Telstra Dealer Calls NextG Utter Crap

[echnidna]

Here (http://forums.whirlpool.net.au/forum-replies-archive.cfm/761839.html)

[Wood Borer]

The fact they are a Telstra Dealer does not mean they have any technical ability. They are mostly sales sucks who have access to big $s and are prepared to put up with the cr@p that Telstra dishes out to them. They are privately owned shops who pay a fortune to Telstra for the signage and are locked in to selling only Telstra products - in other words essentially a franchise.

The lack of technical knowledge is demostrated by the words used by this person including the mispelling of aerial. I wish they didn't pretend they know what they are talking about and qualifying their ignorance with "I am a Telstra Dealer".

Having said that, 3G coverage in the bush is sadly lacking.

Up here Telstra told our community if we want mobile coverage then we have to come up with $230,000 if we want a mobile tower. What an insult and a demonstration that Telstra is no longer involved in providing telecommunications for the people but more into pampering their precious shareholders.

[echnidna]

I'm going somewhere else when they close the isdn down.
Nextg phones here are hopeless, so hows the nextg net gunna work.

They intend to treble the cost of internet compared to their present isdn charges.
When I go their phone goes too coz I'll go engin etc.

Don't think virgin will work out here , pity.
Another option is westvic but they're a little exxy

Anyway I'm waiting to see what comes out of the Elders/Optus partnership.

In any event I'm not rushing into anything as its all too fluid at the moment.
Though if virgin was suitable out here I might be tempted to go now.

[Wood Borer]

I agree with you Bob, it's a difficult decision.

I worked for Telecom for quite a few years in many areas and in those days the decisions were mainly based on providing communications for all Australians with quite of clever engineering decisions.

Telecom were once world beaters in technology and they gave their staff every opportunity to improve themselves thus improving the service levels. I was fortunate and privelaged to work for them during that time.

These days many of the techs and engineers have been given packages and the decisions seem to be based merely on profit and share prices.

I used to be loyal to the old company because of what it did and what it stood for even though there were many areas for improvement. Now I treat them the same as I do any other telecommunications company even if the alternatives are offshore companies.

[rodm]

How are the country brigades affected by the change to digital mobiles? Is there enough coverage with digital or are they operating on VHF radios or other communication?

[Sebastiaan56]

What an insult and a demonstration that Telstra is no longer involved in providing telecommunications for the people but more into pampering their precious shareholders.

Yup, that what they are on about now. Aint privatisation grand.....

[Wood Borer]

How are the country brigades affected by the change to digital mobiles? Is there enough coverage with digital or are they operating on VHF radios or other communication?

Digital mobile is not an option up here for any purpose although there are some rare spots where if you stand and point in the right direction with your hands in the air you can get signal at times.

An interesting point for those who are unaware - if you are in an area where mobile coverage is non existent, your mobile batteries will flatten quicker than if you are in an area with coverage. I understand the mobiles are automatically increasing their sensistivity in poor coverage areas by increasing their gain thus drawing more current. Switch them off in poor coverage areas.

We use VHF for the Fire Brigade but coverage is still very poor. Despite requests for a repeater and the large fires we had last year, there are no plans for a repeater. This means that tankers and crews are often out of communication range and are expected to look after themselves for the sake of some clerk getting a pat on the back because they kept under budget.

UHF fills in some gaps that are not covered by the VHF even though the bases and mobile radios are side by side. This is a bit surprising because UHF is more line of sight than VHF however that is the way it is here.

Privatisation to please investors at the expense of providing service seems ridiculous to me but I am probably in the minority with this opinion possibly because I don't worship $$$$'s.

I wonder if we would get mobile coverage and VHF repeaters if a politician came to grief up here and couldn't summon help. If they did raise an alarm, the emergency services couldn't communicate due to lack of coverage!:o

[wheelinround]

Welcome to the world of free enterprise and false advertising
I make it look good on paper
I'll get my squillion payout and my mates who cover for me
Who cares what the customer pays for
I go home afterwards and someone else can clean up the mess
This way also Australia is left lagging behind the rest of the world.

One of the largest share holders is the Government super funds.

[DavidG]

Telstra should have been split into two parts.
A network provider which provided services to all at the same costings.
And a retail section that had to compete on an equal footing.

[RufflyRustic]

HWMNBO and I went to change his CDMA phone on the weekend. Had a look a the digitial network, the 3G and the Next G network. Very unimpressed by all 3, especially with telstra keeping Next G to themselves.

After thinking about it for a couple of days, we decided to transfer him to Digitial, staying with our current provider. It means he's going to have practically no coverage :( beyond some towns and the truck phone until the digital network is expanded over the next few years.

