A&R - Arrogance & Rapacity??

[arose62]

Have you seen this story in the SMH??

http://blogs.smh.com.au/entertainment/archives/undercover/014948.html

Sheesh!!!

Cheers,
Andrew

[Coldamus]

Muddy baskets! I hope they sink without trace.

The reply was beautifully worded and well deserved.

[Rossluck]

That's fascinating Andrew. Thanks for bringing it to our attention. Economic rationalism is still threatening the devolpment of Australian literature. :((

[corbs]

Well after reading that I know that I will not be purchasing from A&R again :((.

Corbs

[Sebastiaan56]

This has been going on in the supermarkets for years. Line fees were established as a revenue source and an incentive for manufacturers to keep their marketing programs at the cutting edge. The big two supermarket chains (and their sub brands) will delist your product for being out of stock, not meeting sales forecasts, quality problems or a change of strategic supply. This has made line fees a major element of new product marketing planning.

The consumer goods industry has been battling with this for years. This is why your brand choice keeps on declining. It affects everything you buy in major supermarkets, liquor shops, electronics and clothes. A major barrier for new players and an effective gouging of your money to maximise corporate profit. You get those weekly specials bulletins in your letterbox? all paid for by suppliers, who ultimately pays, you do, who profits, you know who.

As far as I am concerned it is an abuse of market power. The ACCC has never done anything about it that I know of because of the political power of the big 2 retailers. That A&R have taken it on is deplorable, particularly as they push the educational books bit so frequently. But book sales from book shops have been falling as e-commerce gains momentum. I havent bought a book from these guys for years. I buy from on line specialist sellers as they A&R and Co dont carry what I want anyway.

Profiteering, nothing more, at least we now have the internet, means you can buy what you want without feeding these companies. Let them die off from the lack of a business model that supports society.

Sebastiaan

[Wood Butcher]

Well after reading that I know that I will not be purchasing from A&R again :((.

Corbs
Neither will I. What a load of rubbish. If I had done that to my customers when Dad & I sold goods wholesale we would have been out of business.

[Ashore]

That makes three of us , it's why I always buy my papers at a newsagent, meat at a butchers , fruit and veggies at the fruito etc even when it costs more or is more incovienant .:((

[Iain]

Another vote from me, Readings are my source of supply, I find them informative and helpful and eager to please, they have their own 'experts' on certain areas and it is their usual response to point you at whoever to answer your query, they are are a bookshop and music retailer in Melbourne and I find they are great.
Goodnight A&R, no more book vouchers for presents anymore either.
http://www.readings.com.au/html/home.html

[Stuart]

What a fascinating read.

I love line 1 of the initial letter "....a piece of work" That letter is certainly "a piece of work"
I also love the last line - where a meeting time is arranged in advance for 10 minutes of his time to discuss the deal.

I cannot believe this is real, but I'm not doubting the source.

Even if this decision is reversed due to public outcry / pressure, I won't change my opinion.

[sea dragon]

Are you aware that it will mean A&R will not necessarily be stocking the Miles Franklin winner or like books, because they are published by smaller houses that won't pay up. Something about nose removal and spite?

There are parallels. Think of the equivalent for small wineries not on the shelves of the Big Two and all the named outlets they own. When they have the right product, it still sells and I hope the publishers have equal success. Keep the Independent Retailers alive, whatever they sell.

[lesmeyer]

Will most certainly boycott A&R from now on.
Les

[markharrison]

That guy is soooooo funny! I really thought it was a spoof (the name Rimmer had the alarm bells going) until I went to the A&R website and saw he really is an executive there.

He sounds just like his fictional namesake in Red Dwarf.

[corbs]

I sent general feedback on their website about my feelings towards the original letter and have received a reply from A&R. I was going to post it here, however it has the disclaimer at the bottom...

Caution: This communication is confidential and may be legally privileged. If it is not addressed to you, please immediately contact us at our cost and do not use, disclose, copy, distribute or retain any of it without our authority.

