Blog discussion

[Big Shed]

On a more serious note, what do people think about the new blog facility?

I just had a look there, and if it is used for general "stream of consciousness" (as BobL put it) than I think it could be quite nice, it also takes some of the general comments away from the forum.

Where I see a danger is that some stuff will finish up in Blogs that should be on the forum, the Blog about a new DP (hey I worked out that stood for Drill Press:2tsup:) table and Wasp sander table, in my humble opinion (IMHO) should be in the main forum where people are more likely to see it. More importantly they are more likely to find it if they do a search (some people do, don't they?).

What do others think?

(and yes I did see the warning at the top of blogs to put anything to with woodwork etc in the main forum, but that didn't stop the DP blog, did it?)

[Sturdee]

On a more serious note, what do people think about the new blog facility?


If I posted my true feelings the post would be deleted so I'll limit myself to saying it is a wast of time and effort and will not be something that I'll avail of.

IMO, whilst there is a limited facility for commenting on what is written in these bloggs, there is no ability to test and even question or refute the comments like in the forums. Hence no proper debate and so these musings are not worth reading.

My humble 2cents worth but I don't want Neil to complain about us being whingers when he brings in something new again, so Neil I appreciate your efforts but it is not for me.


Peter.

[Skew ChiDAMN!!]

On a more serious note, what do people think about the new blog facility?

I'm reserving judgement, until such a time as I can see any general trend in how the blogs are being used. If 'tis just personal maunderings, I'll be ignoring that whole section. :shrug:

However, I don't see why more technical issues can't be covered in blogs. After all, people can cross-link to 'em in the forums if they feel any point merits discussion, can't they? :? IMHO many WIPs would make good blogs... as often as not, all the 3rd-party posts are simply saying "nice job" and not actually contrbuting to the "knowledge quotient." :rolleyes: Surely other's not being able to chip theirr 2 cents worth into a blogged WIP won't suddenly make the WIP "not worth reading?"

For example, I've been thinking about setting up my own blog along the lines of "Woodturning on a shoe-string" aimed at beginner turners on a budget. Covering all those questions that get raised time after time and are generally answered with "do a search." Sort of starting at "Which lathe should I buy" and working through "what are these chisels?" into more technical areas.

With these areas alraedy well-covered, why would I throw a blog into the fray as well? Because it'd lump all these basic questions into one contiguous read, no hijacks off into "this tool/lathe is better than that" etc, etc. that are of more interest to turners who are already set up and know the basic principles involved. (Of what practical interest is a debate over different chisel profiles when the typical newby can't even use a basic spindle gouge properly yet? :wink:)

I may or may not do it - depends on how much time I have on my hands - but my point is it'll be interesting to see just how the blogs do develop.

Give it time, people. Give it time.

[Big Shed]

I'm reserving judgement, until such a time as I can see any general trend in how the blogs are being used.



So am I




However, I don't see why more technical issues can't be covered in blogs. After all, people can cross-link to 'em in the forums if they feel any point merits discussion, can't they? :? IMHO many WIPs would make good blogs... as often as not, all the 3rd-party posts are simply saying "nice job" and not actually contrbuting to the "knowledge quotient." :rolleyes: Surely other's not being able to chip theirr 2 cents worth into a blogged WIP won't suddenly make the WIP "not worth reading?"

For example, I've been thinking about setting up my own blog along the lines of "Woodturning on a shoe-string" aimed at beginner turners on a budget. Covering all those questions that get raised time after time and are generally answered with "do a search." Sort of starting at "Which lathe should I buy" and working through "what are these chisels?" into more technical areas.

With these areas alraedy well-covered, why would I throw a blog into the fray as well? Because it'd lump all these basic questions into one contiguous read, no hijacks off into "this tool/lathe is better than that" etc, etc. that are of more interest to turners who are already set up and know the basic principles involved. (Of what practical interest is a debate over different chisel profiles when the typical newby can't even use a basic spindle gouge properly yet? :wink:)



Maybe I don't understand how blogs work, but it appears to me that there is a facility for "comments", so the blog can still be hijacked with the "mine is better than yours" type of comment, cant' it?
I agree that a continuous thread on what you are proposing, without interruption, would be of real value. However, if the comments break it up by people putting in their two bobs worth, then it is really no different from the forum. Hence my question and my concern about information being lost to the forum.

The other thing that concerns me is how easy it will be to search the blogs?





I may or may not do it - depends on how much time I have on my hands - but my point is it'll be interesting to see just how the blogs do develop.



It will be interesting to see.




Give it time, people. Give it time.



:2tsup:

[DJ’s Timber]

BS in regard to hijacking, you can turn off comments or even moderate your own blog through the blog options.

I think the blog will be good for WIP like my 'Finally got a start on shed site', you could turn comments off till it's finished then turn them back on or provide a link back into the forums for comments.

We will just have to see how it goes.

[bitingmidge]

I reckon they're a solution waiting for a problem.

I can't really think of a purpose except that fewer people will read them, so you can pretend your talking to yourself!

I figured I'd try to post something every day for a month (except I'm going away after three weeks) and see what comes of it.

I thought it would be a good place for work in progress, but I'm not sure. If you check out the larger of the WIP threads for instance :
This one with 250 posts and 25,000 views (http://www.woodworkforums.com/showthread.php?t=10486), it's hard to see how it would have evolved or attracted the interest it did if it was tucked away in a blog. The fact that people are still adding to it, says something for its relevance. I don't think the blog format will give that.

Similarly, I rather like musing in open forums, so that occasionally there's a bit of biffo-fun provoked too! :wink:

Anyway, let's just see!

Cheers,

P

[Skew ChiDAMN!!]

Maybe I don't understand how blogs work, but it appears to me that there is a facility for "comments", so the blog can still be hijacked with the "mine is better than yours" type of comment, cant' it?

