Range hood, plumber only ??

[nic]

Hi

The plumber told me I couldn't install a new rangehood/flue myself, well actually he told the missus. Anyway, does anyone know what the relevant AS standard is and where it specifies you need a license to install it ?
I can't find any reference.

Thanks

Nic

[chrisv]

Nic


You can install the rangehood yourself, but any electrical work needs to be done by a licensed electrician............i know i know......u have heard it all before. But they are a piece of cake to install.

Good luck

Chris

[nic]

Thanks, sparky has already installed a plug, at the the sparky had offered to install the rangehood. So maybe the sparky wasn't aware of this standard either

nic

[Tas_Dean]

If you only want to vent it to the ceiling, you can do it yourself. I'd assume with Victoria's stiff roof plumbing laws, if you want to vent it through the roof you'd probably need a roof plumber to do it.

Dektite's are a good invention.

[Bleedin Thumb]

Mate AFAIK there is no standard, your plumber is probably just full of himself...well full of something anyway.

As ChrisV says pretty easy.... especially if you are venting internally.

They can however be a pain if your venting externally - depending on their placement. I went through the wall with mine - not up into the roof and out the eave as we have a flat roof with no ceiling space. I was also forced to exit too close to the start of the duct which created an almost 90 deg bend - a royal PITA but I got there eventually. I recommend a couple of huge worm clamps (or extra long tie cable ties) to fix the duct on each end and go good metallic foil rather than plastic/paper duct.

[Big Shed]

AFAIK, in Victoria rangehoods now have to be vented through the roof, but cannot point you to the relevant regulation.

To be fully compliant with the regulations (and we always are..., aren't we?) then a licensed roof plumber has to to the roof part, if it is a metal roof, not sure about a tiled roof.

We poor handymen do not have the gumption to cut a hole in our metal roof, do we? And as for installing a neoprene flashing, much to high tech and involved for us mere mortals.:doh:


The nanny state strikes again:o

Edit: Just found this link, migh be helpfulhttp://www.delonghi.com.au/support/faq/faq_rangehoods.asp

[dennford]

AFAIK, in Victoria rangehoods now have to be vented through the roof, but cannot point you to the relevant regulation.

To be fully compliant with the regulations (and we always are..., aren't we?) then a licensed roof plumber has to to the roof part, if it is a metal roof, not sure about a tiled roof.

We poor handymen do not have the gumption to cut a hole in our metal roof, do we? And as for installing a neoprene flashing, much to high tech and involved for us mere mortals.:doh:


The nanny state strikes again:o

I wonder if I should remove the one I fitted and call a plumber to do the job?


Denn

I used a dektite flange - the thing Tas mentioned, it makes the job easy.

Denn

[bricks]

If it's a gas cooktop then your plumber is correct.

The reason being that the rangehood could affect the operation of the cooktop. I know this sounds pretty lame but it's true. As for who installs it, the plumber can or the sparky can, or an aircon bloke can. Possibly maybey ( i'm not sure) a liscenced builder can.

If i were you and your absolutely dead set on doing it yourself then do this,

Mind you, I'm of the opinion that your not allowed to.

Tell the plumber that the sparky will do it.
Tell the sparky that the plumber will do it.

Find out everything you need to know about prohibited flue terminal locations and roof flashings,

Do it yourself.

However if the rangehood is installed incorrectly it can affect the operation of the cooktop. And if you put the outlet in the wrong spot then it could make you sick. And if the flue material is too close to combustibles your house might catch fire.And if you install to many bends in the flue (or as bleedin did an almost 90 degree bend) the rangehood might not work properly and you will be dissapointed with the result.

Not saying that bleedin did it wrong just you need to read the instructions that come in the box with it because each brand and type is different and have different requirements.

What ever you do- read the instructions that came with it, they should tell you things like; maximum vertical lift, number of offsets, type of offsets allowed, minimum length, terminal size, flue size, etc etc etc.

