Rendering question

[cinderella]

Hi. Im new to the DIY home renovations, and was considering doing some rendering to some internal brick walls in our staircase and hallway. But I am unsure about what I believe rendering actually is. From what I have read rendering leaves a 10-12mm coating on the brick work which can be painted. This I believe leaves a smoooth or textured surface. But I have seen houses that have been what I thought rendered, and you can still actually see the brick formation through the render which is then painted. So it gives you a smoother finish than brick, but not so smooth that you cant tell it's not actually brick.

Can someone tell me what I am talking about?

[Burnsy]

Generally your first description is correct, render should leave a flat surface that you can not see the bricks through. Some specialty renders may have brick or block lines cut into it or may use a pattern or texture on the surface of the render.

Some textured coatings are available that you can roll or bag onto brickwork, with these you can still make out the outline of the bricks.

[whizbang102000]

Hi,

I'm just in the process, as DIY'er, of taking on rendering the outside of my house and so far I've spent $240 on the tools I need. Can I suggest you contemplate getting someone to do it for you as you only need a small area done.

[Vernonv]

It really depends on how thick the render coating is.

If you have 10mm of render on the bricks, you won't see the brick outline. However if you put on a thin layer (by using a bagging method, or something similar) then you may still see the brick outline.

The finish you want determines how you apply and finish the render.

[cinderella]

Thanks for the replies. I am thinking that 'bagging' might be the way to go as I dont think I want to go as far as getting a perfect flat surface, and I dont mind the shape and look of the brickwork coming through.

What exactly is bagging? It sounds a bit easier than rendering and might be the way to go for a new DIY.

I actually have more brick work than just the hallway to do, thats just where I am starting. The entire downstairs of the house is brick, but the previous onwer has used 2 different types of bricks around the place, and then painted over some of brick work as well. My intention is to make it all uniform throughout the house, and then move onto the outside when I have a little more experience.

Can you do this bagging over painted brick?

[Vernonv]

What exactly is bagging?

You're probably best to do a search on it, but basically it's applying the render with a cloth/bag/sack.


Can you do this bagging over painted brick?

I wouldn't suggest it.

[cinderella]

Ok, I read a bit on bagging and sounds like its what I'm looking for. I read a bit about a product that applies on like a paint with a special roller, and with 2-3 coats you can get the same effect as bagging and apparently it's much easier to apply. Anyone heard of this?

And what can I do to my painted brick walls to make them able to be bagged?

[droog]

Dulux make products like you are talking about:

http://www.dulux.com.au/html/planning/product_range_exterior_effects.aspx

You would need to check if it is suitable over a pre painted surface.

Regards Dave

[Vernonv]

I've used the Dulux Render Effects (see Dave's link), but you need to put it on an already flat surface i.e. a plaster, fibro or rendered wall.

So at the very least you would need to bag the wall (to fill in the mortar lines) before painting with the Render Effects paint.

[droog]

I have not used the product myself but have looked at them in the past, the Dulux Full Cover Texture was more the product I was referring to. It is supossed to fill the motar gaps.

Regards Dave

[mnorman007]

The Dulux product IS supposed to fill the mortar gaps but I've never met anybody who has had it work for them (as well as rendering/bagging).

I asked the question about the product about 6 months ago (do a search on it) and was advised against it.

Always welcome to hear that its improved though so let us know how you go with it if you choose this.

[cinderella]

Anyone out there used this product before. I would like to know what sort of area the 10 litre covers.

Considering it costs $115 for the 10 litres, it could get very expensive this way. It would probably do ok for a small area, but I cant see it being economical for anything else.

If I was going to do the bagging, can I buy the pre mixed render bags from bunnings, and use them to bag, or is it a different mixture to rendering.

[mnorman007]

Yes you can use the render bags from bunnings but they are more expensive then making it yourself with plasterers sand and cement.

[Master Splinter]

Bagging is pretty easy to do, even for a first timer. Its just as messy as all hell.

Tools - wheelbarrow, spade or mixing hoe, and a mid size broom (yes, good old push broom), and - if you are doing it inside - more than a few tarpaulins to protect the floor.

If you have delicate skin...no, skip that, just if you have skin...get some decent barrier cream and some cheap riggers gloves to protect your hands. A day playing with lime/cement mortar is pretty much like soaking your hands in machine dishwasher detergent.

Mix up a sloppy (not runny, but it shouldn't hold its own shape too well) mortar mix - 5:1:1 sand:lime:cement in the wheelbarrow.

Dunk broom head in mortar, broom onto wall. Fiddly areas can be done with a bannister brush as you go along. Its not an exact process, so expect to make a bit of mess on any adjoining walls/floor/ceiling/cat/car.

As it looses water to the wall, you can hit it with a wooden float (ie piece of pine stud from the trash pile) just to even it out a bit more if you don't like the rough and sometimes bumpy finish that a broom can leave. If the mortar joins are under filled, go over it again a few days later (when you stop being sore from the first go!).

Painted walls - should be primed with something like bondcrete or hit with a grinder to get a good bit of the paint off.

And if you then decide that the finish isn't quite what you were after, you can hit it with that dulux render paint stuff, safe in the knowledge that you've avoided buying several big tins worth of it as you have done most of the surface filling already.

[autogenous]

Its an acquired skill to get it flat

If you are not paining it then put some damp proofing additive such as Aquapel in it to prevent water ingress which shows up the differing water egress rates when it gets wet.

I think you are discussing sand face finish. Pump on, screed, sponge
A bit more to that but again concrete shoes for me to hand off trade secrets.

If its painted remove scaling and use cement/hydrocrete/water mix prior to applying

hydrocrete is acrylic based, bondcrete is pva based (breaks down i high water contact)

This will slow the water evaporation rate.