Yes. But by my understanding, the comments remain just that: comments.

The body of the blog can be expanded at will, with the comments staying down the bottom and not interrupting the "flow" of the blog.


I agree that a continuous thread on what you are proposing, without interruption, would be of real value. However, if the comments break it up by people putting in their two bobs worth, then it is really no different from the forum. Hence my question and my concern about information being lost to the forum.

Here's one way I can see things happening: someone posts a comment suggesting that such'n'such a topic should be included. Rather than fill comments discussing the point, the forum itself could be used for the discussion. With referral links to the blog. Once it has been discussed, the blogger could choose to incorporate the ideas into the blog. Or not. :shrug:

Thus it's not taking away from the forum as such, it's becoming an adjunct. ie. The forum for rough drafts, open to suggestions, criticisms and hijacks :D, the blog as the final draft.

I expect that the blogs will be used in a variety of ways (including the stream of consciousness muck) but the above is how I would probably use them. For what little that's worth.


The other thing that concerns me is how easy it will be to search the blogs?

That's something I've been wondering, too. Also, how will they be moderated? If someone complains about a blog's content, will the offending text simply be modified? That entry deleted? The whole blog?

And who's to judge whether something should be deleted? After all, we've had posts apparently stating simple facts or opinions that've started people off on the topic of libel.

I suspect our mods are in for some long, hard hours in the near future...

[Groggy]

I think DJ has it in a nutshell. The blogs are an unproven product at this stage. It may help if people posted links to a variety of blogs so we could get some ideas of how they can be used.

Please note that Neil's comment needs to be read a bit more carefully. He was referring to woodwork questions, NOT woodwork content.

We had a number of new members that found the blog area before anything else and posted a question in there which we had to move to the main forums(hence Neil's message).

I don't think Neil intended to stop WIP blogs, to the contrary, I think that was one of the reasons he activated them (I'll ask him to confirm that <- EDIT: confirmed).

Think laterally, the blogs could be underused or the greatest thing since sliced posts.

[Groggy]

Searches in blogs: Look in the BASIC skin at the toolbar under search. It should now expand into three search panels: Search forums, search blogs and search projects.

The skins have not been updated yet. Until they are I am using the BASIC skin to look at the new stuff.

Mods in for long hard hours - :rolleyes:

Moderating
"That's something I've been wondering, too. Also, how will they be moderated? If someone complains about a blog's content, will the offending text simply be modified? That entry deleted? The whole blog?

And who's to judge whether something should be deleted? After all, we've had posts apparently stating simple facts or opinions that've started people off on the topic of libel."

Skew, we'll just suck it and see mate. We don't have all the answers - sheesh, we don't even have all the questions yet! :)

[Skew ChiDAMN!!]

Mods in for long hard hours - :rolleyes:

OK. Make that longer, harder hours. :p


Skew, we'll just suck it and see mate. We don't have all the answers - sheesh, we don't even have all the questions yet! :)

I know. I was just pondering aloud (well... my keyboard is a tad on the noisy side :rolleyes:) over how it'll develop, not asking for answers that I know you haven't got. Yet. :D

[DJ’s Timber]

Searches in blogs: Look in the BASIC skin at the toolbar under search. It should now expand into three search panels: Search forums, search blogs and search projects.

The skins have not been updated yet. Until they are I am using the BASIC skin to look at the new stuff.



Umm Greg, I have changed back to U-beauts skin and the search bit is there for all of them, including the links to Blogs & Projects, think they've been there since yesterday :shrug:

[Groggy]

Umm Greg, I have changed back to U-beauts skin and the search bit is there for all of them, including the links to Blogs & Projects, think they've been there since yesterday :shrug:Really? Well there you go :2tsup: (I've been a little busy moving hundreds of posts between forums and haven't tried to change skins recently)


OK. Make that longer, harder hours. :p

I know. I was just pondering aloud (well... my keyboard is a tad on the noisy side :rolleyes:) over how it'll develop, not asking for answers that I know you haven't got. Yet. :DI reckon they will be a good thing once we figure them out. We just need a bit of vision.

Hope you guys enjoy the BBQ tomorrow, wish I was with you instead of sanding walls, ah well.:shrug:

[Stuart]

I placed this as a first blog entry, but it might as well be cut & pasted here. I would have just linked to it, but there 'tis:

Stream of Consciousness

Posted 13th Sep 2007 at 11:52 AM by Stuart. (http://woodworkforums.ubeaut.com.au/blog.php?u=12315)
Blogs, RSS, API Keys, Akismet, blogging - welcome to the wonderful world of Web 2.0

A blog, short for Web Log is, or can be, anything from an easily updatable website, to a diary, to a stream of consciousness.

What do you do with one? Anything you want (within the rules obviously). It is somewhere that is your personal place to talk about what you want, or record events, or share information, or.... how large is your imagination?

You might think it is competition to the regular forums, but there, once you have started a thread, it is "owned" by the forum members to talk to, disagree with, hijack (sometimes), add to, complement etc. Whereas, here, you control the environment. Each post is yours, each thread has only your content - you may allow comments, but even then, you get to choose which ones are seen, or even if comments are allowed at all.

Perhaps you want to keep a record of projects you have made - sure, share them with the rest of the forum, but also post here, so there is an ongoing chronological record of your work - how cool would that be?

Want to try the discipline of posting a thought every day? Doesn't matter about topic, - the topic is you, and your thoughts. All kept neatly in one place, and not watered down by others posting in the meantime.

How about using it to keep track of your experiments? What worked, what didn't? Did a glue joint you made 5 years ago using a new glue survive? Have you found a new formula for a finish, but what to track how it survives over time before releasing the product to the world and make $millions?