But, this was better than going for Telstra's rip off deal - imho.

[Big Shed]

Telstra should have been split into two parts.
A network provider which provided services to all at the same costings.
And a retail section that had to compete on an equal footing.

That's the way it was done with the privatisation of electricity, so why not with Telstra?

The current situation is a dog's breakfast:((.

[rodm]

WB
Thanks and fairly much the same over here. It is a shame because CDMA had good coverage in comparison.
Work changed my mobile over and all it wants to do is connect to the internet. :((
I think I will start to store it in a bucket of water soon. :D

[woodbe]

That's the way it was done with the privatisation of electricity, so why not with Telstra?

Maximum return to the government on the share sale, where we all got the chance to buy what was already ours.

In other words, the greed of vested interests won the day leaving an intelligent solution that might have suited all Australians in the dust.

Telstra has been rotten for a long time before the privatisation though, despite the fact that it was generally better for all consumers back then. A government supported monopoly is only a good idea for the short term to get things started.

woodbe.

[MrFixIt]

Hi

telstra keeping Next G to themselves.

Optus also have NextG.

[wattlewemake]

I have just moved from Telstra to optus due to arguements over service and the astronomical costs Telstra was charging me.
On a side note, at my house in the middle of Brisbane, with optus I am getting a way better signal than what I could with Telstra. I dont have move around the house trying to get a decent signal. This is with my original handset... my new phone is a month old and I have only seen it for about 1/2 that time.... been in the shop being repaired for the rest of the time:((

Shane.

[RufflyRustic]

Hi


Optus also have NextG.


:(( Not according to the salespeople we spoke with on Saturday :((

Grrrrrrr

Thanks for the heads up MrFixIt, I'll look into that further methinks!

cheers
Wendy

[bitingmidge]

Hi
Optus also have NextG.

Sure they do. If you live in a City.

Wendy, it's not a case of Telstra keeping it to themselves, it's a case of the other service providers not building infrastructure. Before you go off to someone else, make sure you can get reception where you need it.

If you are on another network, and it uses the Telstra one when it doesn't have it's own stations, the charges can be a little um... more than you expect.

Cheers,

P

[Wood Butcher]

Optus call it the 3G network. I have my phone on it and would get as good if not occasionally better service than Telstra. Never noticed the charges though because I pretty much only use the phone to recieve call or call SWMBO which is free because our phones are on the same account.

[bitingmidge]

I've just checked and it appears that the cost structure has changed somewhat from the last time I read the fine print. I'd be guessing if there's no cover now, there's no cover. Living in an area that has no cover, which puts me in 4% of Australia's population according to Optus, I tend to look at the fine print!

I can't download the coverage maps, so I guess I can't help!

Cheers,

P
:D

[woodbe]

Optus call it the 3G network.

Just to be clear, 3G is available from Telstra and Optus and others. NextG is Telstra-only, and it is not 3G.

I'm unaware of any sublicensing to other carriers. It's a typical Telstra gatekeeper ploy to exclude competition from their network.

woodbe.

[bitingmidge]

It's a typical Telstra gatekeeper ploy to exclude competition from their network.
What's the big deal with that?

If I made a particular product, why would I let my competitors use my factory to make a competing product?

I just don't get it. If the other players have a problem because Telstra has the infrastructure, then why don't they do something about it? Oh that's right, it's not profitable for them!

cheers,

P

[astrid]

What sebastiaan 58 said
Aint privatisation grand.
In Telecom we had a world class system, investment from OS, research and developement.
Now wevr got B all.
Ditto with public transport, water, electricity etc etc
Privativation of public utilities never equates to better service to the public.

Astrid

[ptc]

will not work in my place. had to send it back
cdma had no problems here.
now we are stuffed.
when is he going back to mexico !!!
I object to being stripped of a good working phone.

[OLDPHART]

I don't see how you can get better reception from Optus,they are only buying the cals at a wholesale rate from Telstra, and Optus sells them to you at a retail rate.Optus don't provide infrastucture as far as I'm aware.Telsta still own the lines that carry your phones,so you are stuck between a rock and a hard place.
Until we get a provider that is able to by pass Telstras hold over us we will just have to put up with it!!:(

[bitingmidge]

We're talking mobile service here, where each operator provides its own infrastructure. It's all rather silly really.

P

[RufflyRustic]

I suppose what I'm really peeved about is that HWMNBO will not have decent mobile phone service in South West QLD, regardless of which carrier is used, regardless of which type of service used. Having had a very good look at the maps, there are more dead spots than there are live spots.