So unfortunately I wont be posting it. I am guessing you would probably get the same response if you did the same though on their site though:roll:

Corbs

[sawdustmike]

Ditto Ashore. I always support my local people, cause if you don't, they will fold and then you have no choice. Still can't believe Rimmer though, what was he thinking. Probably works on the "everyone is a dumbass" theory. Never thought much of the big box style of marketing anyway so I doubt if A&R will feel the pinch from me.

[silentC]

Having been into A&R in Sydney a number of times, it's easy to see that they have a problem. The comment about them being purveyours of Sale signs is spot on. I much prefer Dymocks and rarely ever bought anything from A&R. Hopefully the fall out will knock them about. Would be a shame to see them go down the gurgler though, so maybe they'll sack Mr Rimmer and hire someone to rebuild the bridges.

[pawnhead]

I sent general feedback on their website about my feelings towards the original letter and have received a reply from A&R. I was going to post it here, however it has the disclaimer at the bottom...

Caution:This communication is confidential and may be legally privileged. If it is not addressed to you, please immediately contact us at our cost and do not use, disclose, copy, distribute or retain any of it without our authority.

So unfortunately I wont be posting it. I am guessing you would probably get the same response if you did the same though on their site though:roll:

Corbs
I would be happy to disclose any response from them. As far as I'd be concerned, there's no right to privacy unless you agree to it beforehand. Otherwise they could just send you a letter saying that you're a complete and utter $#%!!, and BTW you're not allowed to tell anyone that I just said that.

If the letter was addressed to you, and you made no commitment to keep it confidential, then I'd say just post it. Of course I'm not a lawyer though.

[Sturdee]

This communication is confidential and may be legally privileged. If it is not addressed to you, please immediately contact us at our cost and do not use, disclose, copy, distribute or retain any of it without our authority.


That is a standard clause on most business communications, especially faxes and email. It is to stop unauthorised use in the event that it is sent to the wrong fax or email address. See the words "If it is not addressed to you"

However, if it is addressed to you you may use it as you see fit and that clause does not apply.


Peter.

[Driver]

This has been going on in the supermarkets for years. Line fees were established as a revenue source and an incentive for manufacturers to keep their marketing programs at the cutting edge. The big two supermarket chains (and their sub brands) will delist your product for being out of stock, not meeting sales forecasts, quality problems or a change of strategic supply. This has made line fees a major element of new product marketing planning.
It actually goes a bit further than line fees and de-listing. The two major supermarket chains are pushing their "own brand" or generic product lines very hard. The feedback to their suppliers is: "If your product isn't #1 or #2 in market share terms, you'll be de-listed."

Leaving aside the devastation this will cause to Australia's food processing industry, the effect of this on the consuming public is that we will be denied choice. On this latter point, it's worth noting that one of the big two now sells canned tomatoes produced in Italy and packed in Vietnam where once they sold only Australian product.

Roger Corbett, Woolworths' former CEO is on the record as saying that 50% of Woolworths' costs are incurred between the back of the retail store and the shelf. His mission (still continuing after his departure) was to cut these costs right back. Think about that. The bulk of those costs would have been in wages. If the intention is to cut back on wages costs, the simplest way to do that is to reduce the staffing levels. So, if you've noticed a decline in the service levels in supermarkets, now you know why.

Other retailers tend to follow the lead shown by the supermarkets. Hence the missive from A & R, I suppose.



Profiteering, nothing more, at least we now have the internet, means you can buy what you want without feeding these companies. Let them die off from the lack of a business model that supports society.


Quite right. Furthermore, the decline in brand choice, service levels etc at the major supermarkets is encouraging some smart operators to compete, not on price but on quality and service. So there has been a small but encouraging surge in high quality niche market food retailers. So far this is mainly in the fresh fruit & veg, meat and fish sectors but there are signs that it's spreading.