I find the chronological nature of a blog very cool, and the fact that it is MY space on the forums.

If you have any questions about blogs, blogging, etc, just ask. I've been blogging now for about 3 years - in various locations, and various topics.

My latest is Stu's Shed (http://stusshed.wordpress.com/) - feel free to have a look, as it might help clarify what in the world this is all about!

[Big Shed]

Thank you Stuart, food for thought indeed. I must admit I enjoy your blog.:2tsup:

The thought of a continuous thread (blog) of all of Sturdee's jigs, mods and projects puts a whole different slant on this blog idea.

You may have to re-consider your aversion to blogs Peter:).

It will interesting to see what develops.

[Sturdee]

The thought of a continuous thread (blog) of all of Sturdee's jigs, mods and projects puts a whole different slant on this blog idea.

You may have to re-consider your aversion to blogs Peter:).

It will interesting to see what develops.


No I don't think so for an advanced search for jigs etc as the key word and using Sturdee for the user name will already get that result.


Peter.

[Skew ChiDAMN!!]

No I don't think so for an advanced search for jigs etc as the key word and using Sturdee for the user name will already get that result.

Using advanced Search:

'jigs' by 'Sturdee' - 7 pages of results, covering some 94 seperate threads.

Narrowing the search:

'cyclone' by Sturdee - 5 pages of results, some 63 seperate threads
'dust bucket' by 'Sturdee' - 3 pages of results, some 41 threads.

Using Google search:

'Sturdee jigs' - 3,750 returns
'Sturdee cyclone' - 404 returns
'Sturdee dust bucket' - 204 returns

Your jigs are too popular for "quick" searches, Sturdee! :D Overwhelming to a newby to the forum, especially if they've minimal computer skills too. One could simply go to the oldest return and assume that's the one they're after, but as often as not you've posted improvements in other, later threads.

Of course, one could simply go direct to the "Best of he Best" but, again, you need some familiarity with the forums to realise that they can be found there.

[Cliff Rogers]

The 'signal to noise ratio' is a bit ordinary at this stage. :cool:

[ubeaut]

This post is partly directed to Sturdee in answer to his previous posts but also applies at all contributing members.

_____________________________________________


Whether you can see it or not, the blogs are ideally suited to people like you (Sturdee), people who actually have something positive and wonderful to share the woodworking community.

The threads and posts you have on your cyclone, etc are terrific, but as pointed out by Skew above. It 's like looking for a needle in a hay stack especially for someone new . With so many threads and posts to wade through, it makes it almost impossible for a new person to find all the info they are looking for without a heap of work.

On the other hand putting it into a blog would turn it into an invaluable resource that would be easy to find and have all the info needed in the one place.

Don't get me wrong, I'm not saying use the blog instead of the open forums. Far from it. I'm saying use the open forums as you have always done. But if something is good and could become an important resource like the cyclone, take all the good stuff and put it in a closed blog for everyone to see.

To put it another way.
Finding something specific in the forums is like:
Wandering around the search engines, aimlessly following hundreds of links, that take you in all sorts of weird and wonderful directions all over the place, but never quite give you what you really want, because there is always someone throwing up a problem or sidetracking the issue, so you have to go off and search again, wading through hundreds or even thousands of links to finally get what you want, almost.
Finding that same something in a blog is like:

Having a clear concise article with all the facts and relevant information, sitting in a leather bound illustrated book, for you to read and enjoy at your leisure and in the privacy of your own room.

There is definitely a place for both forums and blogs. If used correctly, they should coexist perfectly together and fully compliment each other. When combined with the wikipedia we will have up and running in the next day or so they should in time make this one of the truly great woodworking resources on the internet.

Like everything new we've done in the past 8 years, there's always some for it and some against it. No matter what your opinion you should at least give it a fair go before putting it down, so how about we all give it a few months to see what happens.Who knows it could be the biggest flop of all time and then think of the fun you can have saying "I told ya so".

_____________________________________________


Oh yeah...... While I think of it.
I'd like to put an end, here and now, to a rumor or innuendo I believe has been floated elsewhere.

I have absolutely no intention of selling these forums or any part of them, either now, in the near or distant future.

No amount of money could ever pay for what we have here, nor could it pay for the time and energy expended by myself and over 8 years of sleepless night and lost days, the thousands of hours spent by the dedicated admin team and the expertise and knowledge of Steven.

I along with countless others consider these forums and the members as family and as long as my bum points to the ground I will never sell my family. I will trash these forums completely before anyone else ever gets their hands on them and , will I'm sure help me, ably assisted by the other members of the administration team.However if someone has a cool $25,000,000 they want to invest I could be persuaded, bit of hush money to and the rest of the crew. Yep. I'm dead easy to contact. Just click on the contact us links st the bottom of any page. :rotfl:
Really..... All you have to do is click on contact us. Come on I'm waiting. :rofl:

Cheers - Neil :U

[Sturdee]

Firstly thanks Neil for your kind words about me.

You raised a number of points worth pursuing but I still feel that adequate searching would be better than creating the whole blogg system.

True a search on jigs will return a large number of threads but if the search results are displayed as posts rather than the default of threads they are more helpful in selecting which link to use.

A simpler way to search for an individual's posts is to go to their user profile and click on the threads started. In my case that would give 84 threads and all my jigs etc are in separate threads and listed in the title. Not very difficult IMO but not a well known feature.

So maybe a better search engine is needed (BTW I would still like to see in new posts and todays post the forum on the LHS next to the title thread) and a detailed instruction on how to search.

Also a clearer explanation about Best of the Best and how that works would be helpful and maybe new registrations should be directed to such information before allowing them loose on the board.

Questions about bloggs.