As HWMNBO said, "why can't we simply use Analogue. It was the only service that worked and worked well in more areas than any other type of service" and "why the heck can't they make a mobile phone, robust enough with just the simple service needs only, with keys large enough to see and use without fumbling - make and receive voice calls, send and receive text messages, a contacts list, received/missed/made calls lists and a standard telephone sounding ringtone that's loud enough to be heard by those with a touch of industrial deafness"

I think he was being rhetorical:rolleyes:, wasn't he?:?

[woodbe]

What's the big deal with that?

If I made a particular product, why would I let my competitors use my factory to make a competing product?

I just don't get it. If the other players have a problem because Telstra has the infrastructure, then why don't they do something about it? Oh that's right, it's not profitable for them!

cheers,

P

The 'big deal' is that we are supposed to have a competitive communications infrastructure, and Telstra has been acting like a monopoly for too long. The 'big deal' is that they are now a private company, and the spoils of monopolistic behaviour go to their executives and shareholders (if there is anything left after the execs get their snouts out of the trough)

Ask all the ISP's who have been trying to get naked DSL past the door so that they can offer world class DSL to Australian Consumers, Ask the various carriers who have invested in Infrastructure only to have the carpet pulled from under their feet.

All this stuff is a 'big deal' because it consumes investment money in the communications sector in under-performing and short-lived communications assets (including Telstra). Why is that a problem? Because it drives the costs up, and we all land up paying through the nose for services.

NextG is a big deal because it does not perform as advertised, and it is a Telstra-only network. So it is yet another monopoly position. It also requires different handsets (another expense foisted on consumers)

There are chinks in the armor though. The recent pullout of Telstra from the National Broadband initiative is a clear indication that they are unwilling to compete on equal terms with other vendors, an action that will not have gone unnoticed in the halls of power.

woodbe.

[Big Shed]

As HWMNBO said, "why can't we simply use Analogue. It was the only service that worked and worked well in more areas than any other type of service" and "why the heck can't they make a mobile phone, robust enough with just the simple service needs only, with keys large enough to see and use without fumbling - make and receive voice calls, send and receive text messages, a contacts list, received/missed/made calls lists and a standard telephone sounding ringtone that's loud enough to be heard by those with a touch of industrial deafness"

I think he was being rhetorical:rolleyes:, wasn't he?:?


That sounds like my original "bag phone", great job it did too!:2tsup:

Haven't had decent mobile coverage since analogue was switched of, now they are switching off CDMA, that only lasted a few years.:doh:

[munruben]

will not work in my place. had to send it back
cdma had no problems here.
now we are stuffed.
when is he going back to mexico !!!
I object to being stripped of a good working phone.Same here CDMA worked fine 3G is useless in this area.


As HWMNBO said, "why can't we simply use Analogue. It was the only service that worked and worked well in more areas Something to do with bandwidth I think. They can put more customers on the 3G system.

[bitingmidge]

The 'big deal' is that we are supposed to have a competitive communications infrastructure, and Telstra has been acting like a monopoly for too long. The 'big deal' is that they are now a private company, and the spoils of monopolistic behaviour go to their executives and shareholders (if there is anything left after the execs get their snouts out of the trough)

Ask all the ISP's who have been trying to get naked DSL past the door so that they can offer world class DSL to Australian Consumers, Ask the various carriers who have invested in Infrastructure only to have the carpet pulled from under their feet.

All this stuff is a 'big deal' because it consumes investment money in the communications sector in under-performing and short-lived communications assets (including Telstra). Why is that a problem? Because it drives the costs up, and we all land up paying through the nose for services.

NextG is a big deal because it does not perform as advertised, and it is a Telstra-only network. So it is yet another monopoly position. It also requires different handsets (another expense foisted on consumers)

There are chinks in the armor though. The recent pullout of Telstra from the National Broadband initiative is a clear indication that they are unwilling to compete on equal terms with other vendors, an action that will not have gone unnoticed in the halls of power.

woodbe.

Yes yes, all that. The point I'm making is that no one else is putting in the infrastructure. They could all do the next G thing, but they aren't. Why is it a problem? Because no one else wants to put the infrastructure in, they all want a free ride.

Until someone else provides a bit of infrastructure, then Telstra have a right to act monopolistically! I don't like it, but I'm glad SOMEONE is servicing us.

P

[woodbe]

Because no one else wants to put the infrastructure in, they all want a free ride.

To be fair, it's not a free ride. The other carriers pay a wholesale rate for the access and traffic to Telstra. So Telstra is able to cover it's costs and probably make a profit (they wouldn't admit that) from third party carrier sales of it's network.