[Stuart]

Is actually why I am currently looking to change to a new supermarket - our current one is overrun with it's self-branded product, and given the quality of some of the produce they source, why should I have any faith whatsoever in what they source for their self-branded range? I don't care about the few cents that their products are cheaper - if I have an alternative, I buy the other. But rather than see the entire range reduced to 3 suppliers, I'm finding a new place to shop.

[silentC]

The problem for A&R is that, within the book market, there are often no substitutes like there are within the supermarket industry. It's not like they will be able to bring out their own version of Tower Books titles, so if people want those titles, they will shop elsewhere. I suppose there are two modes of shopping for books: the purposeful and the meandering.

Sometimes I would walk into a book shop looking for a specific title. If it wasn't in stock, I would go elsewhere. Other times you're just browsing.

[Sebastiaan56]

Leaving aside the devastation this will cause to Australia's food processing industry, the effect of this on the consuming public is that we will be denied choice.

This has been going in the food industry for 17 years that I know of, I used to work in a consumer food company. Fortunately they apply it just as much to imports


Roger Corbett, Woolworths' former CEO is on the record as saying that 50% of Woolworths' costs are incurred between the back of the retail store and the shelf. His mission (still continuing after his departure) was to cut these costs right back. Think about that. The bulk of those costs would have been in wages. If the intention is to cut back on wages costs, the simplest way to do that is to reduce the staffing levels. So, if you've noticed a decline in the service levels in supermarkets, now you know why.

I heard some cuts from a conference where the CEO of Walmart told Roger Corbett not to worry, you can get around the regulators and Woolies can conquer this market. During the pharmacies in supermarkets stoush. In the Walmart stores I visited in the US there are no checkout staff. You scan your own stuff, process your own payment etc. I dont know how the security works but Im sure its there. Im told that every vendor has to have a 24hr service with a toll free number and vendors pay all costs associated with the promotion of their products. I also remember hearing that Walmart accounted for 10% of US trade with China. Havent been able to verify that one. That said the prices are super cheap.

The future of big retailing in Aus?

Sebastiaan

[Waldo]

Well after reading that I know that I will not be purchasing from A&R again :((.

Corbs

G'day,

I'll join in with Corbs on that, what total arrogance on the part of Angus & Robertson. :~ What comes around goes around lol.

[Zed]

I sent to A&R this :

>
> I read a letter from a Mr Rimmer to Tower books in the SMH today dated
> the 7/8/2007. I'm appalled by you!!!
>
> I buy lots of books all the time, I reckon my family's combinded
> purchases is probably about $1500 a year retail purchase. You however
> will never see any of it ever again.
>
> So goodbye and good riddance to you and your pathetic profiteering ways
> that expose small business and consumer alike. I hope you sell lots of
> "sale signs" lol!!!
>
> The only way i will every buy anything from you again is if you have a
> "going out of business sale"
>

[Sebastiaan56]

The problem for A&R is that, within the book market, there are often no substitutes like there are within the supermarket industry. It's not like they will be able to bring out their own version of Tower Books titles, so if people want those titles, they will shop elsewhere. I suppose there are two modes of shopping for books: the purposeful and the meandering.


Hate to tell you this C but I also saw generic novels in Walmart, plain cover, title like "Western" and "Romance".

ps you must have as much to do as I have.....

Sebastiaan

[Zed]

they responded with waffle about my concerns with thier "negotiations with current suppliers", my "being offended", that they " do not intend to impact australian authors". The rest being marketing drivel about how great they are and how they support the local industry ,how some stores were making net losses each year and they have to rationalise to survive etc etc etc... Essentially a mass produced reply to im sure 1000's of people like me...

a load of clap trap really...

47 suppliers got the tower letter.

[silentC]

Yes, a bit quiet today!

Well, take Carpentaria for example - published by Tower Books, winner of the 2007 Miles Franklin Literary Award. You wont be able to buy that in A&R now.

The sad thing is that if other big retailers follow suit, you could see small independent book publishers like Tower disappearing and it will become very difficult for relatively unknown Australian authors to get their books printed.