My main objection to them is the difficulty in searching for previous information. Most bloggs I've seen archieve previous ramblings and musings by month and don't allow adequate searching. So unless you read them all the time past information can't be readily found. Same problem as a newbie finds in searching.

Further to work satisfactory all bloggs should have a daily bloggs and new bloggs facility as well as an index similar to when we open a particular forum.

So we then have a virtual duplicate system for bloggs as we have for forums. This then will create a disaster for users and mods when posts or entries are made in the wrong section. Crosslinking although a good idea will seldom be used. I may be wrong there but I doubt it.

Question about transferring posts into bloggs or vice versa.

If I felt the need (and had the time and energy which at this stage I haven't) to transfer a current lot of posts on say the Sturdee mini cyclone to a blogg what tools are provided for that.

Is it a cut and paste with editing out the other posts or is there a better set of tools to come.

How would you tranfer the links to photos already posted so that they would open up in the original posts and also in the new blogg entry.

I appreciate that I may be wrong and that time will tell but I've seen other changes come and after a while turn out to be not worth the effort put in for them, eg Reputation system and the prolification of subforums.

Neil, your comments are as allways appreciated.

Peter.

BTW Skew I'd like to think that every post of mine thrown up in a search is worth reading, even if it takes years.:D:D:D

[namtrak]

When the blogs were first mooted, I went over to vbulletin.org and checked out some of the more advanced blogs and projects for that matter, to see how I could use it. And there seems to be a fair mix of useless rantings and intelligent conversation throughout some of the blogs.

My first thought was to transfer my whole renovation thread (http://woodworkforums.com/showthread.php?t=15552) straight to the blog as I thought that it would be ideally suited there (Someone even referred to it as a blog when I first started). But then I wondered how those people who have been tracking the thread could see it if I moved it? And so whilst I think if I start another thread on something I do I will definitely start it in the blogs, at this stage I won't move my thread over to the blogs.

Also, I was wondering (and I may check this out - time permitting) if there is a hack to include new blog posts and new project posts in the buttion which returns new posts? That is basically the only button I use to access the forums, and it would be neat to kill three birds with the one stone.

[namtrak]

A bit off topic - but for F&&& sake don't employ Captcha as a security tool to filter searches - it is a right royal pain in the ringo!!

[wheelinround]

I'm reserving judgement, until such a time as I can see any general trend in how the blogs are being used. If 'tis just personal maunderings, I'll be ignoring that whole section. :shrug:

However, I don't see why more technical issues can't be covered in blogs. After all, people can cross-link to 'em in the forums if they feel any point merits discussion, can't they? :? IMHO many WIPs would make good blogs... as often as not, all the 3rd-party posts are simply saying "nice job" and not actually contrbuting to the "knowledge quotient." :rolleyes: Surely other's not being able to chip theirr 2 cents worth into a blogged WIP won't suddenly make the WIP "not worth reading?"

For example, I've been thinking about setting up my own blog along the lines of "Woodturning on a shoe-string" aimed at beginner turners on a budget. Covering all those questions that get raised time after time and are generally answered with "do a search." Sort of starting at "Which lathe should I buy" and working through "what are these chisels?" into more technical areas.

With these areas alraedy well-covered, why would I throw a blog into the fray as well? Because it'd lump all these basic questions into one contiguous read, no hijacks off into "this tool/lathe is better than that" etc, etc. that are of more interest to turners who are already set up and know the basic principles involved. (Of what practical interest is a debate over different chisel profiles when the typical newby can't even use a basic spindle gouge properly yet? :wink:)

I may or may not do it - depends on how much time I have on my hands - but my point is it'll be interesting to see just how the blogs do develop.

Give it time, people. Give it time.

Skew like your way of thinking, I have veiwd read and trolled many sites for information and many are either to product related (nothing but pure sales pitches) or as we have seen hi-jacked threads.
I for one have to adjust everything for my own use but basics are where we all start.

[Gra]

if someone has a cool $25,000,000

Well I have this friend in Nigeria:U:U

[Gra]

I've been thinking about setting up my own blog along the lines of "Woodturning on a shoe-string" aimed at beginner turners on a budget. Covering all those questions that get raised time after time and are generally answered with "do a search." Sort of starting at "Which lathe should I buy" and working through "what are these chisels?" into more technical areas.

With these areas alraedy well-covered, why would I throw a blog into the fray as well? Because it'd lump all these basic questions into one contiguous read, no hijacks off into "this tool/lathe is better than that" etc, etc. that are of more interest to turners who are already set up and know the basic principles involved. (Of what practical interest is a debate over different chisel profiles when the typical newby can't even use a basic spindle gouge properly yet? :wink:)

Skew,

Do it this is what the Blogging section and this forum is crying out for. Bring on the encyclopeadia Skewtanica :U

[jmk89]

Skew,

Do it this is what the Blogging section and this forum is crying out for. Bring on the encyclopeadia Skewtanica :U
Skew, Do it! Not for the guys who do turn ,but for the rest of us for whom it is the blackest of black arts.

[Andy Mac]

Just a comment on the format of the Blogs, IMO the postings seem a tad too distinct to be considered stream of conciousness or some continued rave. Its given by the framed window and the different colours more than anything, so its a visual thing. Compared to Stuart's excellent diary linked there, it gives me the feeling of seperate posts much like the usual Forum setup.
Just a minor thing, but feedback nonetheless!

Cheers

[pawnhead]

I don't think my musings would provide anything of interest and I don’t have a WIP, but I spend way too much time surfing the net, and I come across stuff, not woodwork related, but sometimes curious, funny or interesting, and probably not worth posting about here. I have a bit of a space/science bias. A lot of blogs dump a few interesting links with a bit of commentary.

Would that be inappropriate?