After you pick your route ( careful of combustibles and cables) pick your terminal point. You need to be 10m away from any air intakes- eg air-cond, 1500mm away from any opening windows, and above any second story windows etc etc etc.


Or you could just bogde it

[nic]

If it's a gas cooktop then your plumber is correct.

It is gas...

The reason why I'm so hell bent on doing it myself is that the rangehood is custom, it's the pride and joy of the kitchen. I like greasy/asian cooking and hate the smells, it's virtually silent and 1300cfm with a 10 inch flue.

Anyway, I told the plumber this and he thought I was a nut case :youcrazy: (maybe I am). I could just feel him adding up the $$ for this complex job.
He is coming back to install the cooktop, I'll get a quote from him at that stage if it's outrageous I'll do waht Bricks says :U:U

Cheers

Nic

[bricks]

If your range hood is custom, make sure you have the correct install info from the guys who made it. A Custom range hood definately might affect the operation of the cook top as it hasn't been made as a pair ( normally you can buy a rangehood to suit your cooktop).

If it is a ceiling hanging unit- make sure the ceiling/roof can take the weight.

But yeah definately get quotes from plumber- and sparky, might be surprised.

They might even let you physically install it and they just inspect and sign off on the job - for a box of beer or something.

[Pulse]

do it yourself, tell them all to get stuffed, just do it after they leave. They will love doing a custom job because of how much it will cost you. It has to be 650mm above the cooktop, that's the only regulation I know of. If you vent it through the roof then a roof plumber may need to do it but I wouldn't get him in if it was just for that. Dektites are pretty straight forward. Only problem is for a 10inch hole you might be better of with custom flashings.

Cheers
Pulse

[Metung]

I recently brought a couple of range hoods and cook tops and did a fair amount of shopping around before the purchase. In all my discussions with sales staff it was never ever mentioned that cooktops and rangehoods came as pairs. You learn something new every day.

[nev25]

Yeah there is a constant argument between plumbers and us sparkies as to who installs rangehoods
IMO an electricians job is to mount a power point to plug the unit in and thats it
A plumber has to connect a flue so it has to be mounted to do that
I usually give the owner a hand to mount it just to get the job finished then tell them to call a plumber (in some cases there is some structural work needed to mount a rangehood so I believe its a builders job).
BTW there are regulations on how far above the cook top the thing has be mounted

As far as a venting goes

I'm told under the new building code nothing is allowed to be vented into an enclosed area (this included exhaust fans etc) there are exemptions like if there is ventilation between tiles so its not a fully enclosed space etc (more Grey areas in the code)
And really would you want to vent the cooking emissions into the roof space
Imagine the mess in a few years grease and fat everywhere YUK

As far as doing it yourself DON'T
If you put the flue in yourself though the roof and something goes wrong (IE the roof leaks your insurance company is going to say STIFF you should have used a tradesman see you later.
No compliance certificate no pay.

[Metung]

Is it compulsory to have a range hood? If not, then I think a lot of this discussion is "hot air" like that which would end up in a room without one anyway. What the hell does it matter if you put the cooking air through a filter first before it is vented back into the room if that is what you choose to do. I suspect Nev25 has never cleaned a range hood, or at least one that works properly. I am proud/ashamed to admit that I have and, given the amount of fat I clean from the filter and fan, I doubt that there is any possibilty of same being deposited another metre or more higher in the roof space. I've checked mine after nearly ten years and there is no evidence of grease whatsoever. I find some of these regulations very depressing.:((

[nev25]

Hey I don't write the regulations I just abide by them!!!!!!!

[nic]

w years grease and fat everywhere YUK

As far as doing it yourself DON'T
If you put the flue in yourself though the roof and something goes wrong (IE the roof leaks your insurance company is going to say STIFF you should have used a tradesman see you later.
No compliance certificate no pay.

