A simple intro as Schtoo mentioned would have been appropriate.
I'm not running a pro-American oil/imperialism argument here. I thought that Bollinger was standing up for the silenced and repressed people of Iran. He was saying, in effect, that in the USA we have freedom of speech, and I now want to give you a demo of what that actually means:
Here's what I think of you....
Now you can respond.
Actually, of course, we do have freedom of speech. That's how the bloke got invited at all. And from the academic perspective I see nothing wrong with it--uni's are supposed to be bastions of free thinking and entertaining all points of view. I just wish I knew whether he made that speech from his heart or from political considerations. I'll never know.Quote:
Originally Posted by Rossluck
What he said wasn't polite and I think he could have done it differently, but you are correct that he can say anything he pleases and that is one thing that separates democracies from dictatorships.