[ubeaut]

pawnhead - Pornography is inappropriate, foul language is inappropriate, pedefilia is inappropriate, denegratindg a person or business is inappropriate, are we starting to see a picture forming here. A science/space bias is quite appropriate, so are Trekies, Stargater's, Babylon 5er, FarScapers and all things space and science even fictional stuff.

It is a space for the members to use as their own little room for doing their own thing whatever that may be. We don't really care so long as it at least attempts to stay within the bounds of reasonably good taste.

________________________________________


This a woodwork forum first and foremost. But some people have become a bit too precious about that fact and don't think anything else should be spoken of in here. But not everyone's life here revolves soley around woodwork and if it did, that would be a bit sad. We all have other interests and/or involvements so why not share them here. You might even find a whole heap of others with a like interest, matter of fact I can just about guarantee you will


________________________________________


namtrak - The blogs are the ideal place for your renovation thread but not at the cost of losing the thread from the open forums. That is great in there and that's where it should stay.

The ideal thing to do would be to copy all the good stuff across to a dedicated blog, where it would be seen in a different light (and the bloody pictures might work properly) This is what we envisage for the blogs. For Threads like yours the Open Forums are like the rough draft that people flit through making comment along the way. Whereas the Blog is more like the full hard bound book that you sit and pour over at your leisure.

________________________________________


Maybe I'm just looking at it through rose coloured glasses but that's how I would like to see it and when the Wiki comes on line soon (I keep saying that but we keep running into problems) the forums the blogs and the wiki will merge over a period of time into what could be an absolutely fantastic repository of information on woodwork and a whole gamut of allied and peripheral information that in time could be a series of snapshots of what we are and all with our own unique Austrailian bent.

Those who don't like really don't have to look or be a part if it they don't want to. Same as they don't have to look at the threads or forums that don't interest them. No one is twisting anyones arm.

________________________________________


OK dinners ready I'm outa here.

[pawnhead]

pawnhead - Pornography is inappropriate, foul language is inappropriate, pedefilia is inappropriate, denegratindg a person or business is inappropriate, are we starting to see a picture forming here.Of course. Ignore the implication of my 'handle'. It's just one I chose for some reason when I joined an online chess club years ago, and I haven't bothered changing it, although I suppose I should have. Meh.

I'll put together a few subjects I've found interesting and if I get no comment it doesn't really matter.

Thanks Neil. :2tsup:

[Frank&Earnest]

It is a space for the members to use as their own little room for doing their own thing


Wow! I wanted to say that, but I was worried I would be banned!:D




The blogs are the ideal place for your renovation thread but not at the cost of losing the thread from the open forums. That is great in there and that's where it should stay.

The ideal thing to do would be to copy all the good stuff across to a dedicated blog, where it would be seen in a different light (and the bloody pictures might work properly) This is what we envisage for the blogs. For Threads like yours the Open Forums are like the rough draft that people flit through making comment along the way. Whereas the Blog is more like the full hard bound book that you sit and pour over at your leisure.


IMHO this hits the nail on the head and blows away all the negative comments. This end certainly justifies the means.

Whether blogs are the most effective means, though, may still be a concern (for you, not the members). Given that what you propose still requires decisional imput, it would have been much simpler to set up an "editing committee" of some description to select the threads worty of becoming "books" to be put in the "reference library" and maybe give the author the honour (and the job) to copy and paste.

The bottom line would appear to be whether the additional cost to you of providing to the members the new service is justified by other benefits. As you said, time will tell. We, as members, can only be grateful to you for your generosity. Those who are into intellectual wa**ing will particularly appreciate it.:wink:

As regards your asking price for the forums, I have a potential buyer. I have been asked to do a due diligence audit for the proposed acquisition. Please let me know how to contact your accountant. :D

[ubeaut]

Given that what you propose still requires decisional imput, it would have been much simpler to set up an "editing committee" of some description to select the threads worty of becoming "books" to be put in the "reference library" and maybe give the author the honour (and the job) to copy and paste.

No committee will ever get a look in on these forums. Committees are responsible for stuffing up too much of the world and life as we knew it as it is.

These are personal blogs input is purely the personal choice and decision of the blogger and bugger all concern of anyone else. It is possible that the blogger may listen to a hint or advice from someone else re their blog but it certainly isn't mandatory and if they don't want to hear it they can turn off the Post a Comment bit of the blog.


The bottom line would appear to be whether the additional cost to you of providing to the members the new service is justified by other benefits.The bottom line is actually giving something back to the woodworking and broader community that might some day be a place that all will want to visit and use. Lookout Disneyland Woodies World is coming to Florida or Sunshine Coast or a least to your nearest computer monitor.


Please let me know how to contact your accountant.Sorry he's gone to his Hacienda in Cuba.

Still trying to figure out what "Those who are into intellectual walking will particularly appreciate it." has to do with anything.

[bitingmidge]

I'm still finding things in the Blog controls, but I can't find a way of publishing an RSS feed, or feeding the thing to Atom or whatever blog syndicator there is or whatever the techno babble is for setting up an RSS fed blog.

There's a menu to get to the RSS page, but what gives? Can Steve or Neil help there?

<Edit> I think the easy way to subscribe is to go to the particular blog, then go to the RSS link, then bookmark that page in your RSS reader (in my case Safari)

The RSS feed for my blog therefore is:
feed://www.woodworkforums.com/blog_external.php?bloguserid=2450


Cheers,

P:-

[bitingmidge]

If I wasn't a complete dill, I may not have hit the Blog menu "getting started" before realising it was the title of one of my own posts! :-

Is there a way of reporting/recording number of views of a given post?

Cheers,

P
:cool:

[ubeaut]

Still trying to find our way around it ourselves midge. the RSS feeds are turned of to the forums so probably the same for blogs. will look into it. We'll probably have teething problems for a few weeks until we've all got it fully sussed out or at least some of us have.