Well that goes without saying that if I do something and it screws up, I'll be the one fixing it.
That goes with all my DIY screws ups ... projects I should say

Nic

[Bleedin Thumb]

A Custom range hood definately might affect the operation of the cook top as it hasn't been made as a pair ( normally you can buy a rangehood to suit your cooktop).




Bricks a range hood doesn't effect the cooktop. A poorly installed hood can be dangerous IE you vent into the roof space or wall space - oil fumes can ignite.

The only thing you have to look out for is that if you are using a gas hob you should have a hood that is capable of sucking out a minimum of around 900cfm - (sorry that is just from memory). You will find 75% of hoods dont do that. Also the minimun distance between hob and hood is 600 but usually recomended at 650 for electric and 700mm for gas.


The reason you need so much suction is not so much to do with catching fatty spray, its more so that it can effectivly remove the poisonous fumes that are created when the gas burns.

Nic you sound like you've got a good one there. Those noiseless one's came onto the market just as I'd finish installing mine:doh:. Even though mine is noisy I have it on full even when I am only using the smallest burner, you get used to the noise and I can live without the toxins.

[Metung]

Had me worried there for a minute Bleedin Thumb so I did a quick "Google" on burning natural gas and all you get is how clean and efficient it is. What are the poisonous fumes you refer to?

[silentC]

Carbon Monoxide

[Metung]

Don't want to make a meal of this but according to my research, natural gas consists mainly of methane which burns to produse heat with the by-products of carbon dioxide and water. My concern was because I'm the cook and I only put the exhaust on when I'm cooking smokey, fatty things.

[silentC]

I'm not a chemist, all I know about it is that when a fuel burns, and that includes natural gas, some CO is released. At low levels, I don't think it's a problem, but people die every year from gas burning furnaces that are not burning the fuel properly.

Here's one quote from this link (http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/16420108/):


Carbon monoxide is created any time any type of fuel — oil, natural gas, propane, kerosene, wood or charcoal — is burned. All of these non-electric appliances produce CO: furnaces, hot water heaters, stoves, space heaters, fireplaces, and wood stoves.

[Bleedin Thumb]

No Metung I would get into the habit of blasting the extractor every time you cook.

As I said most hoods are woefully underpowered for gas and the ratings they give you are for the thing running full bore...so thats how I cook, the noise kinda drowns out the kids.:wink:

[nic]

CO is only created when the combustion is incomplete, if there is enough Oxygen around and the mix right the combustion become complete and only CO2 and H2O is created.
So if you stove is creating CO you had better get it checked out.

Nic

[bricks]

Bricks a range hood doesn't effect the cooktop. A poorly installed hood can be dangerous IE you vent into the roof space or wall space - oil fumes can ignite.

.


The speed of the oxygen as is mixes with the gas at the cooktop can be directly affected by the range hood.

If this happens then the burner will need to be adjusted to accomodate the extra air or the range hood adjusted/changed to reduce it's pull.

And if complete combustion occurs ( correct ratio of gas and air) you will get Carbon dioxide, and water vapour as a flued material. Carbon Monoxide is a symptom of incomplete combustion.

[batcat]

And what really annoys me is people who install rangehoods against walls then tile the mongrels in so when they fail and need to be removed it takes 10 times longer to do the job....

[silentC]

CO is only created when the combustion is incomplete, if there is enough Oxygen around and the mix right the combustion become complete and only CO2 and H2O is created.

Since you've gone from not really knowing to suddenly being an expert, perhaps you could share your google links with us so we can all become educated :)

[bricks]

Just did a google search

Watch this animation.....
http://www.ausetute.com.au/combusta.html

[nic]

Since you've gone from not really knowing to suddenly being an expert, perhaps you could share your google links with us so we can all become educated :)

I still don't know what the relevant regs are regarding installing a range hood.
but from what bricks said the plumbers warning seems to be genuine.
I do know some chemistry, didn't know the 2 were linked :?:? :?

Sorry don't have any google links this is all from memory from high school chemistry class. I didn't listen a lot back then but what I did listen to I remember pretty well.

cheers

Nic