I think that having a private company owning the infrastructure and marketing services on it is not such a smart move. there is a lot to be said for separating the infrastructure from the marketing, eg: One company or Government Authority installs infrastructure and sells access to the carriers who then supply the market for mobile services, land lines etc.

Be nice if they sort out the confusion of convoluted phone plans while they are at it. :)

woodbe.

[echnidna]

We're talking mobile service here, where each operator provides its own infrastructure. It's all rather silly really.

P

Its not silly midge, it goes beyond mobile phones.

You lot may be talking about mobile phone service, which is demonstrably lousy and getting worse.

But I'm also talking about broadband internet.
Dialup here is hopeless, the connection can repeatedly fall out after a few minutes. Even twin channel isdn falls out here every hour or so.

I pay $47 monthly for unlimited isdn plus the phone line rental.

When Telstra scraps isdn they want me to go to their nextg internet at over $100 a month with download limits, Plus the cost of the phone.

I'd love to have access via Virgin but that may not be viable at the moment.
I currently have 2 alternatives to telstra.
Wireless through Westvic or 2way Satellite.
(I'd prefer wireless as it should be more portable if I move house)
Wirelkess & Satellite both work out dearer than isdn but are cheaper than nextg. engin can replace telstras crappy phone service.

But the scene is changing relatively often so I'm inclined to hang out till the last minute in case a new player such as Elders/Optus (Opel) becomes viable.

BTW Cdma at the campground worked, nextG is hopeless unless you buy a special phone (which has only just become available.)
Should a serious accident occur here (leading to an otherwise avoidable coroners inquest) I won't have any hesitation criticising telstras lousy service to the coroner.

[bitingmidge]

Its not silly midge, it goes beyond mobile phones.

You lot may be talking about mobile phone service, which is demonstrably lousy and getting worse.

But I'm also talking about broadband internet.

Of course I agree, again the companies proudly announce that they cover 96% of the population. If you aren't in it (and I'm not), well good luck.

I'm not sure that I'm so concerned about the "what if there's an accident" thing though. The 96% of cover is over something less than 20% of our land mass.

That leaves an awful lot of places you don't want to have an accident!

Cheers,

P

[echnidna]

but when they replace a workable system with an unworkable one and call it an improved system.

Telstra seems to be trying to eliminate their opposition at the expense of service

[RufflyRustic]

............

I'm not sure that I'm so concerned about the "what if there's an accident" thing though. The 96% of cover is over something less than 20% of our land mass.

That leaves an awful lot of places you don't want to have an accident!

Cheers,

P



To be honest, that's exactly what I'm concerned about :(


but when they replace a workable system with an unworkable one and call it an improved system.

Telstra seems to be trying to eliminate their opposition at the expense of service

and then there's this, which at this point, is my take on the situation, though I'd have to voice the assumed thing about making money as well :rolleyes:

cheers
Wendy

[fxst]

Bob said..."BTW Cdma at the campground worked, nextG is hopeless unless you buy a special phone (which has only just become available.)
Should a serious accident occur here (leading to an otherwise avoidable coroners inquest) I won't have any hesitation criticising telstras lousy service to the coroner"
True enough but I work on the theory that if things go bad and the method is there use it.
To this end I got myself a sat phone (telstra) and solved the prob re emergencies. Its kept fully charged and not on a plan etc (bought outright)
The law states that emergency calls must be answered. To date I haven't had to use it but then I only carry it when I go camping in out of the way places.
Pete

[Wood Borer]

Question:

So what would you do if you found a Telstra Executive broken down or injured in an area with no mobile coverage?

Answer:

Because Telstra is so hell bent and verging on the ridiculous with it's OH&S policies, I am sure they wouldn't want me to tow their vehicle (gee I have not got any towing qualifications that are recognised by the US). Telstra could sue me if anything went wrong.

I couldn't give them any water or food because I am not registered to handle food. Again Telstra might sue me.

I couldn't administer First Aid because I have no qualifications there either and could be found negligent after going to court attempting to defend myself against their team of corporate lawyers.

I am not qualified to give them any advice because then again if something went wrong I could be held responsible.

I guess I would be obliged for legal and OH&S reasons to leave the Telstra Executive there and report the incident when I got back into mobile range.

Would Telstra refund me for the rip off cost of the call though?

Sounds cruel and callous? I would merely be following their lead and concern about people in the bush.

If it was someone else - they would be on the road again in a flash after being feed and watered and attended to for any injuries and they would most likely be very grateful.