[ubeaut]

Nup guess the RSS feeds are on for blogs. Don't know a bout counters though.

[jmk89]

I wonder if the front page of the forums could have a box (maybe near the birthdays and who's logged in space) to show which blogs have been updated recently - it might be a useful way to encourage people to look over in blogland...

[Frank&Earnest]

Still trying to figure out what "Those who are into intellectual wa*king will particularly appreciate it." has to do with anything.

Sorry Neil, completely forgot about this thread.

I was only trying to say in a humorous way, prompted by your statement
Quote:
Originally Posted by ubeaut http://mt0.woodworkforums.com/images/button2/viewpost.gif (http://www.woodworkforums.ubeaut.com.au/showthread.php?p=588497#post588497)
It is a space for the members to use as their own little room for doing their own thing

that IMHO using a blog is a rather onanistic activity. Forums are for those who like debate and feedback, personal diaries are for introspection, blogs are for those who like....? Showing off? If they allow debate, don't they just duplicate forums? My point was that, whatever their merits, they are an additional service you are providing. Not everybody likes Disneyland.

BTW, I totally share your dislike for committees, I only used that word, between inverted commas, thinking that you might not have the time to do it all yourself and might want to rope in a couple of friends.

Pity about your accountant. He obviously could not stand the rat race in capitalist Australia and retired in a communist paradise. At least he did not disappear with your money in the nearby Cayman Islands!:)

[bitingmidge]

that IMHO using a blog is a rather onanistic activity.

You obviously admire my "handy"work!

:D:D:D
P

[Phil Spencer]

What,s a BLOG ? How does one BLOG do you have to go tha a little room to do it?

[bitingmidge]

What,s a BLOG ? How does one BLOG do you have to go tha a little room to do it?

Originally a web diary or WEBLOG, but now used for many different purposes.

Some are still very much personal journals or accounts of life, some are newscasts or updates. The facility has been provided on these forums (see "blogs" in the menu bar.

Here are examples of a wide variety of Blogs in real life:

http://www.boingboing.net/
http://www.crikey.com.au/
http://blogs.abc.net.au/articulate/
http://truewifeconfessions.blogspot.com/

But there are as many forms as there are people, some informative, some (like my kids) use them to communicate with friends and family while they are overseas.

Here? Don't know yet. That's what we're trying to nut out.

Cheers,

P
:D

[silentC]

The handful of times that I've had something that might possibly be considered worthy of a blog entry, I've preferred to post it as a new thread in the hope that it will generate some conversation or debate. Being the argumentative person that I am, I find I get most enjoyment out of a topic when I can sit back and watch various arguments resolve themselves, and then pick one to support. Sometimes I don't even have an opinion formed, it's just interesting to choose a line and see where it goes. I can't see that fitting in with a blog, because it would require me to take a stance up front. I think if I did start a blog, it would end up a bit like a personal version of "what cheeses me off". Far too much negative energy down that path. So for now I will sit back and read others' ramblings and console myself that there are people out there who are bigger nutters than me. :)

[BobL]

OK - now we've had the blogs for a few months how are we going? I still can't see too many members using them - maybe we "are just a bunch of old farts". I've made a perhaps pathetic attempt at using a blot by making 2 entries but then I deleted 1. I've read a couple of dozen members bloks , some of the WIPs are OK but as for the rest . . . . . ????

[Ivan in Oz]

G'day Ppl,

Just entered a couple of my Blogs,
The First one is from my Darker times,
actually a few are.

IS this what you see as Blogs?
Or have I just EMBARRASED Myself:doh::B

Nah!
They are all still true for me:rolleyes:

[munruben]

OK - now we've had the blogs for a few months how are we going? I still can't see too many members using them - maybe we "are just a bunch of old farts". I've made a perhaps pathetic attempt at using a blot by making 2 entries but then I deleted 1. I've read a couple of dozen members bloks , some of the WIPs are OK but as for the rest . . . . . ????I have to agree with you. I have done the same, a couple of blogs but I still feel the blogs take a lot away from the open forums where these WIPs and topics were up for open discussion. Now we have to go looking for some of these WIPs and topics and to be honest with you, I don't bother. Maybei its just laziness on my part but I preferred it when everyone saw the thread in the forum and could respond to the thread and offer opinions and comments on the article for us all to see.
Now we have to go hunting if we want to see some of these valuable threads.
I know I am probably missing something by not using the blogs but it seems to me just another tiresome effort when they would have been in the forum anyway had the blogs not come into being. I think the blogs will serve a purpose to a certain section of the members and they will use them but unfortunately many more members will miss out on their threads or posts that would have appeared in the open forums.

Personally I don't know if the blogs are a success or not but for me, they have taken something away from the forums. I use to love the bantering that went on in the open threads when posted in the forums but since the blogs a lot of this has vanished. I have also observed that many who use to post on these forums, no longer do so on a regular basis. I know there can be many reasons for this and may not be due to the blogs but it seems coincidental to say the least.

Nevertherless, having said all that, I am still a strong supporter of the WWF and love my daily visit to look around and share in the goings on here. Its a great place and I know that Neil and everyone else involved with it, do what they do to try and make it even better than what it is. I hope they don't take offence by my comments, they are purely my opinion and one thing I really appreciate in here is the freedom of voicing an opinion, whether it be right or wrong.

It would be interesting to hear what others have to say now the blogs has been running for a while.

[wheelinround]

Blogs have been good some have detracted from the main forum then again many forumites have their own blog site away from WWF many are great reading and viewing :2tsup:.

I venture and browse WWF blogs regularly enjoyed Dingo's tales and many others wip's.