[Zed]

my latest reply to them is this :

thank you for taking to time to reply with your mass marketed blanket response which does little to respond in any meaningful way. I still will not shop further with you and your diabolical mechanisms of communicating with your suppliers leave much to be desired. Fiscally penalising suppliers because they do not meet your OWN SALES volumes is a great way to lose suppliers, please by all means contunue to do so.
I still hope you go broke, I will from now on shop either online or at other retailers as this seems a much better way to reduce your profit margins further. I know my avg yearly spend is only a pittance to you, but hopefully there are many people like myself who will do the same and hopefully do to you what you seem to want to do to your suppliers.

[Sebastiaan56]

Hey Zed, ever thought of going into politics?

Sebastiaan

[corbs]

Hey Zed,
Were the last words in the last 3 paragraphs "titles", "customers" & "needs" respectively?:rolleyes: Maybe they respect us equally.

Corbs

[Driver]

The future of big retailing in Aus?

Very probably. :(

I guess the point is that the big retailers will succeed. Their generic branding strategy will work for them (they may not succeed totally in reducing their offerings to Brand #1 plus Brand #2 plus their own generics but they will certainly knock off a rack of small brands).

However, that leaves the door open to businesses who are prepared to offer high quality and service in niche markets. Those businesses will attract customers who are not happy with the big retailers. And those customers are increasing in number. The big retailers have, by the way, factored this into their planning. They're not fools and they don't believe they can gain control of the entire market but they'll get enough of it to maximise profits and reduce choice at the same time.

Here's a couple of interesting snippets from a review of retailing in The Economist a while back:

In the USSR, there were no branded goods under the Soviet system but consumers learnt how to read barcodes manually so they could identify which goods came from the better factories. A form of subversive branding!

Saatchi and Saatchi did a review of supermarket retailing in the US and the UK and drew the following conclusion: "Pity the poor shopper. He or she (usually she) is subjected to glaringly bright light, mind-numbingly boring music - interrupted by harsh "announcements" over the PA system, low ambient temperatures and confusing and misleading signage. Why would anyone enjoy this?"

[RETIRED]

Very probably. :(

interrupted by harsh "announcements" over the PA system, low ambient temperatures and confusing and misleading signage. Why would anyone enjoy this?"Security to aisle3?:wink: :D

[ozwinner]

security acknowledged.

Al :roll:

[AlexS]

Hey Zed, ever thought of going into politics?

Sebastiaan

No, I'm sure he's far too subtle.

[Zed]

I been asked that a fair bit actually........ you reckon i'd win ? what platform do you think would suit me ? I think an eye for an eye platform..." lol!!
anyone who wants to be pollie should not be allowed to be one!!

[AlexS]

No, I'm sure he's far too subtle.

...besides, there are some things that even Zed wouldn't stoop to.:rolleyes:

[Sebastiaan56]

...besides, there are some things that even Zed wouldn't stoop to.:rolleyes:

Thats a relief....

[Zed]

Aww!!! Com'on now Sab! I speak my mind! whats wrong with that? U prefer waffle and lies? There'd be less war and swearing at the front door if everyone was as honest as me....

Naybe I will run for office....

I can see the headlines now: "Honest politician wins in a landslide, Hates all other politicians and eats lunch alone in parliment house!"

[Sebastiaan56]

Zed,

would you be up to it? sitting in the house listening to the idiots bull it on all day, you'd go ape mate! I listen to question time for the comedy sometimes but the rest, oh dear.... thats why she gave us two hands....

As for honesty, you have a point, but Ive never met an honest politician and well... Im not sure you would want have the bananas or passionfruit removed you would need to qualify.

The worst bit, just off the radio, Pauline's starting another party, now not even you would want to look at that for too long, would you?....


That said, I suggested it, Zed 4 PM!

Give em buggery son.....

HG Nelson

[Sebastiaan56]

For those with a passion for the subject Phillip Adams did a session on the A&R saga and book publishing generally on the radio the other night
http://abc.net.au/rn/latenightlive/stories/2007/2004843.htm

Sebastiaan