[echnidna]

Lets hope the executive is either Mr Ziggy or Mr Mexican

[Wood Borer]

A mate who has since retired from the organisation sarcastically tried out their OH&S policy whilst working in rural Southern NSW.

The techs are issued with first aid kits which are audited regularly. If anything is used or missing then the tech is in deep poo if there is not a corresponding near miss or accident report.

This bloke scratched his finger on a cable sheath, it was not enough to draw blood but he figured it was best if he could protect it with a bandaid.

He called his supervisor who instructed him to sit down and rest until the supervisor arrived. This took a couple of hours because the supervisor's office was 180Km away.

The supervisor arrived with another person with some First Aid certificate and they applied the bandaid. They decided it was OK for my mate to drive home (about 20Km) however the next day he had to drive the 180Km to the office to write up the report. This was checked and approved and then my mate had to drive back to his area.

Of course with the travelling time, meal breaks etc it was knock off time by the time he returned back so the entire day was lost reporting a scratched finger. Not sure whether the customer was off the air for all that time or not.

This incident and similar incidents were the prime reasons my mate and several others left the organisation - they considered the ridiculous OH&S rules and the extent to which they are administered make employees out to be idiots. A form of mental torture and a total waste of time for everyone concerned.

[echnidna]

Obviously Telstra shoulda called the flying doctor

[DavidG]

Used to work for that crowd, at a remote locality.

Took two guys from the regional office to come out and inspect the lawn mower. (clean, sharp blades, fuel etc)

BUT they did not want to know about the 170kva 6 cyc diesel generator .................:~

[rodm]

Perhaps its the OHS and blame game we now involve ourselves in that is the cause. Supervisors are in the sights now so do you blame them for protecting their families from get rich quick litigation?

[Wood Borer]

OH&S is very important but when companies go overboard no doubt due to wimpy greedy lawyers and scaredy cat sheltered insurance brokers it becomes ridiculous.

The comedy like behaviour of supervisers is not entirely a reflection of the supervisors but it is certainly a reflection on the company.

I have pride and I am sorry for those who do not have any pride. I suggest to anyone who has any self pride and is ordered to follow stupid procedures for them to raise the issue with management. If management does not respond then take action like resigning especially if you hold a key position.

If you are a customer of such an organisation then take your business elsewhere. Do you want to be associated with fools?

I do not like to see adults treated like fools by these large companies where adults responsible for their families and community are threatened with the sack if they don't act like moronic idiots. How demoralising it must be for them.

This stupidity has to stop. The dangerous part of it is that people could possibly classify all OH&S procedures as ridiculous based on some iof the idiotic procedures.

Safety and OH&S is vitally important but not when it is implemented to the point of being ridiculous under the guise of being a litigation risk.

[Ron Dunn]

Yeah ... "safety" ... "privacy" ... they're all a cop out for the lazy and stupid.

Time we rebelled.

My idea: Let's have a day of national disobedience where every service club in Australia holds a barbecue on the steps of its local council office WITHOUT A FOOD SAFETY PLAN!!

The worst (best??) that could happen is that we kill a few councillors with crook sausages ... hahaahahaha

[echnidna]

where can we get some crook sausages?

[RETIRED]

http://www.news.com.au/heraldsun/story/0,21985,23059587-661,00.html

[Gingermick]

Had the same problem here when they put the Ambulance levy onto your electricity bill.
http://www.news.com.au/couriermail/story/0,23739,23058796-3102,00.html

[echnidna]

Telstra rang me today to try and sell me their stinking nextg wireless broadband.

Me: What does it cost

Testra chick :$34 for 500mb

I pay $47 for isdn with unlimited downloads and I use 3 gig

Testra chick : We are closing the isdn network.

Testra chick : 3 Gig will cost you $117 per month sir.

Me (changing direction): Would you deal with someone who practises deceptive & misleading methods

Testra chick : Oh no I certainly wouldn't

Me: Well telstra has been found guilty in a court of law of indulging in decepitive and misleading practices

End of discussion.
(I forgot to tell her that nextg only works here occaisionally)

[Sebastiaan56]

Guys,

There are plenty of people making plenty of money on the back of these OH&S crazes. Its also worse in some states than others and yes, Vic is the worst. But its been that way for at least 10 years.

A story doing the rounds concerns an incident on a farm where he lost his life in a tractor accident. As the structure was a trust and there were two trustees WorkCover decided to go the other for having an unsafe workplace, ipso facto. You can guess what comes next, she gets charged and summoned for the death of her husband by Workcover.

Never heard an ending, but its a good story.

Sebastiaan