[munruben]

I venture and browse WWF blogs regularly enjoyed Dingo's tales and many others wip's.But thats my point Ray, I enjoyed Dingo's rantings and ravings and WIPs too but now Dingo doesn't post much in the main forums any longer. If I want to read Dingo's stuff now, I need to go to the blogs.

[wheelinround]

But thats my point Ray, I enjoyed Dingo's rantings and ravings and WIPs too but now Dingo doesn't post much in the main forums any longer. If I want to read Dingo's stuff now, I need to go to the blogs.

I guess now he is moving and had broadband connected (wait till he finds out he has to pay extra for moving his broadband connection it will be a blog to read) he wont get near the computer with all those female in the house.

[bitingmidge]

I gave it a shot initially, and think their best use is as a neat archive place.

I will summarise projects that I've posted on them when I get some time, but that won't be for a while.

I'm talking about a double-up really, things that have already been posted in the forums, like the stool story, but this will give them somewhere else to sit, and will probably make them easier to read without the chit-chat, which in the forums is a very vital part of the whole deal!, but it can hamper searching later.

For me, the musing stuff is taken care of elsewhere, where I can keep track of comments and visitors myself (and I don't mean that in anyway to be disrespectful of this place). Like so many others I too update my personal pages sporadically and I thought about moving that stuff to here, but there's no real point, and some disadvantages. If anyone is interested in my stuff at bitingmidge.com (http://bitingmidge.blogspot.com) they can subscribe to the RSS feed for updates, rather than having to log on each day/week and sift through all the others on the site.

Given the "more serious" nature of the entire site in latter times, I think I'd rather see the blogs as WIP or record threads, and keep the stories on a story thread where I'm more likely to see them on a regular basis.

Cheers,

P (in a moment of introspection)
:wink:

[wheelinround]

Cool Blog there bitingmidge some excellent photos anyone would think boats area past time

[BobL]

Nevertherless, having said all that, I am still a strong supporter of the WWF and love my daily visit to look around and share in the goings on here. Its a great place and I know that Neil and everyone else involved with it, do what they do to try and make it even better than what it is. I hope they don't take offence by my comments, they are purely my opinion and one thing I really appreciate in here is the freedom of voicing an opinion, whether it be right or wrong.

Well said!

Maybe it's just me but most of people I know personally who maintain detailed blogs are already so full of it that the blogs appear to be yet another way of spreading it further. Worse still, when I (unfortunately) meet them physically they can't understand why I can't quote chapter and verse about the contents of the blog - surely I read their stuff, and when you say no they proceed to tell me about it !!!! (apparently the previous couple of sentences are the sorts of thing you are supposed to blog!)

It's probably like when I first discovered bulletin boards and command line email in 1990 and everyone else thought it was just a nerd thing and would never catch on! I remember a boss asking me why I bothered and hadn't I heard of the telephone and fax?

[bitingmidge]

Thanks Wheelin'! :wink:


Maybe it's just me but most of people I know personally who maintain detailed blogs are already so full of it that the blogs appear to be yet another way of spreading it further.

Absolutely! The great thing about them is that you're not forced to read them.

In our case, we use them as a way of communicating among our family and friends in various parts of the world. If others get a kick out of them, well good for them, but don't draw any conclusions about what they really mean!

As a good if nearly ancient friend of mine remarked recently:

Life is like a garden, you can choose to let it become overgrown with weeds, or you can fill it with beautiful flowers. If you want to have the biggest roses with the best scent, you have to really look after your garden, and the to do that, you have to spread a LOT of bullpoop.

So, don't bag the gardeners. If you don't like the smell of bull doodoo, go inside and watch tele!


Cheers,

P
:D:D:D

[BobL]

. . . .
So, don't bag the gardeners. If you don't like the smell of bull doodoo, go inside and watch tele!



Also well said! but, BM - I also can't imagine you would be the sort of person who would drag me out into the garden to take a whiff :D

[bitingmidge]

Nope, I just bring the stuff with me!

P
:D:D

[Sturdee]

Personally I don't know if the blogs are a success


I looked at them in the beginning but not anymore as they don't interest me sufficiently.



I have also observed that many who used to post on these forums, no longer do so on a regular basis.

I come here primarily for the woodworking and as the board now has so many non woodworking subjects there is not that much to interests me, so I post less.

Also very often the answer to questions posed could be found by a simple search. We don't need to reinvent the wheel everytime and repost the same answer.

Also if I see too many sick jokes :(( in the new post search result I switch of and go elsewhere.


Peter.

[Wild Dingo]

But thats my point Ray, I enjoyed Dingo's rantings and ravings and WIPs too but now Dingo doesn't post much in the main forums any longer. If I want to read Dingo's stuff now, I need to go to the blogs.

Sorry John not quite right ol son... Ive not been posting anywhere period for the past week or so in fact Ive spent very little time on the net at all... even with adsl the nets been boring the hell out of me for some time now :roll: so getting the enthusiasm up to post anywhere has just been a bit of a drag and with so many other things happening Ive just slowly trickled it down to an occasional post here an there as something grabs my attention or if I have time enough to respond.

I enjoy the whole ubeaut forum experience... although I still havent quite worked out what the blog area is actually for... I mean to post a WIP?? Not bloody likely! :doh: A WIP goes in the area of the forum MOST appropriate so people can find it and comment!! Where others can offer help assistance commentary other options etc as it progresses THATS where a WIP is meant to be! ...I sorta take the view that the blog is an area that we can use to blow off the excess energy or increadible life yarns we all have to share ASIDE from the forums... and we ALL have them!... Imagine if young chrome domed Christopha decided to regale us with his "yarns from Bidgey" :o ... thus by being in another area of the forum they dont blog up the forums themselves :q ... no need for the mods to use the dunny paper to clean up so often eh!! :2tsup:

But no I havent posted much at all of late... mmm must do somethin about that eh? :;
Cheers
me!!! :q

[munruben]

But no I havent posted much at all of late... mmm must do somethin about that eh? :;
Cheers
me!!! :q Look forward to that my friend. Welcome back.:)

[ubeaut]

I don't believe some of the comments here. This one for instance:

"I come here primarily for the woodworking and as the board now has so many non woodworking subjects there is not that much to interests me, so I post less."

The same forums are here that were here in the beginning, only now there are a heap more woodwork related forums. Sure there are a lot of others, but that doesn't detract from the fact that the woodwork forums are all still here, not only that but they are now getting more posts than ever before.

Apart from the top few forums you have to scroll down past 48 woodworking forums before you come to the first non woodwork forum - Metal Work.

"I preferred it when everyone saw the thread in the forum and could respond to the thread and offer opinions and comments on the article for us all to see."

The blogs are there for all to see, they can be answered and commented on and opinions can be offered, if the blogger allows it. There are a lot of posters who have never come back after their first few posts because they were chased away by over bearing self opinionated bullies. At least now a person can post a blog (if the wish) without the fear of being browbeaten, bullied or made to look a fool.

I use to love the bantering that went on in the open threads when posted in the forums but since the blogs a lot of this has vanished.

Loss of banter has more to do with the BS (Blokey shed) than the Blogs, it mostly went over there, to the good of the forums. We lost literally thousands of worthless posts a month and for that, most of us are eternally grateful.

I have also observed that many who use to post on these forums, no longer do so on a regular basis.

BS again. Not the Blogs. I say again.... We lost literally thousands of worthless, pointless, mindless, posts a month and for that, most of us are eternally grateful.

"I know there can be many reasons for this and may not be due to the blogs but it seems coincidental to say the least."

The coincidence is that the BS and Blogs both started at around the same time and so did the lack of constant drivel, hijacking of threads, mindless and worthless posts, etc. It's not that there are less posts in the forums, we are getting more than we have ever had before . It's more the fact that they're much better quality posts, with more genuine answers, without all the rot, making it much easier to follow threads without having to wade through a sea of mindless drivel to find an answer.

"I hope they don't take offence by my comments, they are purely my opinion and one thing I really appreciate in here is the freedom of voicing an opinion, whether it be right or wrong."

No offence taken munruben, quite the contrary. I personally welcome and appreciate everyones opinion. I may not agree with everyone just as not everyone will agree with me but at least it gives a chance to comment, inform or explain, our feelings and opinions to others. Without it I get no idea what others think.

I always appreciate feedback, whether good bad or indifferent, without it the forums wouldn't continue to go from strength to strength as they have so far.........

Hang on! Yes they would. We haven't had too many bad calls made in the 8 1/2 years they've been running.

We're now averaging around 16.5 million hits a month. Up by 5 million a month on last year and a whopping 9.5 million on 2005. Posts are up by around 27% on what they were 4 months ago when the blogs started and the drivel stopped.

Personally I'm not sure if the Blogs are good for the forum or not. From what I've seen they are, but whatever, they certainly haven't hurt the forums and will definitely be staying.

What we need to do now is divert some of members energies into a heap if WoodiesWiki (http://www.woodworkforums.com/wiki/index.php/Main_Page)entries and we could end up with the worlds best resource and knowledge base for Woodwork and other allied crafts, etc

Cheers - Neil :U

[Wild Dingo]

What we need to do now is divert some of members energies into a heap if WoodiesWiki entries and we could end up with the worlds best resource and knowledge base for Woodwork and other allied crafts, etc

mmmm a Woodies wiki eh? methinks one couldst contribute mightily to such a thing eh wot!! :2tsup:... if its anything like some of the bs Ive read on the actual wiki site then ooooh brother Niel can I give you some friggin entries to make yer hair stand up on end!! :o all wood related of course! :;

So ol chap how does one find such a thing as a woodies wiki? is it in some mysterious corner of the forum that I havent found yet or am I just wondering blindly about... as usual :doh:

ahem... dont worry... I found it... arruummm eerr I think I shalt leave thus area to the more intellegencia amongst us such as Derek and Christopha for tis for the serious side of nature an thus not for one such as I... aah nay laddiebuck dinna take me tha wrong way noow tis a foine thing ye do tis true indeed an rarely canna man find such a thing as tha Woodies Wiki thing... an thus tis a fine thing to have access to... but not for the likes of me I be the type of peanut tha asks questions rather than searches deep into the bowels of a word... a hammer be a friggin hammer after all eh wot? many a different type a hammer fer sure me boyo but still an all a hammer is a lump of metal on the end of a stick that yer whack the billio outta somefin wif!!

Cheerio an tallyho ol chaps!!

[ss_11000]

So ol chap how does one find such a thing as a woodies wiki? is it in some mysterious corner of the forum that I havent found yet or am I just wondering blindly about... as usual :doh:

its up the top - next to your user cp:wink:

[munruben]

its up the top - next to your user cp:wink:Thanks for that Stirlo, Ii didn't even know they existed.. Will definitely be looking through there.:2tsup:

[Wild Dingo]

nah John dont do it son... cruel acedemic stuff in there :doh: :U

[munruben]

nah John dont do it son... cruel acedemic stuff in there :doh: :UYeah, but you know what they say Shane, if you can't beat 'em, join 'em. :D

[BobL]

I inserted and entry into the wikifor chainsaw mil (http://www.woodworkforums.com/wiki/index.php/Chainsaw_Mill)l just to see how easy it was. We have wikis at work but I hate it when other no-nothings change my perfecly goot espression rond and mess up wot I'm tryin to sayee!

[pawnhead]

Nice entry Bob. :2tsup:

[ubeaut]

Nice one Bob :2tsup: all we need now is a few hundred more entries..... a month.

Cheers - Neil:)